Daggers and short sword.



  • I was playing in the |MonK| duel server today. I found out that as an archer I could consistently 3shot a skilled vanguard and 4-5 shot a skilled knight with this weapon. My def of skilled was rank 30+ and generally proficient (or masterful) with their weapons. I could beat all classes with this little thing too. It’s riposte is insane and nearly unblockable as it’s just soooo fast. I was even able to flinch the claymore with it on multiple occasions. My thoughts are if you want to keep it this fast fine, but it should really get a damage nerf then. (yeah IK I said the dirty word “nerf”). If I can consistently 3shot van and 4-5shot knight then why ever use another archer weapon besides the SS…it’s slightly longer SLIGHTLY slower sister weapon. I mean really, what need have I to use a saber? Same # of hits usually. Slower, more reach but it’s so much more easily parried it doesn’t even matter. Note that these are my personal experiences/feeling on this particular weapon set. Just thinking it shouldn’t be harder for me as a van or knight to kill an archer in melee than it is for me to kill a dagger/ss archer.


  • Global Moderator

    Well those players suck.



  • @lemonater47:

    Well those players suck.

    Not to call people names, but its pretty much impossible for archer melee to get close to a vanguard now unless they use saber.



  • I think arche-melee is a bit op in general. A good archer is lethal on the distance and lethal in close combat. They are able to kill MAA in two hits, if he even makes it to them without being hit/killed first.

    Why not given them a damage-penality if they hit someone in the front, opposed the the backstab damage they get.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    @lemonater47:

    Well those players suck.

    Not to call people names, but its pretty much impossible for archer melee to get close to a vanguard now unless they use saber.

    I agree with the name calling (as in, no need for that) and he is right, the new vanguard knockback makes it needlessly difficult to even get close to a vanguard as an archer (knight as well). The saber, especially with the recent buffs, is certainly viable over the shortsword. If you play with it long enough, you will come to appreciate the slightly extra range, which is invaluable in many situations.



  • I’d like to belive the knockback makes it so, but it seems as though in duels it’s very very difficult to keep them off of you. The only real way to kill them is to beat on them until they run out of stam, but with comboes basically as soon as one of them gets a poke in it’s all over. 3 lightning quick hits and you’re done. I don’t understand why they did this honestly, dagger was fine pre-patch IMO.



  • You should try crouch lean back parries, I do them all the time against MaA and archers once I learned about it. Helps a TON.



  • dear everyone.

    please dont nerf shortsword.
    i will have nothing else to live for. ;_;

    thanks, duminikchikobub.



  • One handed weapons in general are far too fast.

    If you get attacked by a one-hander whilst wielding a two-hander chances are you will die because in some cases they can hit you before you’ve even stopped flinching. On that note: flinching should be directly related to the size, speed and damage of the weapon that hit you. Faster weapons = less recovery time etc.

    Had enough of archers and men at arms just facehugging and spamming their butter knives with little to no chance of retaliation.



  • @Shame:

    If you get attacked by a one-hander whilst wielding a two-hander chances are you will die because in some cases they can hit you before you’ve even stopped flinching.

    You can parry in flinch.



  • @DemonicChocobo:

    dear everyone.

    please dont nerf shortsword.
    i will have nothing else to live for. ;_;

    thanks, duminikchikobub.

    Can you not use another sword :P?



  • @Jstorm:

    You should try crouch lean back parries, I do them all the time against MaA and archers once I learned about it. Helps a TON.

    Thanks, I’ll try it but honestly I shouldn’t have to have a special technique for killing the class that’s supposedly weakest in melee.



  • @Shame:

    One handed weapons in general are far too fast.

    If you get attacked by a one-hander whilst wielding a two-hander chances are you will die because in some cases they can hit you before you’ve even stopped flinching. On that note: flinching should be directly related to the size, speed and damage of the weapon that hit you. Faster weapons = less recovery time etc.

    Had enough of archers and men at arms just facehugging and spamming their butter knives with little to no chance of retaliation.

    Ehhhhh……the broadsword is glitched I’m fairly certain but other than that “facehugging and spamming” are quite easily parried. I’m not sure all 1h weps need a nerf just the dagger and short sword as they are the fastest but still can 4shot knight just as Broad. In terms of balance that’s just silly to me.



  • @Helrin2:

    @DemonicChocobo:

    dear everyone.

    please dont nerf shortsword.
    i will have nothing else to live for. ;_;

    thanks, duminikchikobub.

    Can you not use another sword :P?

    no. short sword is my last light in this cold dark world. its warmth is all that is keeping me going. should it fade, my life would too.

    can you have that on your conscience???

    can you live with yourself knowing you took away all i had left???

    will you kill hopes and crush dreams???

    dont nerf shortsword.



  • Archer melee needs a nerf, not archer melee weapons.

    There’s a reason MaAs never pull out their secondaries unless they’re messing around.

    Give archers a class modifier that makes them very slightly more flawed in melee… like +0.05 on all windups, combos and ripostes or something. I dunno. Just the first thing that came to mind.
    I’m sure there are better options for the flaw.

    Also move the +50% backstab ability from Archers to the Dagger class of weapons.
    No, really.
    That’s a lot more important than you think.
    I’m amazed they haven’t done that already.
    75 damage Shortsword stabs is silly, and daggers having some rare usefulness for MaA would be awesome.


  • Global Moderator

    Short sword takes 4 hits to kill a vanguard not three. Only three if you backstab or get to overhead head shots with it.

    Still its fast and good that thing. Over whelming force is what the archer can do well.

    I feint those basterds.



  • @lemonater47:

    Short sword takes 4 hits to kill a vanguard not three. Only three if you backstab or get to overhead head shots with it.

    Still its fast and good that thing. Over whelming force is what the archer can do well.

    I feint those basterds.

    two head stabs kill
    two body stabs kill if one is a backstab
    2HTK is uncommon, but you have to mess up really bad to need more than 3

    I too would like to see the archer backstab ability removed and attributed to daggers instead. Having ranged weaponry is already enough of a distinctive class feature and MAA secondaries do feel pointless right now.



  • archers should be the worst in melee, coz bow. daggers should be short range, slow and low damage, yep the trifecta of melee fail, coz balance. it is lame that the melee classes fear melee with an arcger dagger. please fix this devs. grow your game.



  • @Shame:

    One handed weapons in general are far too fast.

    If you get attacked by a one-hander whilst wielding a two-hander chances are you will die because in some cases they can hit you before you’ve even stopped flinching. On that note: flinching should be directly related to the size, speed and damage of the weapon that hit you. Faster weapons = less recovery time etc.

    Had enough of archers and men at arms just facehugging and spamming their butter knives with little to no chance of retaliation.

    Good idea.



  • @Helrin2:

    I shouldn’t have to have a special technique for killing

    This attitude right here is the problem. EVERYONE should have MANY “special techniques” not just for killing archers but all the classes/weapons/playstyles. God forbid anyone learns and uses strategy.