A few weapons that need addressing.



  • I feel the Halberd is still just a shitty version of the Zweihander at the moment.

    Wait what? Scrim us against RAW BONER’s Halberd. Halberd is still really strong.



  • Yeah I’ve played Raw Boner and he dances really well with it. He also can wreck me with a flail with his eyes closed. Someone playing a weapon well doesn’t make the weapon good; the tracers are still off and the stab still sucks.



  • I agree with most of your points, however I believe the warhammer would need more than a range buff to make it not trash. I’m thinking a buff to its stab speed would help it a lot, as it doesn’t really have any attacks that can reliably flinch people and avoid hit trades and fast, weak stabs are pretty common among blunt weapons in this game.



  • @AmishInsurgent:

    Yeah I’ve played Raw Boner and he dances really well with it. Someone playing a weapon well doesn’t make the weapon good; the tracers are still off and the stab still sucks.

    The stab can be dragged like a motherfucker and the tracers are fine, the animations are just janky.

    Someone playing a weapon well doesn’t make the weapon good

    But Halberd is good. Otherwise it wouldn’t have been the go-to vanguard weapon for months. The only reason people don’t use it as much anymore is because you can’t do the bullshit lookdowns which people constantly crutched on to make it useful, but you can still accelerate it just fine.



  • @Shard:

    Fix: Remove the speed bonus that 1H weapons gain from shields + nerf the overall speed of the hatchet by a bit + Remove the dodge out of flinch on MaA.

    TB needs to do something about attacking after bypassing flinch via dodge. So annoying when people use this crap + buckler hatchet without any shame.



  • @Flippy:

    The stab can be dragged like a motherfucker and the tracers are fine, the animations are just janky.

    But Halberd is good. Otherwise it wouldn’t have been the go-to vanguard weapon for months. The only reason people don’t use it as much anymore is because you can’t do the bullshit lookdowns which people constantly crutched on to make it useful, but you can still accelerate it just fine.

    The halberd isn’t good. There is no reason to use it other than for fun compared to essentially all the other vanguard weapons. It is supposed to be a primarily stabbing weapon as it is described yet the stab is extremely weak compared to other weapons… Furthermore, as Amish said, I don’t think you realize exactly how annoying it is to stab someone with the halberd and have it not connect with the opponent’s hitbox because the tracers are off. You end up scratching your head in confusion as you see the shaft of the halberd sticking through the middle of your opponent’s chest yet no damage has been dealt. As for your claim that everyone used it before and it was such a good weapon well yes because that was before the halberd was nerfed immensely because it was broken at the time and all of its stats were unreasonably superior to most other weapons at the time similar to the sword of war pre patch a while back. You can’t claim that because it was a go-to weapon then means that it is a great or good weapon now, that is a merely stupid assumption to make. They nerfed the weapon and left it to die so to speak as the vanguard sword weapons took over and began to dominate the play-style of almost every vanguard in the game with a small exception with the brandistock. Sure I can do well with the halberd or so can Raw; however, it does not excuse it for being a poor weapon compared to the others with a broken tracer and incredibly weak stab alongside a strangely allotted long windup that is longer than the maul’s which makes absolutely no sense. This means halberd users get flinched more easily with little profit in risking completing the stab with such little damage being dealt from it. There is no argument that the halberd is a “good” weapon in comparison to the others of the vanguard class on average.



  • I agree with everything except the messer portion. I find that the messer is a really balanced weapon and should be left as is. Of course I have some bias as it is my primary weapon of choice; however, this also means the messer is essentially the only weapon I have used for the majority of my thousand hours spent in-game. So, as an experienced player with the messer I can assure you that it does not outclass the sword of war or the longsword. It is also a very weak weapon against MAA, Archers, or knights/ vanguards using secondaries or fast weapons like the sword of war. It is incredibly easy to get flinched with the messer as that is all I seem to get even when the blade is inside the forehead of my opponent on an overhead attack. Furthermore, an experienced messer player knows how annoying those lovely sword of war repostes or feint to stabs are because after attacking or blocking the recovery time on the messer more often than not simply can’t keep up with the speed of the sword of war or other attacks akin to its stab speed. Often you will find playing against the sword of war or fast weapons a game of defense rather than offense because you can’t risk being flinched or else you are locked into death or serious injury via combo attacks that your parry windows can’t keep up with. Also, its swings are slow and easy to block even when dragged or manipulated an experienced player usually doesn’t have trouble with blocking messer attacks. The only hits you will land are from footwork, ducking, and maybe a lucky reverse overhead or lmb acceleration at just the right moment which I find to be fair and highly dependent on skill rather than the weapon itself.

    Compared to the longsword, the messer has almost no chance against it in a duel with two experienced players. Sure the longsword may be weaker but holy cow the drags and accelerations you can perform with that sucker are insane due to its long release time and boost in range compared to the messer. The longsword will instantly hit you one attack and then outdrag your delayed parry on another and land a nice overhead into your face followed by a lovely helicopter overhead twirl from several meters away that somehow always hits your baby toe when you step into range to attack when you thought your opponent’s swing was over.

    The messer is slow. It hits hard as it should, but it is fair. If you allow yourself to panic parry or miss your swing or even hit trade which shouldn’t be hard to avoid as it is so incredibly easy to flinch a messer swing that isn’t a reverse overhead, then you deserve taking the hit as that is a mistake on your part. The messer’s range is nothing to brag about and on the contrary it cannot two hit knights with a shot to the head and one to the body it only two hits on a double overhead to the head. That’s it. That rarely occurs. It is a very small target and the hits need to be landed before a few seconds of health recovery otherwise it is usually a three hit kill on knights. As for the lmb one hitting men at arms, that is fair especially since maa will stam lock you for missing swings in a heartbeat and work right through your parries when they hit you in recovery. And against vanguards the messer barely keeps up thanks to the two hit kills on them because again it will drain your stam as you miss any swings which often happens against the long vanguard weapons that can hit you and cause knockback meanwhile you can’t reach them due to the messer’s very limited range. Another drawback is the messer stab which is one of the worst in the game compared to the sword of war’s which cant two shot vanguards. In sum, I refuse your belief that the messer is superior to the sword of war and longsword and rather instill my own belief through many hours of experience that it is a very balanced weapon especially after they cleaned up the animations on it and removed much of every weapons ability to deal insta-handle hits.



  • I don’t think messer needs a nerf and I don’t think flail is that bad. The windup is a little too slow, but the shield stab makes up for it and it has some decent damage and even some draggability.



  • @rumpelstiltskin:

    TB needs to do something about attacking after bypassing flinch via dodge. So annoying when people use this crap + buckler hatchet without any shame.

    Le Francais Men at Armeeeeeees



  • @Afinity
    Respect for the post you left, i don’t feel brandi needs a nerf, it’s just that not many people use it so they are not used to the animations, i read brandies quite easily, i think it’s a balanced weapon as is.
    A nerf to the slash would warrant a buff in other sections, and i agree that spears shouldn’t be used for slashing though (obvious).
    @AmishInsurgent
    I said the stamina drain on these weapons is retarded for the reach,speed and damage they posses and it really is.
    Halberd is right behind maul on the stamina drain and the Polehammer is right behind the halberd i think.
    @Xanith
    Well, a start would be a buff to the Range.
    Also, i don’t think that Maces and blunt weapons were meant nor used for Stabbing.
    I already hate the fact that the most used attack on all 3 secondary maces is the stab.



  • as far as archer primaries the only way archers are going to use anything other than warbow and crossbow/heavyxbow is when the 1hit kill archer duel meta goes away

    there is no other way to balance it

    warbow is good all around and one shots archers so its the natural choice

    crossbow is much much stronger than warbow but its a bit slow and leaves you vulnerable to archers so its not as popular despite being much stronger, the headshots are brutal with it



  • The stab can be dragged like a motherfucker

    Oh please. The halberd has the 2nd lowest release time used in the game.

    and the tracers are fine, the animations are just janky.

    I don’t want to get into semantics. You can easily see in the video I posted that the animations do not align with the tracers. The animations actually hit the center mark unlike the tracers that do not.

    But Halberd is good. Otherwise it wouldn’t have been the go-to vanguard weapon for months. The only reason people don’t use it as much anymore is because you can’t do the bullshit lookdownswhich people constantly crutched on to make it useful, but you can still accelerate it just fine.

    Before lookdowns were removed there weren’t many halberd users. The halberd isn’t about lookdowns; Other weapons that do more damage are.

    I don’t know if you’re just arguing for the sake of arguing but come on man. I write a list of reasons why (as well as post 2 videos) I feel the weapon needs some adjustment and you argue back with “this person can play it just fine”. I know there are weapons in this game that need major adjustments but at the same time other weapons shouldn’t be excluded from from fixing because it isn’t as serious of a problem. I personally have a lot of experience playing with the halberd and that’s why I’m putting my opinions out there.



  • @AmishInsurgent:

    Oh please. The halberd has the 2nd lowest release time used in the game.

    I don’t want to get into semantics. You can easily see in the video I posted that the animations do not align with the tracers. The animations actually hit the center mark unlike the tracers that do not.

    Before lookdowns were removed there weren’t many halberd users. The halberd isn’t about lookdowns; Other weapons that do more damage are.

    I don’t know if you’re just arguing for the sake of arguing but come on man. I write a list of reasons why (as well as post 2 videos) I feel the weapon needs some adjustment and you argue back with “this person can play it just fine”. I know there are weapons in this game that need major adjustments but at the same time other weapons shouldn’t be excluded from from fixing because it isn’t as serious of a problem. I personally have a lot of experience playing with the halberd and that’s why I’m putting my opinions out there.

    im not that good at melee and i wreck with halberd drags vs people who actually practice and main a class for many hours

    i just pick a class at a whim when im not feeling like archering

    so idk man maybe halberd needs a buff if thats what youre suggesting :)



  • Agreed with most things here.

    I really dislike messer in its current state. So easy to hit trade. As well, its not nearly as slow or short as people make it out to be for its damage.

    I too hate the current state of maces. The stab, mostly stab riposte, is so unfun to fight against. I wish maces were actually viable without relying on really cheap stabs.



  • I agree with the problem that maces shouldn’t have a very fast EFFECTIVE stab attack since , well they’re maces.

    Same goes for the Dane Axe.

    Everything that doesn’t have a point that is meant for stabbing shouldn’t be good at stabbing. Period.

    All this talking is pointless if action is not taken.

    TB CAN YOU LOOK AT ME CAN YOU LOOK AT ME IN THE EYE

    LOOK AT ME TB

    LOOK AT ME TB AND FIX THIS GAME

    READ AND FIX
    READ AND FIX

    REAND AND FICK CNA YOU DO THAT



  • @Sophax:

    I agree with the problem that maces shouldn’t have a very fast EFFECTIVE stab attack since , well they’re maces.

    Same goes for the Dane Axe.

    Everything that doesn’t have a point that is meant for stabbing shouldn’t be good at stabbing. Period.

    The dane axe should actually have a sharpened horn meant for stabbing. I don’t know whey decided to make the axe have some funky grind.

    If anything, the stab should be buffed a bit and do piercing damage instead of blunt damage.

    buff pls.



  • The ‘point’ of stabs on those weapons isn’t really for damage. They are most useful as interrupters, used to flinch and regain initiative and setup for the big overhead/horiz blow to come.
    Nerfing their damage doesn’t change a thing, nerfing their speed makes it useless, it is only the range that has any real impact.



  • The Knights weapons are almost fully balanced. The only exception being the Long sword, it needs a slight buff for its slash imo. Then again, it is the goto Bastard sword for Sword and Board, so perhaps it is balanced as is.

    Don’t mess with the Knight swords.
    Nerf the Windup of Greatsword from .5 to .6, that should bring the weapon in-line with the other Vanguard swords.
    Brandi, nerf swipe damage, make it half. Leave it’s speed as is.
    Spear, imo, is perfect. The fork… I never really use it, what’s the point of a short range, quicker spear? Use a sword.

    The polehammer is great, except it really seems to eat up your stamina.

    The Falchion needs a buff, probably in damage with slash and overhead. I really have hard time choosing anything but shortsword given the choice.

    Daggers should be given backstab bonus across the board, and backstab taken away from archers. MAA dagger backstabs would be brutal…

    Archers projectiles should only flinch in windup nothing else. Damage should drop off significantly after mid-range, this stop useless archers sitting right at the back near their spawns taking pot-shots and doing nothing for the objective. It also brings them closer to the battle for the melee characters to have a better chance of crossing the distance and smacking their cheeky faces.



  • @Toll:

    The ‘point’ of stabs on those weapons isn’t really for damage. They are most useful as interrupters, used to flinch and regain initiative and setup for the big overhead/horiz blow to come.
    Nerfing their damage doesn’t change a thing, nerfing their speed makes it useless, it is only the range that has any real impact.

    I’m wel aware of that but it becomes the strongest point of that said weapon. It becomes the opener, the finisher and the feint attack because it has more range and is faster than the overhead of slash. Regardless of the damage it still is too effective at what it does for a susposedly blunt weapon.

    Do you think its normal that a dane axe can mis on purpose only to hit you in your windup with another stab? This gives them too much of an advantage. They can either feint you or hit you its rediculous.

    Just look at how people play morningstart/HW/dane axe.

    I say that we remove this one trick nonsense and remove the spammability of these attacks. If the weapon is shit after that then we buff other areas simple as that.



  • @Sophax:

    Blunt 1H (riposte) stabs really have to be nerfed a bit. I don’t like how easy it is to finish off an opponent with a riposte stab
    or a feint+stab to the head. I can consistently do it to players with over 1000hrs of experience and it feels just as cheap every time. They already have good range, draggability and chopping/smashing power, no need to have sword like stabs that can flinch anything. I can’t decide if they are too fast or if they reach too far but anyway it’s not cool.


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