Broadheads Vs. Bodkin



  • I’m here to start a interesting topic about Broadheads arrow Versus. Bodkin arrow types that are available as alternative ammo for the Bows.

    Right now the both arrow types have the exact same Base damage which raises / lowers depending on what bow you are using. They also share the same projectile speed. In-game on the weapon menu selection, each arrow is described to have an advantage against certain two classes. Broadhead is suppose to be effective versus Archers & Man-at arms, whilst Bodkin are suppose to be more effective versus Vanguard & Knights. Broadheads deals Swing damage type and Bodkin deals pierce damage type.
    but the problem is that it appears that the Bodkin deals higher damage overall, because its pierce which deals higher damage verrsus heavy armoured classes. Against an Man-at arms, it doesn’t matter if you use a Bodking or Broadheads due to their equal resistance to both those attack, and to either raise or lower one of them might cause Man-at arms to be too weak to the attack its raised against. Back in Age of Chivalry, we used to have two types of armour, though it was never as advanced as the chivalry ones. Each nine class had a Melee attacks armour resistance and Ranged attack armour resistance.
    right now I feel that broadheads are only used for the one-hit kill to the bodyshot against archers combined with the warbow.
    Would really settle the balance between certain ranged weapons such as the trouble with Broadheads versus Bodkin if they added a own type of resistance towards to ranged attacks.

    You could make it so that Broadheads deals higher damage versus Archers and Man-at arms, but less damage versus Vanguards and Knights, and then make Bodkins deal higher damage versus Vanguards and Knights, whilst it deals less damage versus Man-at arms and Archers. And fire arrow can appear as a “Hybrid” that can two-shot any class to the body, where it deals 35 damage on impact, then a burn damage of 15, or make the impact 15 and the burn 35.

    Broadheads = Archers & Man-at arms
    Bodkin = Vanguards & Knights
    Fire arrow = All of them

    But it wouldn’t make much sense if a armour piercing arrow type would do less damage to less armoured class perhaps, but it would be for the balance’s sake.

    Please participate and share your opinions and thoughts.



  • I’m leaving a big balance discussion on Bows and Arrows for another day because I think it’s a complex balance issue but I suppose if I could change things right now I would get rid of broadheads. You should only be able to one shot enemies with a bow if you hit them in the head. 1 shot body hits should be the role of certain crossbows and javelins.



  • With your idea, wouldn’t every archer choose fire arrows as they are effective against all classes?
    This subject needs to be touched on with a lot of thought and simply there is way too many more immediate issues to deal with first.



  • Broadheads or Bodkins is a decision the archer has to make, its a decision between being able to oneshot vanguards or rendering them useless with a chest shot, knight headshot with bodkins puts them on very low hp aswell, or taking broadheads and constantly oneshotting the enemy archer turning the fight effectively 4vs5. I think they are pretty balanced except for the fact that broadheads should oneshot MaA’s to the chest, since bodkin arrow to the chest on a MaA does a crapload of damage regardless



  • @CRUSHED:

    Broadheads or Bodkins is a decision the archer has to make, its a decision between being able to oneshot vanguards or rendering them useless with a chest shot, knight headshot with bodkins puts them on very low hp aswell, or taking broadheads and constantly oneshotting the enemy archer turning the fight effectively 4vs5. I think they are pretty balanced except for the fact that broadheads should oneshot MaA’s to the chest, since bodkin arrow to the chest on a MaA does a crapload of damage regardless

    Or they should make it so bodkins do less damage to MAAs. Seriously one good enemy archer with no counter archer on your team turns into a complete rape. The archer class is already super powerful in the right hands, bows don’t need a buff.



  • I think Archers already have plenty of choice between their different bows (even if they are unbalanced) so they really don’t need another choice between Bodkins and Broadheads. As I said I do not think any of the bows should be 1 shotting anyone from body shots.



  • I say scratch the current iteration of broadheads and bodkins and make them do something else entirely like making one type weaker but more accurate or have less drop and the other arrow stronger but less accurate or have more drop or archers could have the choice of regular arrows (not broadhead or bodkin) or fire arrows that do the same damage but most of that is over time.

    I’m just throwing out ideas right now but what I do know for certain is the currently the broadhead or bodkin choice feels stupid and completely arbitrary. The choice of gimping myself to half of the enemy team when using a bow is very uninteresting and also very annoying when x-bow or javelin users don’t have to deal with a choice like that.



  • Wait, I had always thought that the reason broadheads do more damage to lightly armored classes is because they cause bigger wounds, because, you know, broad heads. The broadhead does not puncture armor as effectively because the energy is distributed over a wider area.

    Have I missed something?



  • If they ever implement fire arrows, please, PLEASE make them a LOT slower than normal arrows; for their annoyance potential, I wanna see them difficult to score shots with. Plus, that big ball of fuel at the arrow tip kinda makes it less aerodynamic and accurate.

    @Goatamon:

    Wait, I had always thought that the reason broadheads do more damage to lightly armored classes is because they cause bigger wounds, because, you know, broad heads. The broadhead does not puncture armor as effectively because the energy is distributed over a wider area.

    Have I missed something?

    Yup, you’re right, its like comparing a hollow point bullet with a full-metal-jacket one. But at the moment there’s really no point in using broadheads except as counter-archer since it gives bonus damage only against them; MAA gets the same dmg from both types and VG and knight die faster to bodkins.

    I would suggest making broadheads travel faster while slightly buffing damage against MAAs, that way it better fits its role as a killer of light and fast classes.



  • Adding a new resistance system for ranged attacks is the way to tweak ranged weapons without having certain melee weapons becomming too powerful or too weak in that manner.

    The only thing that differs most of the ranged weapons from the melee weapon is the fact that Headshot and legshot modifier are different, with the exception that crossbow has a headshot damage modifier on 200%, which is high enough to deal max base damage.

    For example;
    Heavy Crossbow damage type: Pierce
    Heavy Crossbow base damage: 120
    Knight’s pierce resistance: 0.5
    CB headsot modifier: 2.0

    Calculation

    ! 1) 120 * 2 * 0.5 =
    ! 2) 240 * 0.5 = 120

    If we were to just slightly adjust the pierce resistance for the Vanguard for example, we would end up having one-shots on body with the Heavy Crossbow on Vanguard.

    Also that with this calculation mentioned above)))
    The Heavy Crossbow was stated to be the only crossbow to have the ability to one-shot Knights, but due to the fact that Crossbows deal full base damage, even the light crossbow can bring the knight down to 2 HP after a headshot (Lightcrossbow base damage: 98)

    At one point during the first patch (Not CU) the Man-at arms had a slightly armour adjust and ended up with just as much pierce resistance as Vanguard in prior to make some weapons balanced, but this thing took away Heavy crosbows ability to one-shot them at body, which is why most use the Heavy crossbow.

    My point is that they should add more resistance for ranged weapons:
    Swing
    Pierce
    Blunt
    SwingBlunt
    PierceBlunt
    Generic / Fire
    Fist
    RangedSwing
    RangedPierce
    RangedBlunt

    They should make it so that Broadheads has a higher base damage, so it deals higher damage versus light armoured classe, whilst the Bodkin should have a bit lower damage, but the Vanguard and Knight having a fairly low reistance to RangedPierce

    If we focus it so that Broadheads will deal higher damage against more lightly armoured classes, but armoured classes having a bit higher resistance to it, and Bodkin dealing lower base damage, but more heavily armoured class having a lower resistance to RangedPierce than RangedSwing.
    You don’t need to make it so that

    Man-at arms & Archers should have a fair high RangedPierce resistance, when it should have lower damage then the Broadheads, That’s the only perfect fix I can think of.

    So basically what we would end up with, is two arrow types where one of them is best versus two of the four classes. Now that IF we solve the issue between Broadhead Vs. Bodkin, I think it could be time to maybe introduce Fire arrows, an arrow that wouldn’t be able to One-hit, but would serve more as a ( Damage per second ) It could deal 15 base damage Bluntranged, then deal a slow burn damage that deals up to 35, so in total, the max base damage would be 50. And since the fire damage is generic, it would lead to the fire arrows being an ideal but fairly weak “hybrid” arrow.

    Or they should introduce a feature where you can lit any arrows on fire TF2 Style, adding a fire damage to the impact.



  • We should probably balance out all the different kinds of bows first…


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