No-riposte on panic parry is pointless.



  • This is the second major difference between cftp and panic parry, but people don’t talk about it that much. You can’t counterattack (riposte) after a panic parry.

    I honestly see no point to this. The recovery after a panic parry during which you can’t attack isn’t long enough to give the advantage back to the attacker. If you panic parry an attack, then both of you furiously spam your mouse buttons until you come out of recovery, you’re still going to hit your attacker before he can hit you, unless you have a maul and he has a hatchet or something.

    The only purpose that this serves is to arbitrarily slow down combat. Someone who could block the theoretical riposte is gonna be able to block the non-riposte counter attack, and someone who couldn’t block the riposte is likely gonna die anyway - this pause mechanic just makes it take a few extra seconds.

    In fact, letting you riposte would be helping new players in a lot of ways - more often than someone being relieved at a brief respite after forcing a panic parry, I see people panic parrying (the old definition of panic parrying - trying to parry a riposte that ain’t comin) because they’re afraid of that riposte, not aware that it’s actually impossible. Then, since I’m actually spamming my mouse buttons, trying to riposte, I hit them in parry recovery. If I had been able to riposte, they’d’ve blocked it and had the advantage again. It just isn’t clear at all that you can’t riposte after a panic parry - to the casual observer, there is no difference between a parry and a panic parry.

    I see two solutions to this issue… but first a brief explanation of the flow of combat.

    When two players fight each other, they are in certain ‘states’ at any given time - offense or defense. When a player is on the offense, it means that they are able to attack the other. The player on defense is waiting for the player on offense to attack them so they can parry. When you parry an attack, or your opponent misses the attack, you gain the offensive advantage, and suddenly your opponent is on defense - the roles are reversed. There are a few other ways to go from defense to offense, but that needn’t be explored here.

    My two solutions have two different outcomes regarding the interchange of offense and defense:

    1. Tweak the numbers such that the person who forces the other to panic parry is able to attack again before the panic parryer has the chance to attack - this essentially means that when you panic parry, you won’t be able to go on offense. Your opponent retains their offensive advantage. However, if you parry again (a non-panic parry), or your opponent waits too long, you will be able to go on offense.

    2. Allow a riposte off a panic parry. In terms of offense and defense, this is identical to how the game functions now - when you panic parry in live, you gain the offensive advantage, you just have to wait through a short (pointless) delay.



  • @Yazuak:

    1. Tweak the numbers such that the person who forces the other to panic parry is able to attack again before the panic parryer has the chance to attack - this essentially means that when you panic parry, you won’t be able to go on offense. Your opponent retains their offensive advantage. However, if you parry again (a non-panic parry), or your opponent waits too long, you will be able to go on offense.

    I think I can agree with this. Panic parry needs to be more punishable, and it needs to be in a way that speeds the fight up.

    Obviously though, just remove panic parry and revert it to combo feint to parry.



  • No riposte on panic parry is a form of punishment for going into recovery.

    If you want to riposte, utilize combo-parries.



  • These “oh shit, i’m gonna die insta parries” Should simply never put them back into the offensive.
    It should be a last second defense that prevents you from getting hit, allowing you the opportunity to move and regain your composure.

    We need to reward good footwork and not punish it.



  • Honestly I do not see an issue here. When panic parrying you move you weapon back by force while it is still swinging (in recovery). Then the enemies attack impacts on your weapon. Now being able to start a quick counter attack (= riposte) doesn’t make much sense to me.

    In mechanics its a unnecessary buff to panic parry which means missing your strikes will be punished even less than before.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    No riposte on panic parry is a form of punishment for going into recovery.

    If you want to riposte, utilize combo-parries.

    It’s not a very good punishment, since you still gain the offensive and you can feint your opponent or what have you. My point was that the punishment means practically nothing, so you might as well allow them to riposte. I can block a non-riposte, and I can block a riposte. If they riposte, it just means that I don’t have to waste my time waiting for their panic parry recovery to expire, and I don’t have to worry about a feint.

    @Evil:

    Honestly I do not see an issue here. When panic parrying you move you weapon back by force while it is still swinging (in recovery). Then the enemies attack impacts on your weapon. Now being able to start a quick counter attack (= riposte) doesn’t make much sense to me.

    In mechanics its a unnecessary buff to panic parry which means missing your strikes will be punished even less than before.

    As Nova mentioned, you can riposte off a comboparry, which happens even faster than a panic parry (but of course comboparries are completely useless because they happen too fast.) So your point about the defiance of the laws of physics isn’t very strong.

    My point was that it’s an insignificant buff that makes the game more convenient for everybody, not just the defender.



  • @Yazuak:

    (but of course comboparries are completely useless because they happen too fast.)

    Depends on the situation. it is easier to use them in 1v2s or clusterfucks.

    People are still used to reflexively queueing a combo early or a parry early. Instead of doing that, you have to wait until the end of your release to decide whether or not you want to combo or not.

    Combo-parries are also very useful in defending against hit-trades.

    @Yazuak:

    it just means that I don’t have to waste my time waiting for their panic parry recovery to expire, and I don’t have to worry about a feint.

    The real question is. If they aren’t attacking as soon as they can after they panic parry, why aren’t you attacking? There’s a window of time you can recognize where, “if they don’t attack by this moment, I can attack.” You can also feint to parry if you made a mistake in this situation.



  • @Yazuak:

    It’s not a very good punishment, since you still gain the offensive and you can feint your opponent or what have you.

    Most people forget about the huge stamina cost. If you go aggressive after a panic parry you are usually more exhausted than your enemy. This forces you to end the fight quickly or make your enemy lose stamina. Otherwise there is a good chance you will be stunned and killed off.
    @Yazuak:

    As Nova mentioned, you can riposte off a comboparry, which happens even faster than a panic parry (but of course comboparries are completely useless because they happen too fast.) So your point about the defiance of the laws of physics isn’t very strong.

    The argument still holds as combo parry requires you to go through the whole combo windup. Its far less forced than panic parry where you just cancel your recovery.
    @Yazuak:

    My point was that it’s an insignificant buff that makes the game more convenient for everybody, not just the defender.

    It doesn’t make the game more convenient exept for the defender who just gets another option to choose from. You are not forced to riposte if you have the option you know. And its often wise not to riposte but to wait for more options to come available. For example: When I am forced to use panic parry I usually try to slow down the combat to reduce my enemies stamina advantage instead of going fully aggressive risking a stun in the process. Giving me the option to riposte will not increase your quality of life as attacker as it solely depends on the defender what happens next. Given that you also cancel your recovery by panic parrying you can attack far too soon this way.



  • cftp will never return. Rip Cftp… Rip