[BETA] Fortification Map Contest: Whitenest



  • Hi everyone,

    Im pleased to announce that we are presenting Whitenest for the Fortification Map Contest.

    Some of you may already know about Whitenest, we have fully updated it for the contest, here are the map details.

    Whitenest - Team Objective Siege: Steam Link

    This map represents an Agathian siege of a Mason fortress. A Mason Lord holds the castle and his forces hope that the pit and the impregnable walls will repel the attacking army. Agatha must push its siege towers over the pit, assault the fortress and use the cranks to lower the drawbridge. Once the battering ram breaks the main door, Agathians will have access to the village. After slaughtering the treacherous Mason supporters, the last step will be to finish the Mason Lord and put an end to his rule in Whitenest.

    Map objectives

    • Assault the wall with Siege Towers
    • Lower the drawbridge
    • Open the main doors with the battering ram
    • Massacre the traitors
    • Kill the Mason Lord

    Recent changes

    • Added visual content
    • Polished siege tower functionalities
    • Added bot support
    • Killing mason supporters now adds points instead of subtracting
    • Solved ramp glitch
    • Blinking HUDS when lowering drawbridge
    • KillZ volume fix
    • Several small fixes

    Now with some screenshots:









  • Glad to see this in the contest.

    My main issue with the last build I played was the walls were way too narrow. Ideally, you want enough room for two players to run side by side.

    It is most problematic as a defender, trying to move along the wall, and not being able to get around archers and other teammates.

    As others have mentioned, a toggle option for the music would be nice. I am assuming it is driven through Kismet? You could have a key press event that toggles it, and notify players through chat on Level Reset.

    An alternate path to the platform the King likes to camp on might be worth looking into as well.

    Just my thoughts on it. Looking forward to more updates!



  • One of my favourite maps, I love the natural flow and feel of the objectives and the slightly different visual style, very reminiscent of M&B.
    Glad to see the ramp glitch has been fixed. Only real issue is the castle walls could be widened a little imo.



  • Precisely the narrow corridor in consecutive fights is what makes this map a real siege with great gameplay

    Best TO.



  • Looking good so far , hoping to get in some play time on map to give some feedback. Cheers!



  • Hi again!

    Well, first deadline is approaching, we finally solved some bugs! The map has been already updated in the steam workshop, here’s the changelog:

    **Fixed:

    • King dying when Force Respawn to defend him. Now he also is moved inside the castle when the doos are broken
    • Huds not showing up marking the houses with peasants inside
    • Gate inscription not showing up

    Changed:

    • Objective chat messages show up in green**

    Although we have corrected our issues, the map loading time the first time the client enters is still very long, but its something we can’t solve. It is because the custom materials have to be compiled in the client the first time he enters the map. I only hope Torn Banner can solve it soon because many people think the map is broken.

    See you ingame!



  • The first part of this map was a lot of fun and the way you push multiple things instead of one was refreshing and helped make it a lot less boring to me. Once inside the castle walls however it was a bit more boring to me, I liked the idea of putting villagers inside of some of the buildings but several areas up on the wall felt a bit too tight. Also after completing the villagers quest I wasn’t sure what was going on the rest of the round. If the map was to bring the same fun that the first objective had it would be pretty awesome :)



  • Hi! This is the first custom map I ever played on chivalry!
    Good work!
    Kill peasants it’s a bit confusing and last part the king always go to the upper part and survive near all the times.



  • @leynadix:

    Hi! This is the first custom map I ever played on chivalry!
    Good work!
    Kill peasants it’s a bit confusing and last part the king always go to the upper part and survive near all the times.

    Yep, we received feedback that the peasants part was a bit confusing, so we added some HUDs over the houses that had the peasants inside, so people know that they have to break the doors down and kill the peasants inside.

    As for the King part… fire will make him move :D. We know this is an advantage, but its a way the king has to defend himself if he is on his own.



  • Nice to hear, I didn’t play out of test servers since contest announcement.



  • Love the map so far hope it turns out even better!



  • Aggregated feedback from the development team. If you have questions, or need clarification, please
    keep it in this thread. I will not be answering private messages. Remember, this is only Round 1,
    and nobody is out it at all.
    **

    General Map Feedback**

    • Walls are way too tight to fight on. Constantly jammed up by teammates.
    • Persistent Music needs to go, or be clearly optionally
    • Level varies between cramped and far too open depending on the objective stage.

    Objective#1

    • Siege tower collision needs drastic improvement
    • Siege tower is way too compressed.
    • Like that there are options on how to complete the objective
    • Needs to be a ground route to the wall. Archers are untouchable.
    • Capturing is unclear. Do I need two people?
    • Too open outside the wall. Too cramped on the wall.

    Objective#2

    • Solid layout.
    • Best area size of the map.
    • Goes by really fast
    • Hard to defend.

    Objective#3

    • King can camp the platform with the guitar. No reason for him to not be there always.
    • This area needs to be larger, with more ways to access it for the attacking team


  • @Andrew:

    General Map Feedback

    • Walls are way too tight to fight on. Constantly jammed up by teammates.
    • Persistent Music needs to go, or be clearly optionally
    • Level varies between cramped and far too open depending on the objective stage.

    Lets answer this feedback by parts.

    • Wall width: the introduction of narrow walls is an innovative feature that introduces more realism to the map, as it was a common aspect of medieval siege battles (plus there is no sense in enormous walls defending such a small coastal village). There is space enough for 2 players moving at a time, being a desired feature (and most of our feedback since November has proven to appreciate it).

    • Music: no other custom map, to my knowledge, has introductory, ambient and final custom music. It seems that all the effort put in composing the music and adjusting it to the average player’s taste has turned against us. We’ll try to adjust this.

    • Level area variations: the variation between open areas and narrow areas follow the logic of the objectives (field, wall, courtyard and castle). The open field gives a chance for free fights, while pushing the siege towers. Once they arrive the spawn points of the besiegers move forward reducing time spent running across the field. The battle on top of the wall has its own logic and gives the chance for new unseen fights.



  • @Andrew:

    Objective#1

    • Siege tower collision needs drastic improvement
    • Siege tower is way too compressed.
    • Like that there are options on how to complete the objective
    • Needs to be a ground route to the wall. Archers are untouchable.
    • Capturing is unclear. Do I need two people?
    • Too open outside the wall. Too cramped on the wall.

    Objective#2

    • Solid layout.
    • Best area size of the map.
    • Goes by really fast
    • Hard to defend.

    Objective#3

    • King can camp the platform with the guitar. No reason for him to not be there always.
    • This area needs to be larger, with more ways to access it for the attacking team

    Objectives:

    • Siege tower collision can be smoother in some specific point, but “drastic improvement”??… what does that mean?

    • Tower size serves to its purpose, as not much fighting goes on inside of it (we adjusted the ramp height a meter over the wall so Masons dont come from above when open).

    • Archers being untouchable on the wall is seen in Stonehills defence of the gate against the ram and has its logic (wall shouldn´t be accessible until the siege towers are placed, otherwise what is the sense of bringing them in and not directly capturing the cranks). Moreover, this advantage for defending team is compensated by besieging archers shooting from the top of the siege towers.

    • “Capturing is unclear. Do I need two people?” Are you kidding me?? The simultaneous capture of 2 cranks is quite evident with 2 HUDs and is seen in Darkforest’s sewers objective… (sigh)

    • The final Castle has 3 ways of access and was rather easy to attack until we set the force respawn to defend the King. We agree in the fact that the King’s chance to camp the platform with the guitar should be adjusted.

    I appreciate the feedback effort and I give congrats to the winners, but I feel that maps using fully custom assets or elements (not necessarily ours, as there is plenty of interesting ones in the contest) have been tossed aside. We take into account your indications and will be fighting to come across the next round.



  • Corsario, I agree with some of your responses. I’ve played Whitenest a lot, and one of my favorite things about this map is that the walls are so thin that a single knight with a tower shield can be an absolute monster to behold, something that just isn’t seen in Chivalry. What I think might help with the congestion on the walls is creating shortcuts off of the wall (like a hole from a random catapult strike) from the far left and far right posts of the wall. Primarily the issue with congestion stems from players trying to exit the wall, and players trying to defend the wall. Create a path for players exiting the wall that doesn’t directly interfere with players defending the wall. The Agathians invading the wall should be a heavily congested fight, I like that about it. There are a ton of unique tactics seen thanks to the absolutely debilitating lack of space.

    I agree that players should not be able to access the wall without the siege towers. Torn Banner, you know this isn’t really a con to the map as it is a feature on Stoneshill and it isn’t always best for an archer to sit on the wall where he cannot be touched (and likely won’t hit any enemies either…).

    The music needs to be toggleable. I like the music, it’s a bit repetitive, but it needs toggling. Also the music is far too loud at the beginning of the map.

    The third objective in the town, peasants are too hard to defend. They die very easily, and while you did try to curb this by placing doors, there’s just too many areas to defend at once, causing players to run around everywhere and not being able to defend any of the peasants in the end.

    I do not remember if you have two floating blue markers indicating to stand on each side, but this objective is seen in Dark Forest, and it’s a fine objective.

    All in all good map, work hard to change these things, and maybe make the layout a bit more interesting. I know that sounds vague.



  • Thanks Gauntlet. We take into account your idea of the shortcuts to relief the congestion (without affecting the main part of the battle which should be based on narrow fighting). The catapult strike with debri underneath is a good and accurate option to open a way out for those who want to jump to the field.
    The peasants objective was initially thought as a transition objective, in order to balance the hard and time consuming fighting on the wall. We’ll see what we can do about it, together with the King camping the platform problem.
    Music and overall layout/graphics will be tweaked as soon as we gather some time.
    As said, thanks for the feedback!



  • Yeah I don’t really understand how TornBanner comes up with some of this feedback. Its like they are just pointing out things about your map, but then they say its a bad feature.

    You deliberately built it to be tight corridors on the wall. Its interesting.

    Any way, at least you got feedback on your map, I did not even get feedback on mine, almost as if it was completely overlooked. Upsetting.



  • I have probably played this map more than all of the other maps (with a decent amount of players 16+) and everyone seems to enjoy, including myself, it’s a “short but sweet” type of map. But the biggest complaint I see online is about how tight the walls are.

    I have to agree that the walls are way too narrow, it creates congestion and frustration amongst players.
    While I personally think the walls are fine (realistically), however gameplay wise, I find myself getting annoyed at archers who stand smack bang in the middle of the wall and you need to kick them out of the way, then when you do, they go all crazy and angry and go on a TK’ing rampage (not all of them, some just apologize for being in the way).
    I think if it was slightly wider, enough to fit 3 people side by side, or enough so that if one person stood in the middle, players could run around him/her, that would be really good. This could be done by making the crenelations thinner if you did not wish to change the entire wall width, or if you want to keep the crenelations the same thickness, I would overhang them inwards from the wall, that way you don’t have to move anything at the base of the wall and re-adjust the level accordingly, however it might look a bit strange or unrealistic. (But lets be honest…2 siege towers and a battering ram with 16 people attacking a fortresss isn’t realistic either. On that note, I would love to see a battle with 64-128 players on this map hahaha :D

    I also found it frustrating having to run from the other side of the town all the way to the gate whenever I died.
    I am trying to think of ways to improve upon that without drastically changing the layout of the map, but i’m finding it difficult.

    Other than that, I do enjoy this map when it is on. The attackers pretty much always win, but it feels like a big struggle for them to win at times (unless the king player is just terrible like the last time I played, the king died almost immediately lol).

    Will you continue to work on this map? Or will you do something else for round 2 of the contest?