Just my two cents on class balance…
So, tiny backstory; I’ve been playing Chivalry vanilla for about a year, I really enjoy the game. I’m a “decent” player, someone who knows the ins and outs of the game, but still panic-parries sometimes and hasn’t quite mastered the godforsaken helicopter dance.
Still, when I’m in a beta I try to provide whatever feedback I can, and after putting a lot of hours in, here’s what I’ve got so far in terms of my view of each class. Obviously, I welcome argument, refinement, and discussion on this topic!
I feel like out of all the classes, the viking needs the most work. He’s not BAD, per se; in fact, he’s decent across the board. Decent speed, decent health, decent damage, decent ranged options. The problem is that in my opinion, ‘decent’ means nothing in Chivalry. Strength is derived from specialization, and the viking has very little. He lacks the samurai’s reach, the ninja’s speed, the knight’s durability, the spartan’s defense, and the pirate’s ranged offensive. He feels sufficient in every respect, and nothing more. As a result, it feels like in most 1v1s, the viking is in either a neutral or disadvantageous position, especially against knights, samurai and spartans. The weapon throws are wonderfully fun and have a lot of impact, but the berserk ability feels very situational, borderline useless, as the only real work I’ve gotten out of it was cleaning up big battles. Maybe it’s my bias as a duelist, but that doesn’t strike me as valuable.
Suggestions: The viking isn’t terrible, he just needs a nudge towards some kind of specialization. I feel like berserking would be better-served if it was more practical, such as a more significant speed boost after being parried. More throwing ammunition also seems like it would be good, and/or a bit more movement speed, perhaps.
The Spartan is formidable. He’s got a great shield, awesome range, and throwing weapon support. That said, I think he could still use some tweaks.
The main problem I have so far with the spartan is that while he’s great against those who hug his shield in melee combat, such as pirates, ninjas, and vikings, he lacks variety in his offense against samurai and knights. The sword he’s got is a little better than his spear for this, but it still struggles immensely against the longsword, nodachi, and similar weapons.
Suggestions: I think the spartan needs a bit more range on at least one of his side weapons, or at the very least the ability to de-equip his shield when switching to them so that he doesn’t have to deal with the stam drain of shields vs. two-handed weapons, allowing him to get in on those with longer ones.
The knight is fantastically powerful, and fantastically boring. An import from vanilla Chivalry, much of what made him so strong there is intact: excellent durability, solid reach, and a mix of attack speed and damage. The addition of the crossbow is fantastic, giving him a potent ranged option at the cost of a shield, allowing some flexibility in playstyle. My problem? If you want to use a shield, your only weapon available is the longsword, and the two-handed variety is dull, too. Compared to the likes of the samurai and ninja, the knight’s arsenal is boring. One sword and multiple polearms?
Suggestion: Replace at least one polearm with a hammer or sword. Add a couple of one-handed secondary options to go with the shield, such as a falchion/shield pairing or the like.
As far as flavor goes, I feel like Ninja’s one of the best classes in the game. Their arsenal is varied and useful, their throwing weapons are awesome, and their animations are cool. However, despite the fact I think they’re mostly pretty good in terms of balance, one glaring thing feels off: after extended play as a ninja, I still have no idea what I’m supposed to do against a good shield-user.
The claws are practically worthless against them, the staff can sneak a hit in or two but it’s not very reliable, the blade and kusari lack the proper reach, and dodge-rolling is just asking to get my face bashed in. Kicking works sometimes, but it’s such a slow animation that locks the ninja out of his usual mobility that it’s almost more trouble than it’s worth. In most fights, the ninja feels quick, fragile and versatile, but against shields, it’s like fighting a wall.
Suggestions: I feel like the ninja’s kick should be a little faster, and/or he should be able to stam drain block-spammers a bit more easily.
There’s no arguing the efficiency and coolness of the Pirate’s rifle and pistol; I’ve seen my head explode more than once when I thought I had taken the advantage against one of these seafaring rogues. Their melee arsenal isn’t bad either, with the cutlass being a versatile and deadly weapon. That said, they still feel a little overly reliant on their ranged arsenal. Whether this is intentional to make them serve the same role as the vanilla game’s archer is worth considering, but I think I’d like to see them have a bit more to their melee game to help them deal with shield-users that their guns aren’t doing much good against.
Suggestions: Daggers would be nice. They do a lot of heavy lifting for vanilla archers, and I think they’d serve well here.
Simply put, the samurai is awesome. Too awesome. Their weapon variety is fantastic, they have a potent ranged option, their health is second only to knights, even surpassing the vanilla vanguard I think, and they have incredible dueling potential as well as solid team play capabilities. The truth is, they feel a little overpowered to me, though this is only true of certain weapons. The samurai is fun, but it’s also a little too easy to rack up kills with.
Suggestions: The nodachi feels like the worst culprit to me. Incredible range and speed with solid damage all in one, and it’s pretty suspicious that pretty much every samurai uses it. The katana, if anything, feels underpowered, but I think the club - forget the name - is actually in a great place. I also feel like their health and speed are a bit much together. I’d personally be in favor of a slight decrease to at least one.
All in all, those are my thoughts on things so far. I of course welcome discourse here and hope this feedback’s helpful!
I’d like to add that it may just be me, but the Ninja’s sword feels VERY slow despite being a lightly armoured DW version of an MAA. I’m also lamenting the lack of a tanto or short sword version of the main blade. Claws are great but c’mon…gimme a tanto or something XD
Gauntlet last edited by
I agree with most of what you write, but I have two caveats with your analysis. First, you mention shields being great against ninjas and pirates. This is incredibly false, and I’d be willing to show you why in a server if you would care to entertain that. The ninja claws in particular swing around shields like no other weapon can, and are so small with subtle animations that it’s hard to tell what’s going on behind a large shield. Is this balanced? I think so, actually, it means you can’t just hold your shield up and deflect side attacks, you have to be cautious and not let the ninja facehug you with those claws.
Second, you mention that Samurai are OP. I disagree with this, I find Samurai to be the most well rounded in all situations, and thus is the preferred class of many.
I think what is overpowered though, and here is where I think your point still stands, is that the Nodachi is the thing that makes Samurai overpowered. His armor and speed balance well with the reach and damage of his weapons, making him quite a powerful adversary, but something about the nodachi damage output, reach, and potent stabs feels off. It quite completely overshadows the Naginata in all of these minus reach. I think that the Samurai long weapon arsenal should see some revisions, and leave the smaller weapons the way they are. Katanas are very potent when used correctly, and so are wakizashi, but they do feel overshadowed by the near one-hit killing power of the nodachi overhand, and the super speedy stab ripostes.
All in all, I think the samurai suffer from vanguardism, the ability to rack up absolutely massive kills because of their long reaching weapons. Though what I think the Samurai needs is a very clear counter. At the moment, no weapons seem to really murder a samurai outright, excluding the club he can wield (which is samurai exclusive).
I’ll defer to your judgement on the claws, Gauntlet! I appreciate the input. I’ll keep trying them against shields.
I never have any problem as I ninja against shields. In fact I find it’s easier, since I can kick them,
Ninjas kick is the best in the game.
I feel like Knight is currently the strongest class in the game, perhaps so people have a reason to play him when they have all these new classes.
The nodachi is a very strong weapon, but aside from that the Samurai seems pretty fair.
I do agree with the points you make on the Viking.
I agree with pretty much everything the OP said, seems well thought out.
I love the samurai aesthetic, and they are pretty much the reason I purchased the game. But the nodachi and the spear are definitely broken right now.
The spear can combo, which is neat, but the speed, damage and range make it an extremely formidable weapon. The combo animations are also broken making them difficult to read but I assume this is getting fixed. I think the spear is probably a bit better than the nodachi but the nodachi is easier to pick up.
The nodachi seems like a nightmare right now. The samurai is already quite strong health/speed wise and fits pretty well into the vanguard niche with some of his other weapons, but the nodachi throws his balancing out of whack. It’s too fast, too strong and too damn big. The powerful sweeping strikes make it easy to damage teammates when spamming lmb which makes it a terrible weapon to offer beginners, especially since it is so effective at racking up scores.
Every spartans vs samurai I’ve played has been a clean wipe for spartans. I think this is partially because samurai have an effective ranged weapon on top of a melee weapon with great reach. This gives them a somewhat unfair advantage against classes without fast, damaging or long melee that rely on their ability to close quickly or shoot from afar, like pirates, ninjas and vikings to some extent.
I hope this class gets nerfed just enough to still be great and viable.
3/4 Samurai vs Spartan games: Half the Samurai team uses a bow, the other half swings and swings and swings the Nodachi. 60-23 Samurai.