Vanguard vs archer



  • Lots of people seem to think vanguard needs a better defense against archer…so I though about something, no, it’s not realistic but wtv!

    Vanguard could block arrow if they block with their weapon at the same time, it would requires skill but its one option to help them counter these archers! and you would have to block where the arrow is aimed at



  • Or they could throw a smoke pot or two



  • @gregcau:

    Or they could throw a smoke pot or two

    Pretty much what Greg said.

    On your idea, I think that parrying arrows(Whist realistic) isn’t something that could be of benefit. Arrows travel at such an ungodly speed in the game that 90% of the players most likely will never be able to parry an arrow, certaintly at crucial moments. If it were to be implemented, the majority of the playerbase would gain absolutely nothing



  • Vanguard vs archer

    Vanguard should move fast by a zigzag. And when he reach the archer, he very easily kills him. He also can throw some throwing axes. If he hit two times, archers is dead until the Vanguard reach him.

    Vanguards really don’t need a shield. I never use shield and I don’t have problems with archers.



  • Smoke pots aren’t the answer, they won’t stop good archers. Neither does zig zagging or throwing axes. You’ll never hit a good archer in melee either, even if you manage to reach him. Perma-shield on back selectable through specials is.



  • @SOC:

    Smoke pots aren’t the answer, they won’t stop good archers. Neither does zig zagging or throwing axes. You’ll never hit a good archer in melee either, even if you manage to reach him. Perma-shield on back selectable through specials is.

    Yeah but you’re talking about good archers. About 5% of all the archer players can actually be concidered good that they can handle themselves well in ranged and melee. If we keep taking player skill into concideration with suggestions, it’ll end up in a balance clusterfuck. “Only thing that can stop a good X is a good Y.”



  • @SharpshotSid:

    it’ll end up in a balance clusterfuck.

    we already are in a balance clusterfuck. the game is alot worse off than it was prepatch imo



  • An archer is a vanguards weakness.

    A smoke pot will give a vanguard time but usually won’t stop a good archer. Just delay their shot. A little more time can be all you need though.



  • well that was one idea, I play vanguard and I couldn’t care less about archer but it seems lots of people complained about it so I though of this, and it would prevent having a game of jumping 360 vanguard to block arrows if there was a shield in their back!



  • @lemonater47:

    An archer is a vanguards weakness.

    And MaAs. And hit trading knights. But I digress, archers are every class’ weakness.



  • Mithron is right, not even the buffed smoke pots are enough. Their throwing time has been buffed a bit which is nice but they still last very little time and cover very small area, not to mention that you can see through the edges of the smoke ball.

    I don´t want vanguards to be overpowered but the smoke pot needs to be buffed a lot more if archers need to be stopped. The combo time (if we can call it that way) for throwing the smoke pot is very long, meaning it´s quick to throw one but when you then want to throw the second one it takes foreeeeeveeeeer and often I´ll catch an arrow in my face.



  • Bah. I’m doing alright with the smoke pots ;)

    You don’t want to throw the second one right away anyways. You throw the first one, see if it lands in a good place as the smoke pillar starts to build up. Then throw the second one on either side or infront of the other smoke pillar, depending on which side the archers stepped out on.

    I do think that the smoke should have a bit of effect on your vision, though. If you happen to be in the AoE of a smoke pot, you should start coughing and your vision would get a bit blurry from your watering eyes. When you step out of the smoke cloud, you still have the blurry vision. It’s not too bad, you can still aim at people, but it’ll be harder over longer distances. The effect last for three seconds, and Vanguards are immune (because they have fucking respirators under their helmets!)



  • Well I always wanted the vanguard to have a heatershield and the broadsword as a secondary :D
    But I don’t think that’d be good for balancing.
    Archers could use a debuff in melee combat though, in MY opinion. It’s just stupid how awesome they are in melee combat. usually I don’t even get to equipping my secondary because they flinch me all the time. Daggers shouldn’t flinch. And they should get as short as prepatch again. they look like damn shortswords.

    But talking about the archers with bows and crossbows, I don’t think that vanguards need more to defend themselves against them. Most of the archers are too stupid to take out their secondary. Just launch a chargeattack on them and onehit them. Finished.



  • change damage typ of throwing knives to Cut, increase power to 50.

    (also, of course, Vanguard is already OP, so… :/



  • If you are Vanguard and are hitting by projectiles too often, just change your class to MAA or Knight who can take a shield. Simple.

    I prefer Knight much more than Vanguard, but I never use shield and always fight with the twohanded axe. Am I the only one person who really don’t have problems with archers?

    If the zigzag is too less, I can always use the environment as my shield. Or hide behind someone who have shield. And throw my throwing axes or wait until my friendly archers kill this bastard. Teamplay mutafaka!

    Dagger isn’t OP. It is extreme fast, but does very small count of damage and is shorter than other weapons. And I know how to fight with big twohanded weapon against spammers with dagger. Skill mutafaka! I really don’t have problems.



  • well I don’t have problems with archer and I’m doing very fine with smoke pots so far…people complain but how often do you see people use the smoke pots? never, they prefer the axe throw, then pay for it!



  • @Mgqc:

    well I don’t have problems with archer and I’m doing very fine with smoke pots so far…people complain but how often do you see people use the smoke pots? never, they prefer the axe throw, then pay for it!

    I use nothing but smoke now and have since this patch. It’s not the answer. I end up using it for crucial melee opportunities, it’s no archer shield.



  • @SOC:

    @lemonater47:

    An archer is a vanguards weakness.

    And MaAs. And hit trading knights. But I digress, archers are every class’ weakness.

    Lol Nope

    it is not required that it be like that but the system has been designed like this, wholesale, I think, you are have a better class for a matchup but not the best class.

    Archer < Knight
    Vanguard < Archer
    MaA < Vanguard
    Knight < MaA

    Edit: Vanguard > archer in close fight



  • Wait you mean all this time it was supposed to be MAA < VG?



  • @dudeface:

    Wait you mean all this time it was supposed to be MAA < VG?

    I think, TBs guys make the class “balanced” between them, when you have a large weapon and you fight against somebody who has the smallest range (vs you) and you can 1 or 2 shoots him, your class is better for the fight but not the best.

    And in close fight, the VG blast the archer


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