What's the Point of Broadhead Arrow?



  • Broadhead is good against light classes, Bodkin is good against heavy classes. That’s the idea. But is it really like this? Let’s compare broadhead to bodkin Arrow:

    (Longbow)

    Broadhead: 75 dmg (swing)
    Bodkin: 75 dmg (pierce)

    Damge to Knight:
    Broadhead: 30 (head: 45) 3 hits or 3 headshots
    Bodkin: 38 (head: 56) 3 hits or 2 headshots

    Damage to Vanguard:
    Broadhead: 45 (head: 68) 3 hits or 2 headshots
    Bodkin: 60 (head: 90) 2 hits or 2 headshots

    Damage to MAA:
    Broadhead: 64 (head: 96) 2 hits or 2 headshots
    Bodkin: 64 (head 96) 2 hits or 2 headshots

    Damage to Archer:
    Broadhead: 75 (head: 113) 2 hits or 1 headshot
    Bodkin: 68 (head: 101) 2 hits or 1 headshot

    So, only at fighting Archers broadhead is actually better, because MMA isn’t effected by damage type at all, BUT when it comes to killing bodkin is always better or at least as good as broadhead (same goes for Shortbow). The only time I see broadhead being preferable to bodkin is when using Warbow (one hits Archers with broadhead) and intending to especially focus on Archers. This is a really special use so in most cases Bodkin is the way to go. This leads to the question: What’s the point of broadhead arrow anyway? Is it intended to stay that way? Because I don’t see this mechanic being useful at all. Either MMA should be more effected by swing damage, or you could introduce a difference in headshot damage: Increase broadhead damage to 85 and decrease broadhead headshot damage to 125%, or something like this.



  • Broadhead Arrow does need some tweaks. I’ve mentioned MAA modifiers somewhere else contributing to lot of issues including this one, but I was also thinking Broadhead should provide a significant larger ammo count compared to Bodkin, for example 30, compared to 20 Bodkin as it takes more arrows to take down a Knight and a Vanguard.



  • I too am concerned about arrow types. Maybe a Dev could chime in?



  • Giving broadhead more ammo is just as admitting it is actually weaker rather than being a sidegrade it is intended to be.



  • But it’s not really, Broadhead arrows are the only arrows that have a chance to one hit kill Archers and MAA (in theory, when MAA modifiers are sorted), Bodkin can never do that. The point behind more ammo is that it takes an extra shot compared to Bodkin arrows vs the Knights and Vanguard, unless you deliver head shots, and because it takes so many arrows assuming you’re perfectly accurate (and no one is), the extra ammo count somewhat balances it out.

    You’d take Bodkin if you’re fairly accurate, and want to dispatch the heavy classes quickly, but you’d have less arrows, so missing takes 1/20 of your ammo and you will always have to 2 hit lighter classes.

    Broadhead provides more ammo if you miss a lot, but if you are good with accuracy, you’re rewarded with one hit kills on the lighter classes, but the downside is it takes longer to kill heavier classes in almost all cases - but you do have more ammo! The idea behind it is that if you’re fighting predominately VG/Knights, Bodkin is the way to go, but there is still that ammo count there if you’d rather take higher ammo. So essentially there’s two choices to make on the battlefield depending on how many of each opponent there is, not just one.

    Well, that’s just the way I see it anyway.



  • According to the chart, bodkin can 1 hit Archers as well. I think broadhead should be the only arrow type that can OHK on headshots to archers and MAA. That would give it a purpose.



  • damage difference is more noticeable when using a warbow.



  • Balancing every bow with every arrow with modifiers is a pain the ass in all honesty. I’d almost suggest a damage table solely for Archers ranged weapons so we have full control over the exact damages just for this issue!

    i.e

    BodkinArcher (90,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(90,0,0,0)
    BodkinMAA (0,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(90,0,0,0)
    BodkinVanguard (100,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(100,0,0,0)
    BodkinKnight (0,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)
    BroadArcher (100,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(100,0,0,0)
    BroadMAA (100,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(100,0,0,0)
    BroadVanguard (90,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(90,0,0,0)
    BroadKnight (0,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)(0,0,0,0)

    Where 0s represent head, torso, arms, legs in that order. One set per bow.

    Obviously, I’m not a coder so I don’t know what it involves, it takes time, and there are more important bugs and issues to be be resolved first, but just putting it on the table anyway.



  • Honestly - I hope they scrap the different damage vs. different classes completely for arrows. It’s not really an interesting gameplay mechanic at all. And it has no basis in reality on top of that - bodkin arrows beyond point blank range were no better at penetrating plate armor than broadheads, but broadheads created significantly larger wounds on any enemy lightly armored enough to actually let an arrow penetrate. Bodkins were used because they were much cheaper and quicker to produce and the lethality was usually enough anyway - even if it doesn’t kill you outright, it’s very difficult to continue fighting once you’ve got an arrow in your chest.

    I’d much prefer it to be broadheads are the higher damage arrow and bodkins are faster and have a straighter flight trajectory, while both do piercing. That’s not only more realistic, but gives actual variety between arrow choices; compensate for a shortbow’s low damage with broadheads or make it extremely accurate up close with bodkins; turn your warbow into a mid-range one hit killer against light classes or turn it into a medieval sniper rifle.



  • @SlyGoat:

    Honestly - I hope they scrap the different damage vs. different classes completely for arrows. It’s not really an interesting gameplay mechanic at all. And it has no basis in reality on top of that - bodkin arrows beyond point blank range were no better at penetrating plate armor than broadheads, but broadheads created significantly larger wounds on any enemy lightly armored enough to actually let an arrow penetrate. Bodkins were used because they were much cheaper and quicker to produce and the lethality was usually enough anyway - even if it doesn’t kill you outright, it’s very difficult to continue fighting once you’ve got an arrow in your chest.

    I’d much prefer it to be broadheads are the higher damage arrow and bodkins are faster and have a straighter flight trajectory, while both do piercing. That’s not only more realistic, but gives actual variety between arrow choices; compensate for a shortbow’s low damage with broadheads or make it extremely accurate up close with bodkins; turn your warbow into a mid-range one hit killer against light classes or turn it into a medieval sniper rifle.

    +1



  • Indeed +1, SlyGoat that is a great suggestion.



  • @SlyGoat:

    Honestly - I hope they scrap the different damage vs. different classes completely for arrows. It’s not really an interesting gameplay mechanic at all. And it has no basis in reality on top of that - bodkin arrows beyond point blank range were no better at penetrating plate armor than broadheads, but broadheads created significantly larger wounds on any enemy lightly armored enough to actually let an arrow penetrate. Bodkins were used because they were much cheaper and quicker to produce and the lethality was usually enough anyway - even if it doesn’t kill you outright, it’s very difficult to continue fighting once you’ve got an arrow in your chest.

    I’d much prefer it to be broadheads are the higher damage arrow and bodkins are faster and have a straighter flight trajectory, while both do piercing. That’s not only more realistic, but gives actual variety between arrow choices; compensate for a shortbow’s low damage with broadheads or make it extremely accurate up close with bodkins; turn your warbow into a mid-range one hit killer against light classes or turn it into a medieval sniper rifle.

    +0.75

    Also, Martin’s idea of ammo difference is also a very good idea. (+0.25 for martin).


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