On handlehits



  • Since the handlehit patch, i feel like a lot of the effected weapons have turned into shit. Outside of knight duels, i really see no reason to ever use a poleaxe, g mace, double axe and then others like bardiche… Biggest issue is that the knight heavys are all fairly short and have short release times and you basically NEED to get into facehug to ensure a hit (especially versus non-knights in my experience), at which point the handle has a solid chance of just flying right through them. It doesnt happen that often to me but sometimes it leads to you just getting boned and its annoying as fuck when it does happen. That and now the lookdowns are slow as balls on all of these. Really no reason to use anything other than messer and sometimes sow now. I even think longsword is better at this point, just because of the animations of the swords. Wondering if anyone else feels similarly. I think at the least you could let the handle flinch your opponent and that could have its own unique sound to let you know it was a handlehit? Maybe just up the release times/length a little bit so you dont HAVE to get so damn close to hit people? I havent heard too many people whine about this and i am a noob with these weapons with maybe ~150 hrs max but they honestly seem a little TOO bad compared to where they were before the handlehit patch.



  • Give them better animations like the swords.



  • I can agree with you about the 2h sword animations, they’re are clearly superior when it comes to accelerating swings, there really isn’t a reason to use anything else.



  • give them shorter windups maybe



  • Wellllll swagfox I know you typically do nonfeint duels right? Well the thing is these weapons SHINE in feinting fights. Poleaxe, Dubaxe, Gmace all do pretty well with feints.



  • They raised the handle tracers on the longer, non-sword weapons. When they tried to do so on the swords, there were incidents of the tracers simply not connecting with players in facehug range, so they did nothing to the swords. This means that the uneffected weapons still have powerful lookdown potential (longsword, sow, messer, greatsword, claymore, zwei), and weapons such as grandmace, poleaxe, dubaxe, do not. The changes to the handle tracers were massive. Billhook went from being able to instantly perform lookdown attacks that most players had difficulty parrying without pre-emptively positioning and parrying the instant they saw the animation, to having pitifully slow lookdowns that even newer players can parry with ease.

    I have noticed that many players have migrated towards sword weapons as a result.



  • All these weapons are fine. Billhook lookdowns are still wicked fast, same with knight weapons.

    Gmace has always been a mediocre weapon, people just crutched on its broken handle-hits.



  • The difficulty should be in reading feints not in the ease of doing such a swing that it hits instantly and thus makes you gamble.

    If you think weapons become shit because of the lookdown nerf then you just need to feint more.



  • Wellllll swagfox I know you typically do nonfeint duels right? Well the thing is these weapons SHINE in feinting fights. Poleaxe, Dubaxe, Gmace all do pretty well with feints.

    You have 0 clue body, keep it with maa only discussion plz at least, he’s right, gmace, poleaxe and weapon like this are shit now, you can’t even feint poleaxe, cause if you feint stab and then overhead, the guy has the time to double parry easy and double parry happen half the time on others weapon like this to lol, gmace is total shit now and way to easy to read (and it was one of the easiest weapon to read pre patch lol) dubaxe is worse to, still acceptable i guess, this 3 weapons were always correctly readable (way easier than sword) now they are shit tier, sword or die.

    The handle hit fix is good for weapons were it was really needed, like polearm, it totally fucked mace and axe, you can’t feint and you can’t delay to, like it was possible to do with gm before.



  • Please keep the discussion relevant to the topic.



  • I would like the halberd to have its handle hits back, that would make me happy.


  • Mod

    @Rob_Owner:

    I would like the halberd to have its handle hits back, that would make me happy.

    Halberd handle hits gave me PTSD, keep them away.



  • To be honest I don’t see any problems with handlehits or animations in the current build.

    Balance-wise, maybe Messer can have a slight nerf and Longsword a slight buff(Although I’d much prefer a bit extra reach over extra damage or speed)



  • @Sophax:

    The difficulty should be in reading feints not in the ease of doing such a swing that it hits instantly and thus makes you gamble.

    If you think weapons become shit because of the lookdown nerf then you just need to feint more.

    I agree with this completely. However the sword weapons maintain this benefit of easy to perform lookdown attacks, that other weapons no longer have access to, and it’s not based on their wind up times, but purely by where the release window occurs in relation to the tracers. If you pushed the greatsword (example weapon) tracers up like they were on other weapons, it no longer has this built in tracer advantage that is irrelevant to the actual timings of the weapon on the spreadsheet.

    This same advantage allows a weapon such as the greatsword to have amazing speed, amazing drag, and amazing reach.

    Though it seems Torn Banner was not able to find a sufficient solution that didn’t break the weapons, and so now there exists a slight inconsistency between the weapon tracers, and therefore another dimension is added to balancing these weapons.



  • They were easy to block, you can see the handle about to hit you and It keeps the ‘maa’ from flinching or trading my combos, and scared the SoW knights away from me.



  • Playing Halberd last night and lost a bout against a knight because my lmb phased through him without even flinching him. I cried for a long time after that.

    When I first started playing, I assumed hitting people with a handle did minor blunt damage. Naturally, a few bardiche lookdown deaths later, I knew better, but I always wondered why that wasn’t an option. Does the engine not allow for certain parts of the weapon to do more/different damage than others?



  • @Gauntlet:

    I agree with this completely. However the sword weapons maintain this benefit of easy to perform lookdown attacks, that other weapons no longer have access to, and it’s not based on their wind up times, but purely by where the release window occurs in relation to the tracers. If you pushed the greatsword (example weapon) tracers up like they were on other weapons, it no longer has this built in tracer advantage that is irrelevant to the actual timings of the weapon on the spreadsheet.

    This same advantage allows a weapon such as the greatsword to have amazing speed, amazing drag, and amazing reach.

    Though it seems Torn Banner was not able to find a sufficient solution that didn’t break the weapons, and so now there exists a slight inconsistency between the weapon tracers, and therefore another dimension is added to balancing these weapons.

    I agree, its only fair all weapons get the same change since its the same problem.



  • @Baglady74:

    Playing Halberd last night and lost a bout against a knight because my lmb phased through him without even flinching him. I cried for a long time after that.

    When I first started playing, I assumed hitting people with a handle did minor blunt damage. Naturally, a few bardiche lookdown deaths later, I knew better, but I always wondered why that wasn’t an option. Does the engine not allow for certain parts of the weapon to do more/different damage than others?

    it does but TBS is just laaaaaaaaazy



  • Halberd was always over nerfed from it’s first nerf. That nerf should have been half the the nerf it got. Yes, it needed a nerf but it was too much. Fighting against knights is useless most of the time because it is super slow and doesn’t do enough damage for the stamina costs. Then if you have a few ghost swings you are toast.

    Handle hits were never an issue for me either way. But I thought that the nerf was fixing something that wasn’t broken to begin with. But hey, I got out shouted.



  • @JimmyTryhard:

    Wellllll swagfox I know you typically do nonfeint duels right? Well the thing is these weapons SHINE in feinting fights. Poleaxe, Dubaxe, Gmace all do pretty well with feints.

    I accommodate people who do no feint duels, haven’t actually supported them in a long time. Poleaxe has it’s stab feint but the rest aren’t that hard to read compared to most other weapons imo. If you do fall for a g mace feint or dubaxe feint you can just run away to force a double parry half of the time lol, and I’m honestly a lousy feint reader. At least with poleaxe i can usually feint, stab then stab again and do solid damage but dubaxe and gmace dont even have stabs to do damage with lol.


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