Flinch needs to be longer



  • Ok after the point came up in another thread I actually watched out which weapons can hit you after you just hit somebody. Since I’m mostly using the Greatsword I have only noticed weapons which can do that to the Greatsword:

    (Just to be clear I’m talking about how I hit somebody and do a combo and how I can be hit before I can hit them.)

    -Any axe or mace stab. They are pretty much always faster than your combo. Doesn’t matter if you crouch look down.
    -Bearded Axe slash. Not even accelerated. Yeah that one made my lol.

    -weapons with Sword of War speed and even below can still hit you. I “think” you can prevent that with a crouch lookdown, but I’m not sure. Would need further testing

    So even a fast combo weapon like the Greatsword (0.65 combo, only daggers/shortswords have combo times below 0.6) can easily be hit by mace/axe stabs, nothing to prevent that but combo-feint-parry. Pretty much any weapon can hittrade with you as long as you do not crouch lookdown.

    I think this really needs to change. Unless you have a Maul and the enemy a very fast 1h I do not think getting hit should allow you to trade or even be faster. Either that or combo-feint-parry needs a big reduce in stamina cost (and I know nobody wants that^^).

    So IF flinch is 0.75 seconds now(tests suggest it, the real number is unknown) then it should be something like 0.9 for weapons with a fast combo and up to 1.2 seconds for weapons with a slow combo and Spears.

    And while we are at it: increase out of stamina/shield kick stun. A Maul not getting his deserved hit(while most weapons do) after he drained all the stamina of someone is simply wrong. Increase stun time to 1.9 (=0.8s+0.8s+0.3s, this is the delay after you can attack again+ highest windup in game+ some time to connect your release). Stun should end instantly once you are hit and you should be flinched.



  • This is definitely a problem. One solution is to increase flinch depending on how much damage you take.



  • I agree, either longer/variable flinch times or reduced recovery times, every non-spear 2hander is essentially forced to combo when they can be hit by their victim if they go into recovery.

    I like the idea of variable flinch times depending on what your hit by, but there should by an obvious way to tell someone when their flinch has ended in that case, expecting every new player to get used to being flinched by each weapon would be a bit much I think.



  • @Josh:

    I agree, either longer/variable flinch times or reduced recovery times, every non-spear 2hander is essentially forced to combo when they can be hit by their victim if they go into recovery.

    I like the idea of variable flinch times depending on what your hit by, but there should by an obvious way to tell someone when their flinch has ended in that case, expecting every new player to get used to being flinched by each weapon would be a bit much I think.

    You are right, an animation fitting the length of the flinch would be useful.

    @BB:

    This is definitely a problem. One solution is to increase flinch depending on how much damage you take.

    There is a reason why I suggested combo time instead of damage:
    Slow combo weapons suffer from this issue, but these do not necessarily have high damage. But there are also very fast high damage weapons(Hatchet). So while it may look logical to base it on damage on first look, basing the flinch time on the combo time of the weapon is better and deals with the problem at its root.



  • Game needs a crosshair indication of when you are flinched, stunned, or otherwise cannot attack. A little circle around your crosshair that recharges over time, a bit like the melee cooldown crosshair in L4D.

    I’ve been having nightmares about the new feinting, where trying to attack after a late feint only queues the attack for when it will just get me killed. Having a general “YOU CANNOT ATTACK” indicator would be useful to everyone I think.

    Maybe add an option to turn it off (for those who will surely have their immersion broken by this).



  • I thought this was called Idle Flinch.



  • Just had a Norse Sword hit me before my stab combo hit him at facehug range. For those who don’t know: the Greatsword stab at facehug range starts inside the enemy. You hit as soon as possible, it is not possible to hit faster with the Greatsword. And Norse windup isn’t even .3, it is 0.35.



  • A norse has interupted my broadsword before.



  • @-Thylacine-:

    I thought this was called Idle Flinch.

    Idle flinch was a bug where flinch did not play at all in certain circumstances. What I’m reporting here is a “bug” (imo) that flinch is not long enough in certain circumstances, which does lead to similar results as idle flinch, though.



  • We’re they holding a shield when they did it?

    The shield animation cancel trick that you can use when fighting other opponents with shield also works on the flinch animation.

    It can get pretty gay.



  • I don’t have any problems with the bearded axe slash interrupting my combos. He’s usually just winding up but the time my next attack hits him.

    Mace and axe stabs can get through. But that is so unlikely to happen as well as most players are trying to block or they don’t have those weapons.

    I mean there has to be some weapons that can interrupt it. Those are low damaging stabs anyway. And if they hit you all you do is block their next attack and hit them a second time. Not that hard.

    There has to be something that can defeat your great sword kill streak. In not too bothered if
    One low damage attack can hit me. And more often than not its a hit trade anyway that results in their death.

    Otherwise then the great sword will be a bit OP.



  • I think Falc should duel a member of the balance council and if he wins, he takes their place.



  • @lemonater47:

    Mace and axe stabs can get through. But that is so unlikely to happen as well as most players are trying to block or they don’t have those weapons.

    I’m sorry this is just plain wrong. If someone wants to stab you with his mace during your combo, he is going to do it. Only a combo-feint-parry prevents this from happening. NOTHING else.

    @lemonater47:

    I mean there has to be some weapons that can interrupt it.

    You might want to read up what the idle flinch bug was. And no, you are not supposed to get hit after you just hit the enemy and are doing a combo.

    @gregcau:

    I think Falc should duel a member of the balance council and if he wins, he takes their place.

    Well I wouldn’t say no to that one ;D



  • @Falc:

    @lemonater47:

    Mace and axe stabs can get through. But that is so unlikely to happen as well as most players are trying to block or they don’t have those weapons.

    I’m sorry this is just plain wrong. If someone wants to stab you with his mace during your combo, he is going to do it. Only a combo-feint-parry prevents this from happening. NOTHING else.

    @lemonater47:

    I mean there has to be some weapons that can interrupt it.

    You might want to read up what the idle flinch bug was. And no, you are not supposed to get hit after you just hit the enemy and are doing a combo.

    @gregcau:

    I think Falc should duel a member of the balance council and if he wins, he takes their place.

    Well I wouldn’t say no to that one ;D

    I know If he wants to stab you he’s gonna do it. But many don’t want to and will try to frantically block.

    So he bonks me, I then parry combo stab him on his next attack. No big deal.

    And The idle flinch bug is when you get hit and you don’t flinch. But don’t et the confused with te game mechanic. The one where you can’t get fliched if you are already swinging. He can hit you as his flick his over. And if your doing the right combo it can end up as a legitimate hit trade resulting in VHS death.

    And you have a great sword. Keep your distance. Your weapon is twice a long as theirs at least.

    Time for you to use the claymore maybe?



  • I heard they are nerfing the fake



  • @Falc:

    @gregcau:

    I think Falc should duel a member of the balance council and if he wins, he takes their place.

    Well I wouldn’t say no to that one ;D

    Don’t know the NA guys but I am quite comfortable with Dubjay and Sophax dueling you! :P



  • Any increase to flinch needs to make sure that a knight with a shield has some chance of recovery after being hit repeatedly by a fast weapon like a dagger.



  • You can raise your shield in flinch can’t you? I’m sure you can.

    But yes, a slight increase to all flinches would be appreciated.

    I don’t think basing it on damage or combo time would work, since damage vs speed varies widely between weapons, and basing it on combo times seems arbitrary and inconsistent, in addition to spear-type weapons not having combo times.

    A global increase to flinch shouldn’t cause any issues.


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