How do I work with pylons?



  • The only way I’ve ever had the bots traverse my levels in a remotely sensible way has been with only one pylon, at the center of the level, sized up. Using several of them, as with path nodes in the base UDK editor, only results in the bots moonwalking all over the place. The few things I’ve gathered from others is that pylons should see but not intersect with each other, and that they connect either to the terrain or a static mesh. Again, this only makes the AI moonwalk. I feel I must miss something here, and I can’t find any guides whatsoever about this aspect of level creation. Does anyone have anything they could share, or some general guidelines for how to make bot navigation work?



  • they can overlap there areas, but a pylon cant be in the area of another.

    and yes i have problems with them too - i don’t use them on grail castle as they dont seem to work for different levels of the castle - the bots seem tot think they can see the bots above them or below them and get confused.

    there are settings in world properties that you can play with, though i had no real luck with those either. Oh and you seem to need pylons and apple for some reason….???



  • Apples are path nodes for base, non-Chivalry UDK, so I guess it’s not impossible that they are to be used in combination with the pylons… I’ll try it out and see if anything happens. Do the TBS maps have pylons at all? None of the levels I’ve checked seem to use them.



  • press P on the levels - when i looked the TB levels had Pylons and apples (path nodes!!! i prefer apples :-) ) - they may have changed this i haven’t heck lately. Dark forest definitely had both i remember



  • There’s an option in the world proprieties to use the navmesh (pylons) as primary and only use pathing as a fall-back but since non of the TB maps use that option I assume pylons either do nothing, or simply fill in for the pathing when it fails for some reason.


  • Developer

    Pylons are recommended for pathing. The bots do also support pathnode path finding though; we switched between the two a couple times during development for different reasons.

    If you use multiple pylons, and don’t have the ‘prioritize navmesh’ option checked in the Map Info (World Properties -> Map Info -> add an AOCMapInfo to the map), the bots may be using your pylons as path nodes, since Pylon is a subclass of NavigationPoint. That may result in what you’re seeing here.

    We’ve also found recently that navmesh pathing with multiple pylons has some odd behaviour with 32-bit servers for some reason (resulting in the pathfinding algorithm failing completely), which would also cause bots to drop to pathnode path finding.

    ALSO ALSO, just to be sure you get this: enable “Recast” on any pylons you use. Recast is a lot better than UE3’s old navmesh generator. It makes nicer, cleaner navmeshes, and makes them much faster. Coincidentally, UE3’s old navmesh generator is most of what drove us away from nav meshes the first time.



  • Well I was kind of right in the sense that I was entirely wrong. But there we go.

    Also wooo! Recast! :D



  • Thanks for the answer. I had a look at the Map info and Prioritize Navmesh was checked, the pylons I used were however not using the Recast option. In the meantime since asking I have already used the standard build in “apple” path nodes and I’ve had okay results with them, but I may go back and redo it using pylons if this would indeed improve the AI pathing.


  • Developer

    And make sure your pylons’ radii overlap too One pylon can’t be inside another pylon’s radius, but the two have to overlap for a connection between navmeshes to be made

    So:

    This is desirable; the two plyons’ areas overlap:
    ……|---------|
    …|-----|-|…|
    …|…P.|.|…P…|
    …|-----|-|…|
    …|---------|

    This results in two separate navmeshes that bots can’t path between unless there are sufficient pathnodes in the level:

    …|---------|
    …|—|.|…|
    …|.P.|.|…P…|
    …|—|.|…|
    …|---------|

    This is just no good at all, the left pylon is inside the right pylon’s area:

    .P. .P…
    ------------

    This is also no good at all for the same reason, the left pylon is inside the right’s area:
    …|-------------|
    |-|—|…|
    |.|P…|…P…|
    |-|—|…|
    …|-------------|



  • Wow, that’s great! I think I understand how I should use them now. Thanks a lot! :)



  • I used Recast, and have been 100 times better.
    But:
    When I go to world properties/World Info/My map info

    I clic on the blue triangle(create a new object) then AOCMapInfo. and click, and nothing happens.
    _(LOG say: Cmd: UpdateLandscapeSetup)
    _
    I chequed the example maps and I see the AOCMapInfo and I am be able to delete and create new ones.

    I don’t know what is happening.
    (This happens to me with atachments, I only atach objects on new maps or example maps)


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