Stam drain on shields



  • Are you crazy? Did you test that at all in Beta?

    Sorry about the rage but right now feels impossible to win a duel against a heavy weapon user when using a buckler… (at least without feints)



  • Yeah it’s really hard when fighting in a group as well. You block a few blows and you’re instantly out of stam. I loved being able to form a shield wall to protect allies in TO, TDM or LTS but now you’re dead after just a few hits.

    This needs fixing.



  • Cant believe noone cares for that.

    On the other hand I rarely see good players with shields…



  • Shield stam drain is the exact same as it was last patch. It’s calculated completely separately from parry drain.



  • @SlyGoat:

    Shield stam drain is the exact same as it was last patch. It’s calculated completely separately from parry drain.

    Are you 100% sure? Because this is what I see in game:

    Shieldusers run out of stam while parryusers dont.
    People complaining that shields are useless.
    If I use a buckler I run out of stam, but when I put it on my back and fight the same guy I rarely do.

    When I get a friend online Ill do some testing on an empty server, right now its just from playing experience.



  • @Towe:

    @SlyGoat:

    Shield stam drain is the exact same as it was last patch. It’s calculated completely separately from parry drain.

    Are you 100% sure? Because this is what I see in game:

    Shieldusers run out of stam while parryusers dont.
    People complaining that shields are useless.
    If I use a buckler I run out of stam, but when I put it on my back and fight the same guy I rarely do.

    When I get a friend online Ill do some testing on an empty server, right now its just from playing experience.

    You might hold your shield up too much, not giving you time to regenerate time.



  • @SlyGoat:

    Shield stam drain is the exact same as it was last patch. It’s calculated completely separately from parry drain.

    Do u get extra paid for saying bs like this? The stamina drain isn’t the same. Also, funny that the stab through shield bug/glitch is still in the game and that you ignore the topics sly. Why put shields in the game, if you don’t fix them properly. Not a priority ha?



  • Umm also, are you supposed to lose stamina with your shield raised if a projectile hits it? Because I’m almost certain that happened to me earlier. My understanding was projectile blocking was not supposed to cost stamina, but I could be mistaken.



  • Bucklers aren’t heavy tanky protective shields, they’re supposed to act like a second weapon with the added bonus of being able to block.

    Now I don’t think that would be ever implemented in chivalry but I think I have a small solution to make the buckler not a piece of garbage.

    Give the buckler the ability to parry, it would have the same hitbox,active window and recovery as a normal weapon parry but DO NOT give it the user the ability to riposte after the parry.
    The buckler should also retain the regular hold to block function.
    This way you can have better stamina management and be rewarded for timing your blocks correctly.



  • You dont get my point Alyx, it seems to cost more stam to block with buckler than with the weapon.
    And no, Im not holding it up Jstorm, I use it like parry.

    Before the patch I would take out the buckler against archers and heavy feinters. Now I only use it against archers, since blocking heavy weapons with it gets you dazed…

    I like your fix Alyx.



  • Yeah I’ve noticed that the buckler takes a lot more stamina penalty than a weapon parry.
    I tried to use the flail because of the buff to it’s combo timings but it’s near impossible to take advantage of it because if I combo I don’t have enough stamina to block.



  • Perhaps it has something to do with the knockback of weapons being increased or something? Whatever it is, it feels different now.

    Also the special daze seems way too long now.



  • I might be wrong but considering that shields force you to take stamina hit on block and given their penalty to reaction time (you need to lower shield down before attacking) I am wonder if shield should either eat less stamina on blocks or weapons take less stamina on attack.

    What do you think?



  • People have a habit of blocking in recovery with shields for some reason.

    This is most likely why shield users waste stamina like nothing.



  • Stamina drain cost calculation upon shields have only been changed twice. First time through the Content Update 1, and now the Balance patch. Though the calculations are not that different from the old ones.

    A shield can prove to be very useful in a fight versus a projectile weapon at distance, very good at closing the distance without risking being shot too many times, though when it comes to melee it only proves to be useful in one versus one situation as the hold block negates the chance of falling helplessly against a feint. In a multi-situational fight we can clearly see that the shield lacks the speed to compete against the counterattacks. Weapons with shield are actually slower, If you were in a situation where you would block then try to attack your opponent as fast as possible because the shield has a timer on its lower phase… So from the moment you block and try to attack, you have to count the shield lower phase and weapon windup.

    For example Norse sword and Buckler shield.
    Buckler lower time : 0.15
    Norse sword attack1 windup : 0.35
    So total time till a attack could be made is 0.5.

    My suggestion how to solve this, would be if shields could have a ‘sort’ of counterattack. A kind of Tap-block where if you successfully perform it, you would have the shield lower time dropped instantly so that you could attack straight away.

    The hold block should remain as it always where, only that it would be apropriate with a unique feature where 2nd, 3rd and 4th block during a hold block stamina cost is reduced by 10% or something per hit to give them least one tanking opportunity.

    Either way, shields needs a fix soon.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    People have a habit of blocking in recovery with shields for some reason.

    This is most likely why shield users waste stamina like nothing.

    Which goes to show how terrible the recovery parry mechanic is, that people are accidentally using something that punishes them massively.

    Shields are almost totally useless right now. A perfectly legit strategy against a shield user in the new patch is: attack attack attack attack attack, opponent runs out of stamina and gets stunned, attack when they’re defenseless, repeat. The super slow counterattack times for the shield and the completely insane knockback in the latest patch mean you’re stuck blocking at least 2 strikes before you get in range to do any damage, wasting a considerable amount more stamina than a non-shield user.

    A non-shield user can parry and riposte with a long range weapon, meaning they usually only ever have to block 1 attack before being able to engage their opponent, using far less stamina than the shield user who has to block a flurry of strikes before even getting the chance to do damage.

    Any weapon that gives the option to use a shield is better off without it.



  • Yeah, Shields suck dick this patch. Im the most prominent buckler user in the game since 3 months back, and I can tell you that buckler is 100% useless now.
    1 block = There goes 50% of your stamina. (not that much really, but ALOT lol).



  • @wildwulfy:

    Stamina drain cost calculation upon shields have only been changed twice. First time through the Content Update 1, and now the Balance patch. Though the calculations are not that different from the old ones.

    A shield can prove to be very useful in a fight versus a projectile weapon at distance, very good at closing the distance without risking being shot too many times, though when it comes to melee it only proves to be useful in one versus one situation as the hold block negates the chance of falling helplessly against a feint. In a multi-situational fight we can clearly see that the shield lacks the speed to compete against the counterattacks. Weapons with shield are actually slower, If you were in a situation where you would block then try to attack your opponent as fast as possible because the shield has a timer on its lower phase… So from the moment you block and try to attack, you have to count the shield lower phase and weapon windup.

    For example Norse sword and Buckler shield.
    Buckler lower time : 0.15
    Norse sword attack1 windup : 0.35
    So total time till a attack could be made is 0.5.

    My suggestion how to solve this, would be if shields could have a ‘sort’ of counterattack. A kind of Tap-block where if you successfully perform it, you would have the shield lower time dropped instantly so that you could attack straight away.

    The hold block should remain as it always where, only that it would be apropriate with a unique feature where 2nd, 3rd and 4th block during a hold block stamina cost is reduced by 10% or something per hit to give them least one tanking opportunity.

    Either way, shields needs a fix soon.

    Totally agree, something needs to be done and this sounds like a great idea. If nothing else there should be a mechanic to reduce stamina drain against multiple attacks.



  • @Dev.:

    @NoVaLombardia:

    People have a habit of blocking in recovery with shields for some reason.

    This is most likely why shield users waste stamina like nothing.

    Which goes to show how terrible the recovery parry mechanic is, that people are accidentally using something that punishes them massively.

    Shields are almost totally useless right now. A perfectly legit strategy against a shield user in the new patch is: attack attack attack attack attack, opponent runs out of stamina and gets stunned, attack when they’re defenseless, repeat. The super slow counterattack times for the shield and the completely insane knockback in the latest patch mean you’re stuck blocking at least 2 strikes before you get in range to do any damage, wasting a considerable amount more stamina than a non-shield user.

    A non-shield user can parry and riposte with a long range weapon, meaning they usually only ever have to block 1 attack before being able to engage their opponent, using far less stamina than the shield user who has to block a flurry of strikes before even getting the chance to do damage.

    Any weapon that gives the option to use a shield is better off without it.

    I play shield knight and you’re absolutely correct. It’s AT LEAST 2 hits before engagement 99% of the time and then I’m at a severe stamina disadvantage, imo they could fix the shield mechanics by making it take the cost of a normal parry but make the shield breakable. So if you’re being a turtle “crack” then you have to fight like a man :)



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    People have a habit of blocking in recovery with shields for some reason.

    This is most likely why shield users waste stamina like nothing.

    I’d say that people who are using a shield will often attack first because they feel confident that they have the shield to protect them.

    This leads to the other player riposting off the shield users first attack and the shield user is expecting that riposte to come and so he blocks it, but this causes a ‘panic block’ situation.

    So the shield user is being aggressive and throwing the first hit but is being punished for doing so because the defender can riposte and cause greater stamina loss.


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