Poll: Combo-feint-to-Parry



  • I think the best thing that could happen would be to bring the old combo feint to parry back with the old values.
    Hopefully it could bring more people back to the game.



  • But you can have that game back BRICK LOvE. All you good players can have it, it’s called Chivalry+. If only noobs and bad players like the official game, why would you even play there, where’s the challenge and fun in that?
    Why aren’t you having the time of your life in Chiv+ servers with other skilled players?



  • @playerx:

    But you can have that game back BRICK LOvE. All you good players can have it, it’s called Chivalry+. If only noobs and bad players like the official game, why would you even play there, where’s the challenge and fun in that?
    Why aren’t you having the time of your life in Chiv+ servers with other skilled players?

    Because no other clans except maybe 2-3 in both EU and NA (maybe AUS too, not sure) want to make the switch to Chiv+. People have become content with their dumbed down, EZ mode version with a clunky hitbox and the endurance of a possum. I and most of the other people in Tempest like Chiv+ way more than live. But literally not a single clan will even do a 2v2 in Chiv+. So there’s no comp scene for it.



  • The problem with Chiv+ here in Aus, we don’t have the player base to reliably keep the Chiv+ server running, let alone having the casual players join the mod as it generally isn’t running TO.

    It is very rare for a mod to outpace the growth of the underlying game. With the very low growth (or stagnation) of Chiv, chiv+ doesn’t really stand a chance.



  • In the singapore area we might have online at most a dozen of the twenty or so remaining regulars from the pre-patch era. The rest of the server gets filled with rank 5 chaff from somewhere 300ms away.

    I had a server once, but it was no longer worth it after a time. I would love to have a Chiv+ server if only we still had players (not counting the retards from the US who insist of joining).



  • @playerx:

    But you can have that game back BRICK LOvE. All you good players can have it, it’s called Chivalry+. If only noobs and bad players like the official game, why would you even play there, where’s the challenge and fun in that?
    Why aren’t you having the time of your life in Chiv+ servers with other skilled players?

    I do and it’s a ton of fun, but there’s only one server running it with TO in NA. If no one is on, I exit the game. Have you tried it at all?



  • I haven’t tried Chiv+. But if it reverts the game to the state where it was before the big summer patch, then I still remember how it plays. I prefer the current game, not because of cftp but because of various other issues the old game had.



  • @dudeface:

    In the singapore area we might have online at most a dozen of the twenty or so remaining regulars from the pre-patch era. The rest of the server gets filled with rank 5 chaff from somewhere 300ms away.

    I had a server once, but it was no longer worth it after a time. I would love to have a Chiv+ server if only we still had players (not counting the retards from the US who insist of joining).

    If you call off your 300 pingers on our American servers i will try and do the same.
    xD



  • @playerx:

    I haven’t tried Chiv+. But if it reverts the game to the state where it was before the big summer patch, then I still remember how it plays. I prefer the current game, not because of cftp but because of various other issues the old game had.

    What were some of those issues? I’m just curious, because I think I only remember the good things. Having to turn 90 degrees to block face hugging was a nuisance. Other than the removal of CFtP and the addition of panic parry and the bubble, I can’t think of too many differences.



  • Why not BRICK LOve, I’ll list the ones that were problematic for me. I’ll just say first that I really don’t want to fight any forum fights, none of us is going to change our minds anyway. So here’s the list in no specific order:
    Feints- too hard to react to
    Insta overheads- they were too insta
    Combo feint to attack- it was bullshit
    Ability to sprint in every situation- it enabled the highly skilled tactic of running around in circles comboing and it looked stupid
    Sow stab- 80 % of knights were using sow at the time, it was annoying as hell

    Those are the major issues I had in old Chivalry. This current version has a lot of problems too but all things considered it suits better to my playstyle than the old one.



  • @playerx:

    Those are the major issues I had in old Chivalry. This current version has a lot of problems too but all things considered it suits better to my playstyle than the old one.

    I agree, the competitive players only want these things to pub stomp, not for competitive reasons.



  • @gregcau:

    I agree, the competitive players only want these things to pub stomp, not for competitive reasons.

    Well of course, clans have competitions to see who can stomp the most pubs. You thought that we actual scrimmed eachother? Pffffffff that’s funny.



  • @gregcau:

    I agree, the competitive players only want these things to pub stomp, not for competitive reasons.

    Sadly this is what casual players actually believe.



  • Have you heard of chiv+?

    I mean when the Cod 4 pro mod came out every competitive player transitioned and stop complaining about the base game.

    Not the case here.

    The he main problem here is it does ruin pub play. Like not having it ruins comp play. Either way you have it people are gonna be unhappy. The ONLY way people are gonna be happy is if the comp players all transition to chiv+. Who are massively in the minority. Too wide a skill gap isn’t always a good thing. Ragequits can be permanent. I thought people wanted to grow the community. Not eliminate a particular group completely.



  • @lemonater47:

    Have you heard of chiv+?
    Too wide a skill gap isn’t always a good thing. Ragequits can be permanent. I thought people wanted to grow the community. Not eliminate a particular group completely.

    **
    So your solution is to cater to people who are sore losers?**

    That would be a horribly short-sighted decision to make.

    This game is supposed to emulate melee combat in a virtual setting like never before by giving you the “tools” (controls) to do so. It’s not Tetris (react to what you are given; rearrange the blocks in the right way to win) or Mario Brothers (two dimensional movement, jump onto a creature to kill it). Chivalry is much deeper. Chivalry is fluid. You can bend the rules. You can innovate.

    By giving players a larger degree of control over their character — such as turning an attacking swing into a parry by re-angling the blade into an opponent’s oncoming weapon in a split second decision, which used to be possible — players have more freedom to develop their own techniques, which can take dozens of hours to perfect and be used reliably.

    Unlike in the real world, however — where pitting an untrained peasant against a young knight in his prime who trains 5 days a week and has real combat experience would lead to a cruel death for the peasant— every player in CMW instead starts out on an equal footing. Virtually, we are all “physically fit” and command basic skills (swinging, stabbing, parrying, holding a shield properly, etc.).

    We are all on equal ground and have the same set of tools as everyone else in the game. What, then, determines who wins and who loses?

    Skill.

    How do you get that? By playing a lot and practicing, and by naturally having good reflexes and so forth (often referred to under the umbrella term “skill ceiling”).

    The changes in the June patch undermined the ability to use skill to beat an opponent in this game and introduced a few frustratingly unintuitive changes such as the bubble. I don’t see how this could be any clearer. Remember that the game had already been officially released for well over 8 months when many of these sweeping changes were suddenly made to the game’s core combat mechanics and movement system.



  • On a side note, Tiberius once opined that AOC was too difficult and off-putting for new players, and that he wished new players would be able to join a CMW server for the first time and find it “more intuitive”, or something to that effect.

    I initially agreed with his sentiments. But now I fear that what he really meant was that CMW’s skill ceiling should be so low that any casual young gamer should be able to log in for the first time and start “owning” within a few hours of play. I hope that wasn’t what he meant. As is the case with learning martial arts, fencing, and all other competitive activities in real life, including both physical and mental, it takes time and effort to become a proficient opponent. And there is nothing wrong with making a game that reflects this, to an extent. It is a big factor in enjoyment (challenge and sense of achievement) and replayability.

    Bonus psychological diagrams:


    EDIT: I honestly feel that for a lot of people, Chivalry took a nosedive from the upper right quadrant (“arousal, control, and flow”) to the lower left quadrant (“worry, boredom, and apathy”).

    Hence a lot of people left the game in droves, and now even with sales a lot of new people don’t stick around.

    Why?

    Boredom and apathy.

    Play on a Chiv+ server sometime and you’ll find a rekindled experience of the direction Chivalry was pursuing — a game that was characterized by more tense, “arousing” situations, whereas in the current version of the game it is often “apathy”, “worry” (frustration), and yes, “boredom”.

    What the dev team should concentrate on is getting newbies out of the top left area (anxiety/frustration resulting from high game difficulty + low skill level) as quickly as possible by increasing their skill level.

    How? By embracing the fact that the game is difficult, and highlighting that as a POSITIVE TRAIT. Advertising the game as a challenge. Creating a better tutorial. Making a sticky thread of YouTube Chivalry tutorials for new players in the forums or in the game launcher. There are so many options. If some kids still can’t hack it (no pun intended), then they can go play Tetris or Saints Row or something instead — obviously Chivalry just ain’t their cup of tea.



  • @HaHawk:

    How? By embracing the fact that the game is difficult, and highlighting that as a POSITIVE TRAIT. Advertising the game as a challenge. Creating a better tutorial. Making a sticky thread of YouTube Chivalry tutorials for new players in the forums or in the game launcher. There are so many options. If some kids still can’t hack it (no pun intended), then they can go play Tetris or Saints Row or something instead — obviously Chivalry just ain’t their cup of tea.

    +1 This. I’ve likened this game to Dark Souls countless times to the hapless newbies, explaining that the game is hard as fuck at the start, and to expect to have their asses handed to them, but in turn they’ll learn from their mistakes, and the more you play, the more addictive it becomes. Difficulty in a gritty, gruesome medieval slasher is a good thing, especially for the market that actually enjoys the theme and concepts of the game.



  • Game should be very hard but allow many choices of fighting, strategies and playstyles. Game shouldn’t be nerfed for the newbies (like now), because those newbies will become skilled someday and find that the game is boring. Chiv should be hard, but there also should be lots of tutorials and “things explained” in the game so people can learn their mistakes rather than ragequit.

    Natural Selection 2 has implemented a very good idea - The “rookie mode”. New players in the game recieve enormous amount of tips while playing and also sometimes, a little “protip” video comes up that explains certain things that player just did or was about to do. “Rookie mode” disapears after playing the game for some bigger time.

    If Chivalry had this kind of helpfull tips then there would be less complains in-game like: “Oh, you are glitching again” or “Stop exploiting you ****!”. Tutorial in chiv doesn’t demonstrate all the techniques and ways of fighting. It would be nice if the tutorial was expanded and if a new player is trying to connect to a server without trying the tutorial first - then he/she should get a pop-up message saying something like: “The game is really hard, you should try playing the tutorial first, young warrior”.

    Also i miss the loading screen tips :l

    HaHawk +1. Awesome!



  • Nicely put, HaHawk.



  • Crom approves of HaHawks badassery.

    Crom is pleased.


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