A Request for Parries



  • Now that the bubble is reduced, people have more leeway in what kind of crazy drags and accelerated attacks they can do. Many appreciate this, though despite this, it has brought to light a flaw with the parrying mechanic.

    The actual parry-capable phase of a parry seems to initiate slightly after you’ve pressed a parry, or at least that’s how it appears to me. It may not seem like much, but this is huge. I’ve lately been finding myself parrying at seemingly the correct time only to be hit by the fastest attacks in the game after my model animates the parry. Attacks like turn accelerated spear slash ripostes and greatsword lookdown overhead ripostes now seem to hit me if I parry at the last possible moment, which is what this game has encouraged from the start. If I see myself start the parry animation before the attack connects with my player, logically I should be able to parry the attack, but not so. The only solution I’ve found is to parry early expecting these attacks, but that is a horrible solution considering the attack of the riposte could also be a stab drag.

    Nerfing the bubble reduction would be a big setback to the game, and nerfing weapons to accommodate poorly functioning mechanics is missing the point.

    My solution is to make the parry-capable state of a parry initiate immediately as the parry has been pressed. If I initiate my parry just before I see a weapon hit me, that attack should not hit me. In the current state of the game where an attack that can hit almost instantly can also be delayed for over 2 seconds, you have hardly any room for error.

    If the parry-active phase of a parry does in fact initiate immediately after the parry has been inputted by the player, then these problems are latency and/or clientside. The solutions then are to make parries have slight retroactivity somehow to let them keep up with extremely fast weapons, make the bubble bigger again (which is bad,) or to nerf attacks that are unreasonably fast (which is also another poor solution.)

    Edit: There’s an overall theme in the threads I’ve been seeing lately. Despite how the bubble reduction makes many previously useless weapons more viable, it has made accelerated attacks (in conjunction with feints even) near impossible to react to. I hate to say this but a lot of work still needs to be done. I’m almost willing to say that with the increased speed of all these different attacks, offensive feints deserve a nerf or some serious revision. Even if the aforementioned parrying issue were to be solved, it still wouldn’t help the fact that accelerated attacks in conjunction with feints are too fast to react to.



  • The actual parry-capable phase of a parry seems to initiate slightly after you’ve pressed a parry, or at least that’s how it appears to me. It may not seem like much, but this is huge.

    its called latency



  • Perhaps increase the parry window by 0.1 or 0.2 seconds, so you would feel safe to parry early on those attacks. I’ve tested parry in a LAN setting and there is no delay whatsoever, it’s just your latency.



  • @Monsteri:

    Perhaps increase the parry window by 0.1 or 0.2 seconds, so you would feel safe to parry early on those attacks. I’ve tested parry in a LAN setting and there is no delay whatsoever, it’s just your latency.

    Fuck no. Decels will be 100% useless.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    its called latency

    Actually, if you go into a private bot game and in console type “show collision” you can see the parry box and a lot of other boxes. It looks like the parry box does actually come up ever so slightly after you press the button. Latency adds a lot to this.


  • Global Moderator

    It makes parries look smoother and makes sense. People didn’t have teleporting arms back in medieval times. People don’t have teleporting arms today. It will take time to move your weapon to parry their attacks.



  • @lemonater47:

    It makes parries look smoother and makes sense. People didn’t have teleporting arms back in medieval times. People don’t have teleporting arms today. It will take time to move your weapon to parry their attacks.

    Lemonator, have you played this game long enough to know what a feint is? If so, you should realize how awful your argument was.

    Plus, the only thing I want out of parries is for them to initiate immediately after input, not for the animation to instantaneously fly into position.



  • This is a reasonably good change. TBS pls put it in the beta.



  • I wouldn’t be so lax to parry buffs, I personally don’t think they need them. The window of time for parry to become active is very, very short, I can’t remember the exact details but it’s something like .125 or a very short time frame like that.

    I do feel like there should be at least some raise time to parries, much like shield has a raise time.



  • Two things to consider:

    1. Latency does affect this, this is unfortunate and nothing can be done to change it really.

    2. There are two ways people parry without realising.A. (the most common) They press parry as soon as believe the attack is real THEN they start to move their mouse in the direction of the attack. The sequence between button push and movement is very quick, but makes a huge difference.

    B. They move the mouse in the direction of the attack THEN they push the parry button. Again, the sequence is very quick.

    Option A + latency causes a problem. If press parry then move your mouse, even though the movement is very quick, The server is instructed you pushed parry facing x+y direction, THEN it is instructed that player has turn from x+y to x1+y1. So there is a small delay, through latency into the mix and it can be all the difference. There may also be a Parry turn speed cap also, not sure.

    Option B, since the movement occurred before movement cap, then parry is pressed the server receives the player pressed parry at x1+y1 and server registered the parry as successful without further updates from the player. So in theory Option B is the better technique for parrying and can make a big difference.

    Testing it out shows that it does indeed make a difference for those split second parries, it takes a little mental discipline to make sure you do it in the correct sequence, as well as to truly asses which sequence you performed.

    edit: Typos and a few missing words, on cold+flu tablets, deal with it hehe


  • Global Moderator

    @DerFürst:

    Lemonator, have you played this game long enough to know what a feint is? If so, you should realize how awful your argument was.

    Plus, the only thing I want out of parries is for them to initiate immediately after input, not for the animation to instantaneously fly into position.

    I don’t know know what your game looks like but you can clearly seen an animation when someone feints. Its the ini edited CFtP I have a problem with as that again is teleporting arms.

    And immediately = instantaneously.



  • @lemonater47:

    I don’t know know what your game looks like but you can clearly seen an animation when someone feints. Its the ini edited CFtP I have a problem with as that again is teleporting arms.

    And immediately = instantaneously.

    And if you parry an attack within a few frames of pressing the button it doesn’t look like you parry at all.

    Instant parry. What’s the difference here?





  • The picture above is actually a good reminder of what people should be doing. That way they don’t have to spend time aiming their parry, instead they can just hit parry as they’re already looking in the right place.

    @lemonater47:

    It makes parries look smoother and makes sense. People didn’t have teleporting arms back in medieval times. People don’t have teleporting arms today. It will take time to move your weapon to parry their attacks.

    This makes me think that maybe putting in place a parry lift time and parry drop time would be a good idea. It’d be hard to adapt to at first, but i can handle it.



  • @DerFürst:

    Attacks like turn accelerated spear slash ripostes and greatsword lookdown overhead ripostes now seem to hit me if I parry at the last possible moment, which is what this game has encouraged from the start. If I see myself start the parry animation before the attack connects with my player, logically I should be able to parry the attack, but not so. The only solution I’ve found is to parry early expecting these attacks, but that is a horrible solution considering the attack of the riposte could also be a stab drag.

    This is actually the big issue with Chivalry. The fastest attacks are very close to, if not actually instant hits(windup hits, hilt/handle hits, hits “inside” of the bubble as soon as you start the attack, etc). At the same time, it is possible to start an attack that takes longer to connect than a parry will last.

    This basically removes the “skill test” part of parrying and turns it into “lets hope you correctly guessed the random upcoming attack type, because if not, it WILL connect”.
    I don’t mind the drags; its the minimum distance between “what is telegraphed” and “something has just hit you” that needs to be more consistently greater than “perceived zero” / instant to get things back into a sensible gear.

    I know this is a rare opinion to have, as such an incredibly high number of players rely on the insta-hit cheese to win their everythings.



  • I should perhaps add that I always perceived Chiv as trying to be about footwork, reach, timing and parry skill.
    Instead it has become / turned out to be a contest around who can best exploit “bubble weakness” or find nigh-unblockables, and this is a bit of a shame.
    I feel the original idea (timing, aim, reach, footwork) was/is much closer to actual medieval combat as opposed to gamey tactics.



  • @SomeDudeOnAForum:

    I should perhaps add that I always perceived Chiv as trying to be about footwork, reach, timing and parry skill.
    Instead it has become / turned out to be a contest around who can best exploit “bubble weakness” or find nigh-unblockables, and this is a bit of a shame.
    I feel the original idea (timing, aim, reach, footwork) was/is much closer to actual medieval combat as opposed to gamey tactics.

    Well when you have competitive players, the drive to win means everything. The best gamers in the world use exploits to win. In racing, you scr a pe a wall to slow down. In shooters, you utilize angles to shoot behind cover. Third-person games, you push the camera thru walls to see opponents. The list goes on and on. Hell, even MLG Halo 2 allowed button glitches. BXRs, BXBs, Quad-shots. All game breaking, all allowed cause the pros used em.

    Point - If it gives you an edge, best believe the ‘good’ players are going to use it. That being said, I do agree that the parrying got broked over the last couple of patches. The no parry window after missing an attack, the insta-hits combo’d with feints, the buggy animations, and then the latency just does not help.

    I know how to aim a parry, but when I get ovie’s going into my skull even after I watch my parry raise and blend with the opponents weapon, it just ain’t right yo.



  • I made a mod that tries to address the instant attacks issue.
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=245759061

    And it sort of works, but it also made it clearer that some “facehugging” attacks are bypassing the parrybox. An ideal solution would be to have the attacker’s arms also have tracers. And then maybe reduce the parrybox’s size a bit, to not make things too easy. I’ll try adding that to the mod in the future.



  • @Camponês:

    I made a mod that tries to address the instant attacks issue.
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=245759061

    And it sort of works, but it also made it clearer that some “facehugging” attacks are bypassing the parrybox. An ideal solution would be to have the attacker’s arms also have tracers. And then maybe reduce the parrybox’s size a bit, to not make things too easy. I’ll try adding that to the mod in the future.

    THERE’S NO SUCH THING AS INSTANT ATTACKS. EVERY SINGLE WEAPON HAS A WINDUP PERIOD. I DON’T EVEN. CAN YOU GET MORE CASUAL?



  • Do you actually play on the pubs or just that micro cave you rent? The pubs are full of insta killing crouching
    overhead vans. Unlike you always looking down your wooden noses at pub players some of us have been
    playing pubs since day of release. The stuff that goes on in some games you would not believe.