Fix Gun Designs: Pistol Spam / Meatshotting Shotgun Blunder



  • So based on Sly’s words on the Blunderbuss:
    @SlyGoat:

    Blunderbuss was significantly reworked. It now has reduced damage when it hits the same person with more than one pellet, but hitting multiple people with it does significantly more damage. The idea behind this was to give it a proper combat role because straight up shotguns are just not possible to balance in a melee game - they’re balanced in FPS games by essentially being the shortest ranged weapons, obviously this isn’t the case in a melee game.

    It’s main role is that of a more widespread firepot, again, Sly’s words make a lot more sense now
    @SlyGoat:

    Think of it like a fire pot/flaming rum

    unfortunately, this role is completely overshadowed by the extreme single person damage this weapon is capable of putting out
    If it’s going to have a group fire role it can not have the capability to one shot single targets
    So here’s what’s going to have to happen:

    Blunderbuss:
    +Increase spread and pellet count

    +Decrease consecutive pellet shots on single targets

    Now before you all start believing that not being able to one shot single targets is too much of a nerf, know just how much damage you would be able to put out if you fired this at a group like you are supposed to:
    @lemonater47:

    So against a Spartan that’s 35 damage for the first pellet and 7 for the rest.

    Each pellet that hits a separate target would end up doing a good 1/3 of their health

    This is the Blunder’s true purpose in this game, and don’t start complaining how the Pirate needs a good single target gun, because he already has one, it’s called the Pistol
    Unfortunately for many of you the Pistol requires aim

    Pistol:
    +Increase damage

    +Decrease ammo amount OR Increase reload time

    The problem with the Pistol at the moment is how easy this thing is to spam from a good distance away. What needs to happen is an ammo decrease, which allows you to spam but punishes you for doing so when you run out of ammo. Or, an increase in reload time which competely disables the ability to spam, and you get to keep all of your ammo.

    Pistol fills single target damage role-not good against groups
    Blunder fills group damage role-should not be good against single targets

    ! This weapon is truly boggling
    !
    ! it’s a shotgun
    ! in a melee fighting game
    !
    ! it does not reward good aim
    ! it does not punish bad aim
    ! it’s spread sees to both of those
    !
    ! nothing can block it
    !
    !
    ! Bow requires aim and can 1 shot a couple classes
    ! Crossbow requires aim and can 1 shot a couple classes
    ! Pistol requires aim and can 1 shot a couple classes
    ! Blunderbuss…
    ! Blunderbuss requires no aim, and can 1 shot every single class
    !
    !
    ! What exactly is the purpose of the Blunderbuss?
    ! Would anyone be sad that a no-skill weapon like this was made to require skill?
    Edited in case TB is confused about what to do



  • I have to agree, the blunderbuss really ruins it for me.



  • Woah! I think you just went too far in your second comment. This game is purely Beta. If you remember playing C:MW beta you will notice there was a huge difference from that to its current release. Beta’s are purely for testing. There shouldn’t be a prestigious competitive play in beta until final release. Otherwise people would be exploiting the imbalances. Just have fun and provide constructive feedback for a better game on release.

    Now, for my opinion. The blunderbuss is not a shotgun. In my opinion it is a lower ranged version of the pistol and personally, I enjoy the pistol over the blunderbuss because of that. I prefer accuracy over power. Although, I do think the guns need longer reload times. Currently I can fire two shots with the guns at moderate range before an enemy engages in melee combat which I don’t feel is right.



  • @djk45:

    The blunderbuss is not a shotgun.

    I’ve never had an easier time hitting with any ranged weapon in Chiv, and I’m not an archer player / ranged player. Turn on your tracers or play the tutorial mode in the visualization room, and look at what the blunderbuss tracers show. It’s a shotgun, through and through, and when you aim at the torso, the spread has a tendency to hit the head a lot causing a near instant kill (if not instant).

    Something just is wrong about the concept of a shotgun in a game that focuses so much on its melee combat.



  • @djk45:

    This game is purely Beta.

    So… I should wait until it goes Live to tell the Devs how much I hate it and just how stupid of an idea it is?
    why can’t I just tell them noooooow?? :C

    @djk45:

    Now, for my opinion. The blunderbuss is not a shotgun.

    I don’t think it being a “shotgun” is up for interpretation
    it fires pellets in a spread shot

    that’s a shotgun
    and it requires no aim to get hits with
    this is by far the lowest skill floor weapon in the entirety of both games
    even the fucking oilpot requires more skill to use



  • Ah, I will play it this weekend. I was reading the patch notes and apparently they did give the blunderbuss a spread. That is kind of odd they would do that to a melee game. Before I was going with pre-patch blunderbuss which was almost identical to the pistol.



  • @djk45:

    That is kind of odd they would do that to a melee game.

    you understand my confusion and ferver



  • I agree with pretty much everything you said BB, it needs some serious work.

    Additionally, when I played two days ago I noticed twice that I was oneshot by the pistol when I was a knight. I’m not sure if I perhaps I got damaged just before, because it boggles my mind that a knight can be oneshot by a weapon with such a rapid rate of fire. Something to consider as well.



  • I think the cross hairs need to change immediately to something like in battlefield or completely remove them. It’s too easy to line up dome shots with a simple drag almost like in…COD plz god no. Damage and accuracy at long distances needs to gtfo, but pirates should have the samurai sword draw to help with rushers. I think the damage is okay to a certain degree, but the accuracy is just ridiculous. This last patch broke the game, so it’s not like I’m playing until they fix it.



  • @ubersturmfuhrer:

    I think the cross hairs need to change immediately to something like in battlefield or completely remove them.

    the crosshairs do help a lot with differentiating friend from foe, and with all the varied costumes and colors available this saves everyone a lot of team damage



  • @BB:

    @ubersturmfuhrer:

    I think the cross hairs need to change immediately to something like in battlefield or completely remove them.

    the crosshairs do help a lot with differentiating friend from foe, and with all the varied costumes and colors available this saves everyone a lot of team damage

    Well, the circle crosshair can do the same thing…turn red and display enemy name. The center of your screen doesn’t change…Also, pirates should be using the blunderbuss at close range making it even easier to determine black from pink ;)



  • Oh you mean just get rid of the crosshair altogether?
    People would just jam a thumbtack into the middle of their screen to replace it



  • Its there to tickle people at long range and to blow people to the moon at close range.

    Yes while you may hit people at range it deals very little damage. 25 per pellet. And that’s before the damage resistance everyone has. 18 damage against a spartan in the chest. 5 against his shield. Viking, samurai and knight all have better armour. Against them its even less.

    Blunderbuss fires 8 pellets per shot. Despite people’s claims it fires as many as 15.

    In a couple of alpha builds you could parry with the blunderbuss. It lead to unblockable instakill ripostes.

    There are some smart cookies that wait till you get close then fire. Trade off is you either hit full blow or miss completely at that range. And if you miss you are screwed.

    Even then its not the smartest thing to do against someone with a shield. Against a spartan it deals a grand total of 40 damage. After that they get a free hit on you. And are better suited to melee. Pirates die in 2-3 hits depending on what weapon the spartan is using. And you have been hit once already.

    Viking and knight shields I’d imagine against them even less damage. I’m guessing 4 against the Viking and 2 against the knight.

    Blunder buss seems to scare people off in mass charges against a mass group of pirates. You charge fowards shields raised and often half you team has abandoned you. Meaning less targets for the pirates to shoot and the remainder of the charge die. And then everyone thinks pirates are OP.

    The problem is people are pussies. Some loud bangs a big flinch and 10 health knocked off them and they run for cover. When they do that their shields are down too do they take full damage from projectiles.

    The blunderbuss always had a spread it was always a shotgun. Its only use was as a shotgun. The barrel is flared and too wide to fire a single shot effectively.

    Te blunderbuss is more scary than dangerous. People gotta grow some balls and charge down those pirates shields raised.



  • Lemon pls
    I could not give more of a fuck about the deets on this shit

    if you can’t find a way to make this skill based you’re going to be writing all that in the Blunders obituary

    Also the fuck?
    @lemonater47:

    Te blunderbuss is more scary than dangerous.

    did you miss the part where I mentioned it can one shot every single class?
    because it can

    you know those un-killable test dummies in Training?
    I KILLED THEM
    their heads are gone



  • @lemonater47:

    Its there to tickle people at long range and to blow people to the moon at close range.

    Yes while you may hit people at range it deals very little damage. 25 per pellet. And that’s before the damage resistance everyone has. 18 damage against a spartan in the chest. 5 against his shield. Viking, samurai and knight all have better armour. Against them its even less.

    Blunderbuss fires 8 pellets per shot. Despite people’s claims it fires as many as 15.

    In a couple of alpha builds you could parry with the blunderbuss. It lead to unblockable instakill ripostes.

    There are some smart cookies that wait till you get close then fire. Trade off is you either hit full blow or miss completely at that range. And if you miss you are screwed.

    Even then its not the smartest thing to do against someone with a shield. Against a spartan it deals a grand total of 40 damage. After that they get a free hit on you. And are better suited to melee. Pirates die in 2-3 hits depending on what weapon the spartan is using. And you have been hit once already.

    Viking and knight shields I’d imagine against them even less damage. I’m guessing 4 against the Viking and 2 against the knight.

    Blunder buss seems to scare people off in mass charges against a mass group of pirates. You charge fowards shields raised and often half you team has abandoned you. Meaning less targets for the pirates to shoot and the remainder of the charge die. And then everyone thinks pirates are OP.

    The problem is people are pussies. Some loud bangs a big flinch and 10 health knocked off them and they run for cover. When they do that their shields are down too do they take full damage from projectiles.

    The blunderbuss always had a spread it was always a shotgun. Its only use was as a shotgun. The barrel is flared and too wide to fire a single shot effectively.

    Te blunderbuss is more scary than dangerous. People gotta grow some balls and charge down those pirates shields raised.

    Hate to say it but you obviously are a player who uses the blunderbuss and finds it skillful.

    I do not understand how anyone can sit here and say hell any of the pirate guns are remotely balanced. As a Spartan (the class I pretty much always play unless its a class v class of some other sorts) it makes literally no sense why we have a minimal chance against a pirate. You proposed we put our shields up and run, here is the problem with that…

    Despite our shield being up, your hit still counts. Does it do less damage? Sure which is fucking retarded. Why we don’t block the little flintlock/blunder bullets is beyond me. After we’re hit we are knocked back and thrown out of our block. Before we can make a charge forward here comes another shot from your shit to hit us. By this time you’ve reloaded and will probably hit again.

    Lets say we do manage to make it to you. Our chances are still slim. You sit there at full health as we are now half if not below it. At this point, any old player who decides to LMB spam can win. You go into that fight as the pirate knowing you have some health ground to give. Knowing you can trade hits.

    How and the hell are they fair? Hell, think of the classes with NO shields.



  • @BB:

    Lemon pls
    I could not give more of a fuck about the deets on this shit

    if you can’t find a way to make this skill based you’re going to be writing all that in the Blunders obituary

    Also the fuck?
    @lemonater47:

    Te blunderbuss is more scary than dangerous.

    did you miss the part where I mentioned it can one shot every single class?
    because it can

    you know those un-killable test dummies in Training?
    I KILLED THEM
    their heads are gone

    Yes I know it can but did you read the part where I said shield? Takes 3 point blank shots.

    And its people with shields who are running away.

    Also large numbers without shields work. Some of you will die but they can’t kill all of you. Pirates die in 1-3 hits from things the other classes have.

    Competing play right? Communication. Group up charge forward no hesitation with any class other than the ninja and you will be victorious.



  • ranged should be harder in general



  • This weapon…… Why would they implement something which gives a sure hit, and does this amount of dmg? Only way to fix this is reduce dmg by like 50%, or make it very inaccurate.

    Also it should definitely not shoot through shields, I mean COME ON

    I can see how kids would want to buy a game where they get to be pirates, and shoot guns at knights without being able to miss, but in the long run this will hurt the playerbase more than it does good.

    PIRATES MAKES KONGEN ANGRY



  • @lemonater47:

    And if you miss you are screwed.

    Pretty hard to miss with that thing. Unless you don’t have hands, or the purpose of the crosshair is a profound mystery that continues to elude you.

    @lemonater47:

    Also large numbers without shields work.

    Exactly. Just have more people on your team. L2P etc. etc.



  • ok i played with the blunderbuss for like 5 mins

    i laughed really hard at how ridiculously easy it was to get free damage + knockback, literal point and click
    playing ranged in this game is such an awful joke it’s quite hilarious


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