Change to feints that is a compromise



  • So feints are part of your core game - I suggest you can do them without restriction as is now.

    Don`t like feints - I suggest when an attack hits after a feint it only does half damage.

    Realism (ha) theory is you use up the momentum of your attack with a feint so that following blow is not as effective. Half damage or some reduced amount of damage.



  • A pretty interesting idea, I see real life feint with weaker strike too.



  • Why not just make feints defensive only, so you can’t swing right after feinting? Feints would be still a viable part of the game, but not as annoying as now :3

    That’s just my suggestion. I think offensive feints are the real problem (<- Don’t judge me, if that word doesn’t fit all that well :D ).



  • @HammelGammel:

    Why not just make feints defensive only, so you can’t swing right after feinting? Feints would be still a viable part of the game, but not as annoying as now :3

    That’s just my suggestion. I think offensive feints are the real problem (<- Don’t judge me, if that word doesn’t fit all that well :D ).

    In medieval warfare, feinting is a valuable offensive technique. A feint is fooling an enemy into diverting his defenses to a location where they are not needed, so that you can strike at the place where his defenses are now lacking. Both a tactic for armies and for individual combat. Like you put your sword in the air to do an overhead strike, your foe puts his sword or shield up to block, and then you stab him in his exposed belly instead. Or when leading an army, you attack a certain location of your enemy to divert their defenses there, and then your main force attack their now weaker sections.

    I don’t know what feinting would be used for in this game if you were unable to do an attack right after a feint. What do you mean “defensive feints”? You attack, do a feint, he blocks in the wrong direction and then you…? There is such a thing as a “feint retreats”, faking a retreat, making enemies persue you and lead them into an ambush. That is kind of what skilled vanguard players do already, you know when they run away from you, you persue them to put a sword in their back but they all of a sudden turn back at you with a powerful stab. Has nothing to do with the feint mechanic present in the game, though.

    Edit: An idea I have about feinting, which won’t solve any problems I reckon, is that you shouldn’t be able to perform an identical attack after a feint and getting a free hit. For example, you do a swing from the right and feint, your opponent blocks to the right, then you quickly follow up with another swing from the right. Your opponent is already ready for an incoming attack from the right and should still be ready for that even if you feinted. I rarely use feint, but when I do I just want to end a fight with someone who blocks all of my attacks, and I do that by swing -> feint -> swing in quick progression because I’m that lazy. This idea would stop that and would force me to do swing -> feint -> stab instead, or something.



  • I know what a feint is, but thanks for explanation.

    What I meant was that you could keep on using the mechanic, but not to get a 50% hit, but to use it for defending purposes.

    Feints are an easy to use, but high rewarding mechanic and in my opinion that’s not good. There should always be a reason not to use it instead of a regular swing. You should have to think twice if you really want to use it. Since the stamina penalty is insignificant, there is no such reason. There has to be real a downside to be balanced.



  • @HammelGammel:

    Why not just make feints defensive only, so you can’t swing right after feinting? Feints would be still a viable part of the game, but not as annoying as now :3

    That’s just my suggestion. I think offensive feints are the real problem (<- Don’t judge me, if that word doesn’t fit all that well :D ).

    Offensive feints are too integrated in the game balance to just remove it. I think that the slower weapons NEED feint in order to compete with the faster ones.

    @gregcau:

    So feints are part of your core game - I suggest you can do them without restriction as is now.

    Don`t like feints - I suggest when an attack hits after a feint it only does half damage.

    Realism (ha) theory is you use up the momentum of your attack with a feint so that following blow is not as effective. Half damage or some reduced amount of damage.

    I suggest something similar, having the wait time between feint and new attack increased. This way attacks to the same amount of damage. It’s a similar idea to yours.



  • I agree that feinting is part of the game.
    I do not agree with the numerous ‘feintspammers’.
    In a real fight, i don’t think you would feint more than 80 percent of your attacks, or feint 6 times in a row.It is ridiculous, breaks immersion, and is just a noob tactic.

    The beauty of a sword fight is the clashing steel, not the endless feinting.
    There should be a limit to how many times one can feint so feinting is used the way it should be: to trick your opponent.



  • @gregcau:

    So feints are part of your core game - I suggest you can do them without restriction as is now.

    Don`t like feints - I suggest when an attack hits after a feint it only does half damage.

    Realism (ha) theory is you use up the momentum of your attack with a feint so that following blow is not as effective. Half damage or some reduced amount of damage.

    feint change idea is bad, the solution isnt to make the luck hit do less damage. it would still cause flinching, a luck flinch+halfdamage is still a big deficit.

    If feints are kept in at all (i dont believe they should be) it needs to just be defensive feints to cancel a missed swing/flash feints, happening in the first few instants of windup.

    I really dont like the feint mechanic. I dont entirely like how long combos can go, it should be a 2 strike base limit, increased for some weapons. STamina needs to either be tied to swing speed, health regen, or weapon damage, or across the board have its regen made slower.

    But to be perfectly clear, balancing the game is impossible without a uniform perspective (be it first or third), fixed acceleration mechanics, and slower base movement speed of several classes.

    Another possible solution, is to slow down the entire game 10%-20%ish. It plays much better, even with feints. They become readable by humans.



  • @gregcau:

    So feints are part of your core game - I suggest you can do them without restriction as is now.

    Don`t like feints - I suggest when an attack hits after a feint it only does half damage.

    Realism (ha) theory is you use up the momentum of your attack with a feint so that following blow is not as effective. Half damage or some reduced amount of damage.

    Great idea, even 75% damage would be a fine change, make the feint one item in the attackers toolbox but not something that is so devastating.


Log in to reply
 

Looks like your connection to Torn Banner Forums was lost, please wait while we try to reconnect.