Do you think chivalry is a skill based game?



  • @JCash:

    Note how this entire time i’ve said feints didn’t start to bother me until that is consistently how i began losing, which doesnt happen till you’re approaching the skill ceiling, which neither of you are.

    @JCash:

    Log hours. Not to say hours= better opion, but nabster i have as many hours logged with every single class as you do with your main and ive been in ‘competitive’ teams since i started playing chiv, literally my first day i was in kila. I’ve as many hours with EVERY class as you have with your main. So yea maybe my perspective is a little more robust.

    Oh boy here we go with the dick waving.

    Buddy pls. If you say you start losing consistently because of feints, its because you are bad, not because of a “coin toss mechanic”. Almost everything you said in your posts make no sense, especially about this game being not competitive and other stuff, and is more of a longer written whining wich screams “i need to convince myself and other pplz on the forums cus im madbad”. So please, small son, sit down and watch as i will ignore your “i have more hours then you im better” posts from now on and enjoy the other constructive posts in this thread.

    You won’t tell anybody when to have a fucking opinion and when not.



  • @CRUSHED:

    Oh boy here we go with the dick waving.

    Buddy pls. If you say you start losing consistently because of feints, its because you are bad, not because of a “coin toss mechanic”. Almost everything you said in your posts make no sense, especially about this game being not competitive and other stuff, and is more of a longer written whining wich screams “i need to convince myself and other pplz on the forums cus im madbad”. So please, small son, sit down and watch as i will ignore your “i have more hours then you im better” posts from now on and enjoy the other constructive posts in this thread.

    You won’t tell anybody when to have a fucking opinion and when not.

    I dealt with your particular brand of stupidity already, when you kept telling me how great chivs anti hack protection was. You were as wrong then as you are now. If all you’re noticing is me ‘dick waving’ you’re an idiot - plain and simple. I’m giving my hours to give a point or reference, feints really did not bother me till the only tactical error in fights I was making was to parry blows. Sometimes i landed the parry but sometimes - and entirely according to luck - the opponent would feint and I would die. I noticed how cheap it was. I noticed how often i win due to an unreadable feinted blow in combat. I talked to others, tested their ability to read feints, i did a lot of work surrounding the formation of my opinion.

    Because unlike you, i’m not retarded.

    And I formed my value judgement - feints make the game worse. Now you seem incapable of having a real discussion about the mechanics of the game because you cant even admit feints equate to free hits, meaning until you lose whatever delusions of ‘skilled feinting’ you have in your small brain, we can’t have a discussion, or even an argument. You can just be objectively wrong over there, while over here we discuss the problems with the game and how to fix them.



  • Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.



  • @Jetstream:

    Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.

    Common opinion, that feinted blows can be blocked. Extensively tested. No one in the community, even people with hundreds to over a thousand hours, can read feints. 100% luck.

    If anyone thinks they can i’ll pull you into my clan server and show you to be wrong, send me a forum message.



  • @Jetstream:

    Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.

    So how does that work with a slow two-handed weapon against a falchion?

    As to the OP. Yes, it’s a skill based game but, yes, there are game mechanics that actually turn your own skills against you.
    If we were to compare it to a board game, Chivalry would be like Axis & Allies - sure, you can have a plan but the second Russia rolls all 1’s your f’d.



  • Jcash you might not have noticed it yet, but heavily insulting others is not a good way to argue…and neither is telling them you are teh superbest playur evar. Hours and rank mean nothing in this game after a certain point.



  • @Falc:

    Jcash you might not have noticed it yet, but heavily insulting others is not a good way to argue…and neither is telling them you are teh superbest playur evar. Hours and rank mean nothing in this game after a certain point.

    You’re right, once you hit the skill ceiling, which is fairly low due to a random hit mechanic, hours and rank mean very little.

    But hours definitely do mean something.

    “There is a cult of ignorance in this forum, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

    paraphrasing. And no i’m not the best player ever. I do understand the game mechanics and talk to a huge cross section of this community about stuff like feints all the time. I didn’t just decide one day to come rage against feints, it took me hundreds of hours and a lot of no feint fighting to even begin to have a problem with them.



  • @JCash:

    You’re right, once you hit the skill ceiling, which is fairly low due to a random hit mechanic, hours and rank mean very little.

    But hours definitely do mean something.

    lol, hours mean very little but they do



  • @CRUSHED:

    @JCash:

    You’re right, once you hit the skill ceiling, which is fairly low due to a random hit mechanic, hours and rank mean very little.

    But hours definitely do mean something.

    lol, hours mean very little but they do

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns

    Once two people are at ‘skill ceiling’ with a class, the hour/rank differences between them don’t account for much. Having more hours and more hours with more classes inherently gives you a more diverse, broader, more informed perspective. And even if the returns are diminishing, there are STILL returns for hours invested. Go away troll.



  • @JCash:

    Once two people are at ‘skill ceiling’ with a class, the hour/rank differences between them don’t account for much. Having more hours and more hours with more classes inherently gives you a more diverse, broader, more informed perspective. And even if the returns are diminishing, there are STILL returns for hours invested. Go away troll.

    I think you have already proven who the troll is.



  • @JCash:

    @omg87:

    To be completely honest - this game is fun, but doesn’t require too much skill to play. It’s not necessarily a bad game because… well, who plays bad games for the fuck of it? It’s just not terribly complex. Even with the upcoming feint nerfs, the same problems will still exist. The game’s simplicity is its own undoing, but at the same time it’s what makes the game fun. Because of this, it’s difficult to take the game seriously.

    You can fix all the bugs, tweak the mechanics, but the game at its core is simple.
    I mean, really, I wasn’t expecting much since improving yourself stops at learning how to feint.

    I agree with you. The game is fun, and it doesnt require too much skill to play.

    But the skill part of that can be fixed by removing feint.

    The game isn’t really that simple. Play age of chivalry, the precursor to this one if you dont believe me. Similar core combat mechanics, no feinting, one of the most difficult games ever. Incredibly hard to get good at. This game could instantly become equally difficult, with an extremely high skill ceiling and learning curve, if feints were removed.

    This is not Age of Chivalry. This is a different game where the devs want to give more options to the player, including feints - I am all for more options.

    @Jcash:

    Its like a no brainer. That they leave feints in tells you without ambiguity that the devs want chivalry to be a casual slasher. Which is sort of a gross waste of potential. And, with all the exploits, the casuals are not staying anyway. I guess they leave the overheads and stuff in for the clannies who want to mash pubs, leave the feint in for the pubs that want to be able to mash clannies, and in the end neither group is happy and the global population goes into free fall.

    The reasons why the population is stagnant right now isn’t because of one mechanic. Clans get a bad rap because they tend to twist mechanics around to their advantage and yes, it’s garbage, but that’s how things work right now. Maybe clans are ruining the community and they’re not realizing it. I’m seeing less newbies and more higher ranked players with every passing day. It’s funny and it’s also sad because it means eventually the community will be made up of veterans who have all learned the same crap using it on each other.

    I’ve been watching the numbers and they’re going back towards the numbers post-launch. That should tell you something.

    @Jcash:

    Make sure to take months to release any kind of development tools so that the game can have a constant stream of new content, and by all means never worry about hack protection. #devlogic

    Dev tools would be nice and it REALLY might help the population of the game.I’ve already seen some ideas about a Japanese flavor mod which looked interesting…. The problem is this has little to do with the game itself.

    Which brings me to my point. The “competitive scene” the clans all want is currently a bad joke. It comes down to feinting each other and exploits. Yes, you can argue it requires a bit of skill to pull off but it’s really fucking boring. I remember a few times they were trying to advertise the tournaments and whatnot, but nobody really gave a shit.

    As another poster has said, this game was the most fun in the beginning and middle ranks of the game. After this point, you learn the ins and outs, and so do your opponents so you end up with a stalemate with never-ending parries. And you want to remove feints because you lose to them? If you think removing feints will fix this problem, I assure you - you are mistaken. The game at its core is too simple. I’ve watched that youtube video of 2 guys going at it without using feints. Imagine that crap in a team based setting. 1vs1 fights will go on forever. Double teaming is required for any kind of progress. That will make this game infinitely more stale than it is right now.

    If you’re going to remove feints, you’re going to need another mechanic to replace it. Taking options away from the player is a bad idea.



  • There is no mechanic to replace feints that will accomplish the same goal, of ending fights quickly through quick bypass of an opponents defense, no matter how good that defense is.

    Either you have the lower skill ceiling with quicker fights, or a higher skill ceiling with longer fights (in duels). Team fights won’t be affected much if at all. That’s something to test though isn’t it, I might try to get something like that going, a casual no feint scrim showing just how fast paced and quickly people will still die even without any offensive feints at all.



  • @Radiant

    The way I see it, if you have 2 teams of equal worth coming at each other it comes down to who can kill the quickest so you can start double teaming, but by this time you’re all out of stamina because you were too busy parrying and attacking that one guy. And this is assuming your team can get a kill at all.

    We all know that feints don’t work too well against shields which is why people don’t feint a shield user. You could easily simulate this by having 2 teams, all knights with shields just incase one guy feels squirrely and throws a feint in.



  • @omg87:

    @Radiant

    The way I see it, if you have 2 teams of equal worth coming at each other it comes down to who can kill the quickest so you can start double teaming, but by this time you’re all out of stamina because you were too busy parrying and attacking that one guy. And this is assuming your team can get a kill at all.

    We all know that feints don’t work too well against shields which is why people don’t feint a shield user. You could easily simulate this by having 2 teams, all knights with shields just incase one guy feels squirrely and throws a feint in.

    I was playing on a classic duelserver and we agreed not to use feints at all, only canceling your attacks was allowed, not attacking right after this. I assure you, it was pretty fast paced. And MUCH more tenste, than feintspamming could ever be! There are other ways to fight, excpet of feinting and simple LMB-spamming, you know? Sure, these ways are moer diffucult to master, but isn’t this just good?



  • @HammelGammel:

    @omg87:

    @Radiant

    The way I see it, if you have 2 teams of equal worth coming at each other it comes down to who can kill the quickest so you can start double teaming, but by this time you’re all out of stamina because you were too busy parrying and attacking that one guy. And this is assuming your team can get a kill at all.

    We all know that feints don’t work too well against shields which is why people don’t feint a shield user. You could easily simulate this by having 2 teams, all knights with shields just incase one guy feels squirrely and throws a feint in.

    I was playing on a classic duelserver and we agreed not to use feints at all, only canceling your attacks was allowed, not attacking right after this. I assure you, it was pretty fast paced. And MUCH more tenste, than feintspamming could ever be! There are other ways to fight, excpet of feinting and simple LMB-spamming, you know? Sure, these ways are more diffucult to master, but isn’t this just good?



  • @omg87:

    @Radiant

    The way I see it, if you have 2 teams of equal worth coming at each other it comes down to who can kill the quickest so you can start double teaming, but by this time you’re all out of stamina because you were too busy parrying and attacking that one guy. And this is assuming your team can get a kill at all.

    We all know that feints don’t work too well against shields which is why people don’t feint a shield user. You could easily simulate this by having 2 teams, all knights with shields just incase one guy feels squirrely and throws a feint in.

    I was playing on a classic duelserver and we agreed not to use feints at all, only canceling your attacks was allowed, not attacking right after this. I assure you, it was pretty fast paced. And MUCH more tenste, than feintspamming could ever be! There are other ways to fight, excpet of feinting and simple LMB-spamming, you know? Sure, these ways are more diffucult to master, but isn’t this just good?



  • @JCash:

    @Jetstream:

    Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.

    Common opinion, that feinted blows can be blocked. Extensively tested. No one in the community, even people with hundreds to over a thousand hours, can read feints. 100% luck.

    Incorrect. A good feinter should always land a hit. If they screw up and let themselves get parried then they did it wrong. So yeh, It’s a free hit if you don’t screw up. What you should be asking yourself is how you got into the position of being forced to attempt to parry a feint.

    And, just to clarify, as I still think you don’t understand: You do know that there is a separate EU competitive community, right? There’s more places in the world than the US. Don’t make any assumptions about someone’s skill level just because you haven’t played or heard of them, and don’t delude yourself into believing you are some omniscient Chivalry God.



  • @NabsterHax:

    @JCash:

    @Jetstream:

    Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.

    Common opinion, that feinted blows can be blocked. Extensively tested. No one in the community, even people with hundreds to over a thousand hours, can read feints. 100% luck.

    Incorrect. A good feinter should always land a hit. If they screw up and let themselves get parried then they did it wrong. So yeh, It’s a free hit if you don’t screw up. What you should be asking yourself is how you got into the position of being forced to attempt to parry a feint.

    And, just to clarify, as I still think you don’t understand: You do know that there is a separate EU competitive community, right? There’s more places in the world than the US. Don’t make any assumptions about someone’s skill level just because you haven’t played or heard of them, and don’t delude yourself into believing you are some omniscient Chivalry God.

    What you just said is, you might as well unbind parry, and only attack in this game, because any time you parry there is a chance the opponent will feint and land a free hit on you.

    Attacking: the game. STop talking kid.



  • @NabsterHax:

    And, just to clarify, as I still think you don’t understand: You do know that there is a separate EU competitive community, right? There’s more places in the world than the US. Don’t make any assumptions about someone’s skill level just because you haven’t played or heard of them, and don’t delude yourself into believing you are some omniscient Chivalry God.

    The difference is most Europeans are polite and modest.

    But to give Jcash some credit, he has stuck to his guns.



  • @NabsterHax:

    @JCash:

    @Jetstream:

    Feints equate to free hit when people auto-block and refuse to wait until the last second to block.

    Common opinion, that feinted blows can be blocked. Extensively tested. No one in the community, even people with hundreds to over a thousand hours, can read feints. 100% luck.

    Incorrect. A good feinter should always land a hit. If they screw up and let themselves get parried then they did it wrong. So yeh, It’s a free hit if you don’t screw up. What you should be asking yourself is how you got into the position of being forced to attempt to parry a feint.

    And, just to clarify, as I still think you don’t understand: You do know that there is a separate EU competitive community, right? There’s more places in the world than the US. Don’t make any assumptions about someone’s skill level just because you haven’t played or heard of them, and don’t delude yourself into believing you are some omniscient Chivalry God.

    I can’t agree with you. You are saying, you shouldn’t even try to block? So esentially what you are doing is pressing LMB over and over again? I don’t think so, and since a feint can be performed at any time, you CAN’T forsee it. Mixed with your opinion, that a good feinter should always hit, you see feints are unfair?

    So they could just remove blocks, don’t they? …