Handle hits should NOT cause flinch



  • Per thread title: Handle hits should NOT cause flinch

    I think this is the easiest option for TBS in terms of work that they’d have to do.

    My reasoning for this solutions is that often with handle hits they connect during the transitional phase of windup -> release and at this point in the swing there is minimal force behind the swing. In reality you could easily overpower someone in that position.

    So if TBS are unwilling to remove the damage 100% of handle hits (be it through tracer mod or not) than they should do this. (I don’t see TBS doing more complicated solutions since this seems like an easy fix which would be fun)



  • An interesting idea to remedy them, but in the end I think they should just shorten the tracers a bit so that the handles don’t act as the blade.



  • Was thinking about this earlier. Except I was toying with the idea of them not causing flinch, doing reduced damage, and the tip of the weapon still being able to hit in the same swing after the handle hit. Only on polearms of course. Handle hits on maul and gmace are completely fucked.



  • I think this is the easiest option for TBS in terms of work that they’d have to do.

    My reasoning for this solutions is that often with handle hits they connect during the transitional phase of windup -> release and at this point in the swing there is minimal force behind the swing. In reality you could easily overpower someone in that position.

    So if TBS are unwilling to remove the damage 100% of handle hits (be it through tracer mod or not) than they should do this. (I don’t see TBS doing more complicated solutions since this seems like an easy fix which would be fun)



  • Realism means nothing. Make a balance argument.



  • I always saw handle hits as quick powerful jabs that were more intended to cause an opponent to flinch more than a realistic attempt to cause damage.



  • That is initially what i though, but the animations as they are (half way between windup and release) suggest that the attacking player is in a position of weakness rather than doing a quick jab or pommel bash or blunt shaft thrust.



  • Interesting, but I think the programming would be far more difficult than you think where as slightly reducing the swing trace is truly the simple solution from a DEV perspective. But then again, I don’t see them as much as a problem as those that are parading around on that bandwagon.



  • How about no lets find another solution?

    Deal a smaller amount of blunt damage. A bit less than a quarter staff. Causes flinch and acts like a one hand axe boop.



  • You’re asking for a global nerf to Maul, Gmace, and all polearms. People would just facehug and they wouldn’t be able to do anything about it. Instead of nerfing weapons, how about you just raise the tracers farther up on the handle on the worse weapons.



  • @Flippy:

    You’re asking for a global nerf to Maul, Gmace, and all polearms. People would just facehug and they wouldn’t be able to do anything about it. Instead of nerfing weapons, how about you just raise the tracers farther up on the handle on the worse weapons.

    Well they could switch to their secondary weapon as it’s intended to be used for? I’m all for it.



  • @Tyoson:

    Well they could switch to their secondary weapon as it’s intended to be used for? I’m all for it.

    While you’re switching to your secondary, the enemy would have initiative, get a free hit for doing no work, (maybe even 2 free hits with faster weapons) and you’d be stuck using a shitty weapon against a much stronger weapon. Hooray for balance.



  • @Flippy:

    While you’re switching to your secondary, the enemy would have initiative, get a free hit for doing no work, (maybe even 2 free hits with faster weapons) and you’d be stuck using a shitty weapon against a much stronger weapon. Hooray for balance.

    Well that’s sort of your fault for letting them get too close.



  • I’m not in favour of changing anything to create special hit categories for handles. All I want is for the weapon in question to be in a reasonable position when I get struck by it (i.e. not facing the wrong direction). I don’t care if I’m technically hit by the actual shaft of the weapon… that’s fine.

    Hopefully moving the tracers a bit further up the shaft would accomplish this?



  • @Tyoson:

    Well that’s sort of your fault for letting them get too close.

    There’s nothing you can reasonably do preventing them from getting to close. If they sprint and parry your attack any class can and will immediately sprint into facehug range.



  • Buff fast kick, that would solve the problem you mentioned.
    But to be honest i think making the handle/shaft/etc do blunt damage would be tricksy and then you have the issue that flippy has talked about - people face hugging to try and negate maul/gmace etc.
    This is why i suggested just remove the flinch, but keep the damage. So the deterrent of the damage is there, but if you find yourself in the position that you’re being hit with the shaft at least you won’t be flinched which to me doesn’t make any sense (as described earlier in the thread) .



  • Biased vote. I think they should flinch otherwise facehug fights would become very strange hittrade mashing but their damage should be greatly reduced. So I voted for the second option even if “leave them alone” is not the right thing to do.



  • @giantyak:

    Buff fast kick, that would solve the problem you mentioned.
    But to be honest i think making the handle/shaft/etc do blunt damage would be tricksy and then you have the issue that flippy has talked about - people face hugging to try and negate maul/gmace etc.
    This is why i suggested just remove the flinch, but keep the damage. So the deterrent of the damage is there, but if you find yourself in the position that you’re being hit with the shaft at least you won’t be flinched which to me doesn’t make any sense (as described earlier in the thread) .

    You very rarely have the stam to perform very many kicks in a comp game.

    Nerfing handle damage and making them not flinch (just those 2 options) would make people get really really close and just swing. They take quarterstaff damage and get a free hit on an opponent stuck in release and who doesn’t have to tools to keep distance.

    Not an ideal option.



  • @Evil:

    Biased vote. I think they should flinch otherwise facehug fights would become very strange hittrade mashing but their damage should be greatly reduced. So I voted for the second option even if “leave them alone” is not the right thing to do.

    I would choose riposte over hit trade. I think you’d only see mish-mash hit trading in nub fights. They’d learn quickly.



  • whats wrong with handle hits not doing damage at all?

    don’t block the sword block the handle!..… should be something I hope I never have to say


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