Longsword and SoW changes



  • Disscuss what you think about the SOW and longsword damage and speed changes.

    Longsword overhead damage from 85 to 82
    Longsword stab damage from 65 to 61
    Longsword overhead windup/combo/release from .5/.65/.65 to .525/.675/.6
    Longsword slash combo from .65 to .675
    Sword of War overhead damage from 75 to 70
    Sword of War stab damage from 75 to 68
    Sword of War slash release from .6 to .525 and combo from .65 to .675
    Sword of War overhead release from .6 to .525 and combo from .65 to .675
    Sword of War stab release from .35 to .4 and combo from .65 to .675



  • I’ll be the first to admit that they were overpowered. Every other knight primary was put to shame by those swords. High reach, decent speed, could 2 shot MAA with swings, 2 shot vanguard with stab + overhead bodyshots. Their only weakness was other knights… go figure.



  • I think they’re still borderline OP, particularly SoW which is overall faster now and still maintains the same HtK with combo feints into stabs which is its main selling point anyway. But I like that other people think they’re crap now so I can use my favorite knight weapon without feeling dirty :)



  • I think the axes were alright. The only weapons I felt were underpowered, or maybe just hard for me to get the hang of, was the maul and the grand mace.

    Hey, I have a question: Since the patch, can you one-hand a bastard sword without using a shield?
    Before, you could only do it with a weapon swap “glitch”.



  • Yes, just press 1.



  • I don’t like the longsword changes. I know it seems pretty hypocritical being an avid longsword sword user and hater of the SoW since bada really made how good it is shine back in the day, but the longsword could take 4 hits to kill knights if you mixed LMBs in, 3 hits to kill vanguards and sometimes even 3 on MaAs, so I thought it was pretty balanced. The long feints are what made the longsword as good as it was, so with those gone I don’t really think it needed touching.

    The SoW was incredible and I do believe needed nerfing, I don’t know if it was nerfed too much or not but it did need both speed and damage nerfs. 75 on overhead and stab was way too much for how fast it was and its reach.

    The new longsword really just doesn’t do it for me any more. I find my self doing so much better with the double axe now, which is basically the next pole axe/grand mace of this patch. If you really had to nerf the longsword, I guess it’s ovehead should have less damage but the damage of its stab and slash should remain the old way as well as its speed.



  • @SOC:

    Agreed.

    I get that 2 shotting vanguards consistently with the overhead->stab (or vice versa) combo on either of these weapons was MAAAYBE a bit much. I’m fine with the damage change… I guess. But now the 2 weapons are basically the same thing. I find myself doing a lot better with the longsword, but other weapons outshine it completely. I also find myself switching to the broadsword way more often. I might as well stick with it.



  • Having the Longsword be slightly better than every other weapon was preferable to me, because of it’s status as the Generic Knight Sword.

    That is typically what you would expect to see, with other weapons being more specialized in one thing or another. Is there any specific reason why the Double Axe or whatever -should- be as good as the Longsword?

    Nobody who was looking for a “cheap” way to play went for the Longsword.



  • That’s probably the dumbest arguement I’ve ever seen.



  • Broadsword has essentially same HTK as Longsword now, so why would I ever use it? I’ll just take an axe or the Maul and switch to my secondary if I want a sword.



  • @Daiyuki:

    Broadsword has essentially same HTK as Longsword now, so why would I ever use it? I’ll just take an axe or the Maul and switch to my secondary if I want a sword.

    This is the real problem with the changes. The HtK for LS and SoW was increased by 1 in A LOT of scenarios. Sure, SoW can still 3 shot a knight with stabs and overheads only as SlyGoat suggests is the appeal of SoW. But a single horizontal slash and that’s not the case. I don’t know about your knight playstyle, but horizontal slashing with the SoW and deaccelerating/accelerating/spinning was the most fun part of using it. I can’t do that now, to kill efficiently my playstyle and “mix-it-up tactics” are now limited.

    The problem here isn’t so much that LS/SoW aren’t good anymore, it’s that they’re no longer better than the 1h alternatives. As mentioned above, might as well just pack a maul or axe and a broad/norse sword for any sword purposes. LS/SoW are obsolete.



  • This is the real problem with the changes. The HtK for LS and SoW was increased by 1 in A LOT of scenarios.

    Lol, “A LOT of scenarios”

    Thanks for the entertainment but it’s not a lot of scenarios at all. It’s only one head hit and in team play 75-90% of the time the enemy will be at most in 3 hit kill range. The live Longsword and SoW are BORDERLINE 4 hit kill and just the slightest amount of extra damage make it three hits to kill.



  • @Jstorm:

    This is the real problem with the changes. The HtK for LS and SoW was increased by 1 in A LOT of scenarios.

    Lol, “A LOT of scenarios”

    Thanks for the entertainment but it’s not a lot of scenarios at all. It’s only one head hit and in team play 75-90% of the time the enemy will be at most in 3 hit kill range. The live Longsword and SoW are BORDERLINE 4 hit kill and just the slightest amount of damage make it three hits to kill.

    1 hit more on Vanguard and Knight. When discussing HTK, you can’t just say “Well sometimes they’ll have lower health, so it’s fine!”. That’s not how it works.



  • The new fire-pot alleviates a lot of the stress the SoW and Longsword users have to go through in order to still have the easy 2 HTK Vang and 3 HTK Knight, since they can’t get carried by the innate strength of the weapon anymore that held their hand due to their lack of aim/skill.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    The new fire-pot alleviates a lot of the stress the SoW and Longsword users have to go through in order to still have the easy 2 HTK Vang and 3 HTK Knight, since they can’t get carried by the innate strength of the weapon anymore that held their hand due to their lack of aim/skill.

    This just in, SoW/Longsword used to auto-aim for you. News to me.



  • Daiyuki, you probably forgot to set:

    LSSoWAutoAim=1 in your config file.

    It’s a common thing people miss. I think a lot of people have added:

    1HWeaponExtendRangeBeyondModel=1

    To their config :/



  • They way those were, was one of the main reason why there was no point to play vanguard in high level play. The speed, reach, and dmg were really good. Both those swords needed some kinda nerf and even now they are fine. Why should sow two hit everything but knights? It is the lightest, fastest knight primary sword, which usually means that the lightest and fastest should not do too much dmg. It still can two hit everyone but knights, so there is no problem. Can’t stab overhead vanguard? Sure it can, just get one headshot, and I disliked all stab overhead spam to begin with, makes it very boring when you just repeat same thing over and over.
    Long sword is still fine, you can two hit every class but knights (still one hits archer?). I actually don’t feel like knight was nerfed that much as everyone said they are. I play vanguard, and as weird as it is, I did better before patch, the first day of patch I did horrible, now getting back to my usual scores. So I picked up knight with long sword in duels and my score was 8/2. Thats me playing a class that was supposed to be nerfed, with no feints, the class that I am not most experienced with and going against weapons that been hated lately: spears, mauls, claymores.
    The changes are fine, and I think some things are not changed enough.



  • Knight sword meta can die in a burning fire. You have dominated the game since release, time to be balanced.



  • @Knil:

    Knight sword meta can die in a burning fire. You have dominated the game since release, time to be balanced.

    Welcome our new overlords, polearm meta.



  • It is true, the Knight SoW was a dominating weapon, it was too good. The Longsword was about right. The messar was a fun distraction.

    Now the SoW is kinda pointless, the longsword didn’t need a Nerf and the Messar is better now which is good. So really the SoW needs to have a little rethink of it’s use and buff the Longsword’s damage just a tad.

    Other than reach/speed/damage how is a 1 handed sword and different to a 2 handed sword, they both use practically the same horiz, overhead and stab styles. Perhaps the actually direction of utility of the weapons need to be looked into?


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