A few weapons that need addressing.



  • Cudgel needs some love. I’ll settle for not even buffing it, as long as you add back it’s ability to bash helmets off. That shit was hilarious and it always seemed to make people more vulnerable to headsplodes.



  • Thanks for the replies everyone !
    @Toll
    @Flame
    With you both being Messer knights, i smell nothing but bias on your replies regarding the messer nerf.
    Anyone who says that the messer is balanced compared to the other 2 swords is an idiot, simple as that.
    Remember we are trying to fix weapons, not make them useless, a wind up nerf would only level the playing field.
    Right now idiots just backswing as soon as they see you doing anything and they always succeed in trading which in my opinion is retarded.
    Also the part i don’t get is Flame said he can assure me that the messer is balanced, yet he only plays that.
    How can you say that ?!
    I play all 3 swords pretty much every day (i change between rounds) and there is no doubt in my mind that messer outclasses the other 2 swords. Just look at the spreadsheet. The numbers don’t lie.



  • I’ll be honest, 1v1s are waaaay easier with Messer than with Longsword. In teamfights, LS’s range actually does help a lot, but it is obviously terrible for hittrading due to low HTK while Messer is king at that. I feel like an increased flinch time would really do wonders to keeping it more in line.

    I feel like LS and SoW are so close to being perfect. SoW just needs stab feints looked at a bit and LS should have guaranteed 3HTK if you 2 overhead a Knight or 1 overhead a Van imo. Or maybe leave Vans to be 3HTK without headshot so SoW still retains a notable advantage over LS in Van-slaying.

    Warhammer is definitely my favorite 1-hander, fell in love with it when I was trying to unlock Maul back in the single-digit levels. It felt terrible ever since the handle hit nerf… the range got noticeably worse, wouldn’t be surprised if it was worse than fists lol. Needs to 2-hit Knights with LMB + Overhead combo even without headshot imo. I’ve read a suggestion that Warhammer should be the slowest windup + longest release time of all 1h’s, would make it the blunt Messer of 1h’s and I would love for that to be its niche too.

    Agree with your sentiments on the speedy gonzalez 1handers.

    Oh god Flail. It’s the Dan Hibiki/Pichu of this game.



  • With you both being Messer knights

    What makes you think I’m a ‘Messer’ Knight?

    When I play Knight I probably choose Longsword 30% of the time, mainly with shields. Sow about 40% of the time, for that sweet sweet anti-vanguard action and and Messer about 30% of the time if I want to go knight and the other team is Knight heavy.

    To me that seems pretty balanced.

    Up until recently most of the time I’ve seen Flame play he was Vanguard with Brandi and sometimes Greatsword, then as he played knight I’ve seen him SoW a fair bit and Messer. I’ve never seen him use a shield and that is possibly why he doesn’t really use Longsword.



  • The warhammer needs to be reverted back to what it was, it was a great fun niche weapon before the latest patch. It didn’t really make people go ‘wtf handle hit!!?!?’ it just did what you expect, big damage at short range with a little bit of dragging potential.



  • @Toll:

    What makes you think I’m a messer

    I think this is just a case of mistaken identities Toll aren’t you Oceanian? There is a messer spinner named Toll in EU



  • Yeah I hide down under. I’m the better Toll. roflseewhatididthere



  • Up until recently most of the time I’ve seen Flame play he was Vanguard with Brandi and sometimes Greatsword, then as he played knight I’ve seen him SoW a fair bit and Messer. I’ve never seen him use a shield and that is possibly why he doesn’t really use Longsword.

    Flame is NA. You’re AUS. There’s no way you’ve seen him play unless you were for some reason spectating NA pubs.



  • For the love of god don’t buff longbow or shortbow anymore, they have ALREADY GOT BUFFS IN THE PAST how about instead of buffing them perhaps give warbow a slightly longer time to shoot so there is actually a reason to pick longbow or shortbow over warbow…



  • @Flippy:

    Flame is NA. You’re AUS. There’s no way you’ve seen him play unless you were for some reason spectating NA pubs.

    THIS IS SO FUCKING CONFUSING! TWO TOLLS, TWO FLAMES! WHY AM I TYPING IN CAPSLOCK! NERF BRANDISTOCK!



  • @Shard:

    Thanks for the replies everyone !
    @Toll
    @Flame
    With you both being Messer knights, i smell nothing but bias on your replies regarding the messer nerf.
    Anyone who says that the messer is balanced compared to the other 2 swords is an idiot, simple as that.
    Remember we are trying to fix weapons, not make them useless, a wind up nerf would only level the playing field.
    Right now idiots just backswing as soon as they see you doing anything and they always succeed in trading which in my opinion is retarded.
    Also the part i don’t get is Flame said he can assure me that the messer is balanced, yet he only plays that.
    How can you say that ?!
    I play all 3 swords pretty much every day (i change between rounds) and there is no doubt in my mind that messer outclasses the other 2 swords. Just look at the spreadsheet. The numbers don’t lie.

    Ya all this and then also lol @ “need 2 headshots to 2 shot knight.” Overhead to head is 56 dmg, and to torso is 45. Only one required. Don’t know how you can use Messer that long and not know that.



  • buff longsword and sow OH damage, keep messer



  • @CRUSHED:

    buff longsword and sow OH damage, keep messer

    Might as well do this since every knight plays swords anyways ever.
    Scrim meta atm is as follows:
    Knight= Sow/Messer
    Vanguard=GS
    MAA=Broad
    Archur=Shortsword
    Swoard master race



  • @Bluebeard:

    Might as well do this since every knight plays swords anyways ever.
    Scrim meta atm is as follows:
    Knight= Sow/Messer
    Vanguard=GS
    MAA=Broad
    Archur=Shortsword
    Swoard master race

    Here is the NA meta:

    Knight: Poleaxe/Sow/Dubaxe/Maul/Messer
    Vanguard: Greatsword/Halberd/Brandistock/Polehammer/Zwei
    MAA: Broad/Norse, Firepot
    Archer: Warbow/HeavyCrossbow/LightCrossbow/Sling/Javelin
    Archer Melee: Shortsword/ThrustingDagger

    It’s actually pretty diverse now that I see it.



  • lol NA once again behind EU meta

    LOLPOLEAXE
    LOLDUBAXE
    LOLMAUL
    LOLWARBOW
    LOLHXBOW
    LOLSLING
    LOLZWEI
    LOLPOLEHAMMER
    LOLHALBERD

    LOLOLOL



  • NA big serious competitive scene, they use dubaxe or slings in scrims



  • @rumpelstiltskin:

    NA big serious competitive scene, they use dubaxe or slings in scrims

    to be fair i only use sling when im destroying KT’s butthole



  • Don’t you dare to diss the allmighty dubaxe!



  • damn you guys are flamin pretty hard

    I’m pretty sure that the EU meta is behind in all honesty, seems like they all go into scrims as individuals instead of teams, using their best duel weapon instead of a team based weapon composition. I hear they 1v1 the last
    guy if he’s outnumbered in LTS. Lol. I hope it was a joke.

    In NA we use more diversity mainly because we can see that certain weapons counter certain classes better, sure you can go tryhard and lone wolf it but it’s not as effective unless you’re really a god



  • I will never understand why people use sling in scrims.


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