Feedback on CU2 Patch 21 Beta's 1-3



  • Reduced the bubble collision by 60%
    Positives:

    • Combat is much more fluid and less bulky.
    • Team fights now allow you to hit multiple people with stabs and horizontals with much shorter weapons such as the SOW. Something i missed a lot and are very rare in the live version due to the bubble.

    Negatives:

    • Indirect buff to MAA due to their smaller weapons. However, with enough practice anyone can parry these attacks.
    • People saying attacks landing much faster. THis is due to the fact that the weapon tracers are starting much closer to you than you are used to. With quick reactions one can get used to the “new” timings.
    • Side attacks going through parries. This is remedied by looking/rotating the opposite direction of the attack and aiming your parry correctly.

    Slowed down bearded axe overhead
    Positives:

    • No more lightning attacks that phase through your late parry.

    Negatives:

    • The weapon is pointless to use now. The overhead is slower than the grand mace now and deals less damage.

    Reduce 2H flinch time to 0.8
    Positives:

    • You are now able to interrupt combo feints which was impossible to do before.
    • You feel less locked out and ready to get into the fight again.

    Negatives:

    • Certain 1 hander weapons with low windups may now be able to interrupt combos from 2 handers. (more testing on this is required) “Possible solution if this problem exists is to increase 2H flinch time to 0.9 for 1 hand users.”
    • If you drag a combo after hitting your opponent you are going to hit trade with them if they are doing a look down overhead or quick attack with <.55 windup. [This negative is acceptable in my opinion]
    • If you drag a combo after hitting your opponent you are going to get hit/flinched by someone using handle-hits with weapons such as the Grandmace, Polehammer, Halberd, ect.

    Maa Dodge stamina cost increased from 15 to 25

    Positives:

    • MAA can no longer dodge 6 times in a row

    Negatives:

    • MAA will run out of stamina faster and may hamper there ability to do well in teamfights

    Increase feint time (time between starting a feint and returning to idle) to 0.5s for combo feints for all weapons (from the default feint time, which varies by weapon from 0.2s to 0.4s)
    Positives:

    • You have more time to react and use combo feint to parry in situations.
    • Attack ->combo-> feint-> attack is nerfed and weapons like the sow that use this will need more footwork and timing for those that are fleeing away from falling for a feint.

    Negatives:

    Outlying problems i’ve noticed.

    • MAA can dodge out of flinch. Torn banner needs to address if this is an intended feature or not.
    • If a MAA dodges out of flinch he can interrupt your combo if he goes on the offensive. THis can be countered by cftp but is a very reactionary based thing to do and not many will have the foresight to do this.
    • Lag spikes are noticeable in the beta and testing is difficult to do.
    • Chase mechanic for knight never works. I think this buff’s MAA’s against knights to the point where we get a lot of MAA OP ect. If chase mechanic was reliable or knights had more speed i think a lot of this discussion about MAA would end.

    Thank you- SiN



    • Indirect buff to MAA due to their smaller weapons. However, with enough practice anyone can parry these attacks.

    If all one handed weapons can curve around parries easier, I can see a resurgence of weapons like the hatchet and mace. In all honesty, this is a good thing. Trying to drag around a MAA’s parry with a large weapon is an exercise in futility. Hopefully this brings back the option to fight MAA and shield knights effectively with short one handed weapons again.

    • People saying attacks landing much faster. THis is due to the fact that the weapon tracers are starting much closer to you than you are used to. With quick reactions one can get used to the “new” timings.

    Lookdown overheads are going to be faster than ever then. Lookdown feints might become extremely scary like they used to be.

    • Side attacks going through parries. This is remedied by looking/rotating the opposite direction of the attack and aiming your parry correctly.

    This is of course going to cause a lot of confusion to newbies, but I believe this is good as well. The more exaggerated the amount you have to turn to parry, the less room for finesse you’ll need to do it.

    • Certain 1 hander weapons with low windups may now be able to interrupt combos from 2 handers. (more testing on this is required) “Possible solution if this problem exists is to increase 2H flinch time to 0.9 for 1 hand users.”

    Has the possibility of becoming a good thing as fights with 1hers could end much more quickly. In the past, a lot of 1handers misjudged their window of opportunity after being flinched and got hit a second time which killed them, even if it was with a hit trade. That being said, the main reason combo feints are used is to kill people as quickly as possible. Unless we’re talking about a HWS stab, I don’t think combo feints have been defeated yet.

    • MAA will run out of stamina faster and may hamper there ability to do well in teamfights

    Should be lowered to 20 percent stamina per usage. Everyone wants to nerf the MAA but 4 dodges max is a little too much, considering MAA have to do things other than dodge every once in a while.

    • Attack ->combo-> feint-> attack is nerfed and weapons like the sow that use this will need more footwork and timing for those that are fleeing away from falling for a feint.

    Combo feints aren’t significantly nerfed though, are they? They will still be useful for using the same attack twice, correct?



  • I don’t see how any of the bubble negatives are negatives.
    I like how reduced 2H flinch times add depth to the combat, and you feel less limited when attacked. Afaic, the mace stab could only interrupt combos that started with an accelerated attack. I think that getting a sense of timing and distancing mid combos will be more essential now, and that’s a positive, imo. As for “drag combo will lead to hit trade if they acc. overhead”, I’m pretty sure you can react fast enough during a drag to just accelerate and cancel the attack out before the trade. Yet another beauty of Chivalry mechanics.

    The Bearded Axe I agree with you on. I never saw any good players use it though, so I probably never understood how broken it was in the first place. Everyone I saw use them always just relied on the fast overhead, and therefore sucked. I wonder how they’ll take this change.



  • ^it was just a stupid weapon, only used because of the one broken overhead, nothing else, if at all. In fact i never saw anyone use it. So i like the speed nerf, because it will have to get something different now

    Anyway the reduced 2h flinch also affects 1vN big time, getting hit in that no longer is a death sentence



  • Hater’s gonna hate about unblockable hatchets now.

    I believe this is the best patch so far.
    MAA nerf, bubble ‘nerf’, Bearded Axe users relying on the overhead finally realizing they suck and apparently outhouse guy is back.



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  • Are you sure the feint time does anything but change the animation in case you don’t attack or parry right after a feint? The only thing I saw is that it prevents twohanded combo feints from instantly teleporting your weapon back into side guard. It makes combo feints a little more readable and smoother but thats about it.

    I never had problems with those lookdown Bearded Axe guys - in fact they were very easy to parry and for some reason forgot that their were lots of faster weapons available. I hope the weapon will get some compensation in a future patch.

    As for MaA - I really wanted to see a different approach but is okay/good. They still got that long dodge even when it comes at a cost. On the other side the bubble reductions favers them more than other classes as they rely more on footwork, got an intrinsic speed advantage (which is often enough to beat your opponents) and their weapons are shorter on average (plus they got more viable choices).

    And the other bubble negatives are also no real negatives. All you need is getting used to it. Axes and curved weapons will probably become a target of hate because people instinctively aim their parry somewhere below the tip (before the weapon curves away from them) which can lead to failed parries especially on side attacks.



  • @Evil:

    Are you sure the feint time does anything but change the animation in case you don’t attack or parry right after a feint? The only thing I saw is that it prevents twohanded combo feints from instantly teleporting your weapon back into side guard. It makes combo feints a little more readable and smoother but thats about it.

    I never had problems with those lookdown Bearded Axe guys - in fact they were very easy to parry and for some reason forgot that their were lots of faster weapons available. I hope the weapon will get some compensation in a future patch.

    As for MaA - I really wanted to see a different approach but is okay/good. They still got that long dodge even when it comes at a cost. On the other side the bubble reductions favers them more than other classes as they rely more on footwork, got an intrinsic speed advantage (which is often enough to beat your opponents) and their weapons are shorter on average (plus they got more viable choices).

    And the other bubble negatives are also no real negatives. All you need is getting used to it. Axes and curved weapons will probably become a target of hate because people instinctively aim their parry somewhere below the tip (before the weapon curves away from them) which can lead to failed parries especially on side attacks.

    Bearded Axe never animated properly for me, and the feints are extremely twitchy. The overheads were just plain broken, now they can balance it properly without making it accelerate at a speed this game engine simply can’t handle.

    MAA deserved some sort of dodge change to encourage them to use dodge thoughtfully, I think 4 dodges may be too little, and 5 may be more appropriate. However, with MAA movement speed and such, we will see how 4 plays out for now.



  • @SHH_:

    MAA deserved some sort of dodge change to encourage them to use dodge thoughtfully, I think 4 dodges may be too little, and 5 may be more appropriate. However, with MAA movement speed and such, we will see how 4 plays out for now.

    Guess Torn Banner still doesn’t believe in tweaking things a bit at a time instead of giant changes. I guess since enough people complained they’re going to do a heavy nerf instead of a small one.

    Should start with 20 stam cost and then to 25 if its not enough if you really insist on nerfing dodge.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    Guess Torn Banner still doesn’t believe in tweaking things a bit at a time instead of giant changes. I guess since enough people complained they’re going to do a heavy nerf instead of a small one.

    Should start with 20 stam cost and then to 25 if its not enough if you really insist on nerfing dodge.

    They pretty quickly reverted 25 to 20, so they definitely have a willingness to adjust things on the fly.

    I don’t want MAA nerfed, I just want MAA to have to make the same choices as other classes instead of just making a mistake and then using dodge.



  • I liked 25 more - 20 feels very little and can be regenerated quite quickly similar to 15. But on the other side I would still rather have the range reduced.

    The new Bearded Axe feels nice to use and to fight again but it might have some trouble competing against the Messer and the other axe choices. I would like to know the exact new timings though.



  • :sleeping:



  • Only tested for about 15minutes against bots. The FOV’s feel nice, dont know what you did but it feels nice. Maybe next time i’ll test it out against real players.

    BTW - I tested with several fovs 95 + with some 2handers you can see your guys arms and it looks pretty terrible. AND i dont mean like a little, but like ALOT. Its like your head is inside your chest. Looks silly. (Only Tested Greatsword/Claymore) everything else looked fine.

    Good luck


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