I think that vanguards are OP.



  • I think they’re OP.

    Specifically, sword-wielding vanguards.

    More specifically, claymore wielding vanguards.

    I don’t know if anyone else will echo my sentiments, and I don’t quite know how to go about this, so I’ll just make a list of reasons why I think they’re OP.

    Stamina- I think that they have too much of it. They can swing about wildly for several seconds and then still have enough stamina to engage an enemy without even getting staggered after several hits. It’s ridiculous.

    Speed of Attack- When they get to combo’ing and dragging (just wait till they start feinting) it’s bloody impossible to tell where a strike is aimed, coming from, etc. They drag all the way out of your parry, back in, and still have enough of their swing left to hit you afterwards.

    Lately, I’ve fought them and they manage to hit me before the animation has even begun. This is especially prevalent with the overhead and stab combos (no, ping was not an issue- we were twenty points away from each other, around 60 (me) and 40 (vanguard)).

    Dragging- Jesus Christ. How the hell do they manage to extend the life of their swings like that? Look-downs are nearly unblockable if they get to facehugging you, which is really hard to avoid unless you’re another vanguard or a knight with a bastard sword/poleax.

    That’s all I can come up with now. I expect I’ll hear a fair amount of “git gud” bullshit, but I also hope to hear some arguments or insight into what I think is a problem. It’s really getting old seeing swarms of epileptic, grazing, back-breaking vanguards turning the entire battlefield into a wanton meatgrinder.

    Dear God have mercy on me…



  • Vanguards ain’t OP. They’re just strong in pubs because they’re mobile and do high damage so they get a lot of kills since bad players can’t parry.



  • Feint stab spam with a sow, we’ll see how powerful vannies really are



  • That being said, GS needs a rather large nerf, and I’d argue Brandi needs a few adjustments as well.

    Polehammer lookdowns should be fixed a bit, too easy to trade for the damage it does.

    Claymore should be made actually viable, instead of gimmicky and poorly animated.

    Other than that, vanguard is ok.



  • Brandi needs to be removed imo. Maybe if you significantly reduce the damage of the swipe it might be OK.

    Greatsword only needs a overhead windup increase from .5 to .6.

    Claymore is fine how it is. It needs to be fast to make it different from the other weapon and is good for clipping back dodging MAA’s. To fight the claymore you have to understand that its primary strength is speed. Parry it, but don’t riposte, then take control with feints and movement. Try not to let him be in a position where he can effectively feint you.
    Shield works well against claymore as you can block him and his feints and feint him back. Or as knight, pick out a SoW and hit trade him with stabs.

    Or as vanguard choose a longer range weapon like the spear or zwei and out range him.

    As MAA you just have to dodge his shit.

    As archer … well you deserve to die for letting him get close (or just shortsword his arse).



  • @SHH_:

    That being said, GS needs a rather large nerf, and I’d argue Brandi needs a few adjustments as well.

    Polehammer lookdowns should be fixed a bit, too easy to trade for the damage it does.

    Claymore should be made actually viable, instead of gimmicky and poorly animated.

    Other than that, vanguard is ok.

    This. Although polehammer lookdowns were pretty much fixed in the handle hit patch I would imagine. I haven’t fought any since then though so I’m not sure.



  • Pretty much what the others said already.
    Vanguard himself isn’t OP, it’s just his poorly animated Claymore and his retarded Greatsword that can both drag as one of the best weapons and is capable of near-instant lookdowns.

    I don’t even fight against Greatswords anymore. There’s absolutely no fun in doing so, and I pretty much despise people who go around servers looking for a duel with their Greatsword. They try something else and –-surprise! Hard time scoring a kill!



  • Vans are op unless your a clan queen. When it comes to who is op its the pub players who must be taken seriously by TB.
    what the clan pond life fails to filter is were happy pub players are so is the cash. A happy pub player will buy games
    and all the goodies afterwards. The clan pond thingybobs once they master the game infact don’t bring in any income
    for TB. Hence they should have Two versions the generic pub Chivalry mode. The Veteran clan Chivalry mode were
    swift changes or patches can be rush through to suit the clan community. A pub player has the choice to cross over
    once the skills are present if they choose. Back in the day I do recall…



  • lag hakn fagy vanguards w/ 12 ft swords in this nerfest molasis game
    come to ~RD~ MODDED MATRIX MAYHEM to xperiens real hardcore gamepaly



  • @Karasu:

    This. Although polehammer lookdowns were pretty much fixed in the handle hit patch I would imagine. I haven’t fought any since then though so I’m not sure.

    Personally, I think polehammers are more or less okay as they are now. Back before the patch, they were definitely my favourite weapon to run as a vanguard as the stab->lookdown overhead combo was insanely quick and could take out many knights before they realised what hit them. It’s much easier to parry that now, so in that regard I think they’re okay. The point they make about being able to trade is true to an extent, but I don’t see it happen very often, either for myself or those I’ve played against.



  • Brandistock and Greatsword both have the same problem. They have attacks that are too fast for their damage.
    Brandislash is plain retarded if he vanguard knows how to accell it correctly. I AM NOT SURE but doesnt brandislash 3 shot knights? Same as u would overhead them with gs.
    Greatsword just is the easiest wep in the game because of the overhead that is way too fast for its damage again.



  • I think knights should get reduced damage from projectiles to put them on par with vanguards.



  • @Bluebeard:

    I AM NOT SURE but doesnt brandislash 3 shot knights?

    It does if you score one headshot.
    38 on head + 31 torso + 31 torso = 100



  • @rumpelstiltskin:

    It does if you score one headshot.
    38 on head + 31 torso + 31 torso = 100

    ‘‘Hey lets make brandistock slash retarded fast and give it same HtK as Longsword overheads’’ - Torn Banner Balance committee June 2012



  • @Bluebeard:

    ‘‘Hey lets make brandistock slash retarded fast and give it same HtK as Longsword overheads’’ - Torn Banner Balance committee June 2012

    It’s also a lot longer and has shitton of knockback so you can’t even riposte from it most of the time.

    It’s balanced because spears have no combos, huehue.



  • In general I would rather fight against a claymore user than a GS or brandistock. Brandi slash should be knocked down to 40 damage or something.



  • @dudeface:

    In general I would rather fight against a claymore user than a GS or brandistock. Brandi slash should be knocked down to 40 damage or something.

    Huh. I’ve seen a lot of people complaining about the brandis, but I personally have no trouble countering them- they follow pretty predictable motions and the animations sync properly. I suspect that the issue with some of the two-hander swords is that their tracers aren’t syncing up with where the game says they are. If the claymore blade was actually where you saw it, it might be possible to parry- but a lot of the time, it’s still finishing the previous combo before it even hits you.



  • Vans are op unless your a clan queen. When it comes to who is op its the pub players who must be taken seriously by TB.

    I find Knight class to be best in general on pubs. They soak up all that team damage rather well, have good stamina and can dish out damage reasonable well. That being said the class I choose is heavily influenced by what the enemy team and my team is made up of, and by the general rank distribution.

    I hate fighting the Brandi against good people. Even more so if they feint. I have no mercy versing Brandis and will use everything at my disposal to remove them. That thing does far far too much damage for its range and speed, particularly the swipe. It is the swipe that makes it a broken weapon, does far too much damage.



  • @Toll:

    I find Knight class to be best in general on pubs. They soak up all that team damage rather well, have good stamina and can dish out damage reasonable well. That being said the class I choose is heavily influenced by what the enemy team and my team is made up of, and by the general rank distribution.

    I hate fighting the Brandi against good people. Even more so if they feint. I have no mercy versing Brandis and will use everything at my disposal to remove them. That thing does far far too much damage for its range and speed, particularly the swipe. It is the swipe that makes it a broken weapon, does far too much damage.

    I take it back. Holy shit, the knockback on that weapon is ridiculous. The knockback might as well double its range. Jesus Christ.



  • @Carolean:

    I take it back. Holy shit, the knockback on that weapon is ridiculous. The knockback might as well double its range. Jesus Christ.

    yeh if you thought the brandi isn’t a problem for you to counter, the brandi user ain’t doin it right.


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