Fix your broken flinch system



  • @B4RK:

    A solution that would benefit everyone in other situations as well would be to allow recovery parry after a successful ht, or have reduced recovery times after a successful hit.

    This is the best idea I’ve heard all month.

    Somebody needs to fund this!

    They should probably allow for repostes for these recovery parries, too.

    Imagine that…

    A buff for 1vXers…



  • I don’t understand why some people want flinch in release suddenly. Unless they main HWS or something.



  • @dudeface:

    I don’t understand why some people want flinch in release suddenly. Unless they main HWS or something.

    They main MAA.

    Also, I can’t believe people are now defending 0.8 flinch and flinch in release. Disgusting.



  • Do you two even read posts?

    The only flinch in release that has support is 80+ damage.

    No one wants sprint flinch.

    And B4RK makes an excellent point about .8 flinch.

    If they added recovery parry after a successful hit, then you would have absolutely no reason to whine about .8 flinch, unless of course you are already shit at timing your parries.



  • against hit traders I CFTP after every hit I get on them if they have fast weapons.

    Its a bad a habit but sometimes its the only way to parry their attacks



  • The only aspect of the flinch system that’s “broken” is the flinch in release. Anything else is preference. Whether it’s .8 or .9 I couldn’t care less.



  • The problem I have with 0.8 flinch is it just seems to encourage the many hit trade gamblers we have these days. Not really sure why we need to be restricted to comboing a certain way (or cftp every time) to be safe from these guys. IMO if you get hit you shouldn’t automatically think to hit back for a free hit, why should they regain the initiative in such a way?



  • @Mr.Lion:

    “Features”

    HEXEN and Zombo confirmed for being elitists who want to be competitive in this fun and casual game. Its like a card game realy.

    excuse me sir, I’m trying to bring casual fun to millions by removing flinch.

    all you did was your little “quotation” thing

    @parkrangerstan:

    The only aspect of the flinch system that’s “broken” is the flinch in release.

    And no flinch during weapon switch and no flinch during kick recovery, just fyi tbh



  • @randomlvl40+:

    Do you two even read posts?

    The only flinch in release that has support is 80+ damage.

    No one wants sprint flinch.

    Only you were saying that.

    Perhaps it is you who should be reading those posts?



  • @randomlvl40+:

    Do you two even read posts?

    The only flinch in release that has support is 80+ damage.

    No one wants sprint flinch.

    And B4RK makes an excellent point about .8 flinch.

    If they added recovery parry after a successful hit, then you would have absolutely no reason to whine about .8 flinch, unless of course you are already shit at timing your parries.

    I thought you wanted to nerf archers?



  • @zombojoe:

    against hit traders I CFTP after every hit I get on them if they have fast weapons.

    Its a bad a habit but sometimes its the only way to parry their attacks

    And on the second time you CFTP during a mid combo hit they’ll just feint you.

    0.8 is horrible. The never worked with these mid combo hits for like a year and a half.

    Flinch in release shouldn’t apply during sprinting but only for weapons who do 80 damage in one hit because they are so slow against 1h.

    @H:

    excuse me sir, I’m trying to bring casual fun to millions by removing flinch.

    all you did was your little “quotation” thing

    It was a joke…yea this game is totaly like a card game.



  • @Kreittis:

    Also, I can’t believe people are now defending 0.8 flinch. Disgusting.

    I was always neutral on my stance with 0.8 flinch, however the longer I think about it, the more it makes sense. I don’t think 0.9 is going to fix the problem, it might make it worse.

    I think i’d rather see something like a parry in recovery “unlock” after a successful hit.

    @gndo:

    The problem I have with 0.8 flinch is it just seems to encourage the many hit trade gamblers

    There’s no gambling about it. What I’ve found out is that for both players – the “gambler” and the comboer – neither understand the 0.8 flinch dynamic to the fullest extent for a majority of the players.

    @Mr.Lion:

    And on the second time you CFTP during a mid combo hit they’ll just feint you.

    So now more mindgames are a bad thing to have? This issue only applies to insta-hits. It gives more risk to insta-hits. So people that rely on doing nothing but insta-hits are going to have a major ordeal with this flinch time.

    Should some weapons get a 0.9 flinch time? Sure, but probably not many. Zwei comes to mind off the top of my head, but I would have to go do some spreadsheet research.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    There’s no gambling about it. What I’ve found out is that for both players – the “gambler” and the comboer – neither understand the 0.8 flinch dynamic to the fullest extent for a majority of the players.

    Well, perhaps you could explain it fully? Make a thread on it if need be.



  • Already explained most of it in my response to Mr.Lion. You only have to worry about them interrupting your combo with insta-hits or for slower combo times, very early hits.

    It’s not Deadliest Warrior, where insta-hits instead have incredibly low damage. These are full damage, but the drawback instead is that you may be at risk for a combo to be interrupted.

    There really isn’t much to explain. It’s just something to either grasp or not.



  • .8 flinch def. adds skill ceiling, but also more tears from shitters.



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    Already explained most of it in my response to Mr.Lion. You only have to worry about them interrupting your combo with insta-hits or for slower combo times, very early hits.

    But why should we be limited in our combo when we have the initiative. They have just been hit so they lookdown and get free hit or force cftp which uses stamina. I don’t like how this gives gamblers more options and those who have scored a hit less options.



  • I am consistently interrupted by SoW stab spam during my LS combos. Even if I do a stab to overhead/LMB most SoW users will just crouch, lean back, and use stab. If I am lucky I can trade them, but at least half the time I get flinched or knocked back and miss.

    Similarly, but not quite as bad, is messer lookdown OH. If I land a stab on some messer spammer and proceed to combo, chances are that he is already doing a lookdown overhead. I almost always trade these guys, which is better than the SoW, but unfortunately Messer does so much damage that I am barely ahead after being traded.

    Also, in both cases after this exchange, I am left on the defense because I was hit first by the spammer and they can easily proceed to spam another lookdown or feint a lookdown.

    Even simply blocking someone with their head in my crotch is difficult because I can not see any animations.
    Calling a feint in this situation is nearly impossible.

    Get more distance so I can read it you say? I can not. There is a spammer in my face who just wants to hit trade while head bashing at my crotch. I am already stunned from the previous trade so I can not sprint or move away much.

    How about stop doing combos with LS unless my strike landed on the final frames of release? Well, that is difficult for two reasons.

    One: unless I already cued a combo it is very difficult to start another attack when I hit with the final .1 seconds of my attack. It is hardly within human reaction time. I suppose I can cue a combo up earlier but then I may hit him with an early part of my swing and then I’m gonna get traded or have to CFTP and lose all my stamina.
    Two: LS is pretty much only good because of its fast and diverse combos. If I can only combo in very specific situations why the fuck would I want to use LS? Better to just take messer and hit trade OH all day, or SoW and stab & stab feint spam.

    I don’t know what to do about .8 flinch but I think there are a lot of situations where it brings more bad than good.
    I am just some guy who likes LS, and I don’t think that weapons of similar size and speed should be able to so easily break combos.



  • @CRUSHED:

    .8 flinch def. adds skill ceiling, but also more tears from shitters.

    Yes mos def. These bads don’t even know bout that stand still to hit trade advance meta



  • caveman lotto knight strats are the future



  • @NoVaLombardia:

    So now more mindgames are a bad thing to have? This issue only applies to insta-hits. It gives more risk to insta-hits. So people that rely on doing nothing but insta-hits are going to have a major ordeal with this flinch time.

    What do you mean with insta hits? What mindgames? You mean mid combo gambles all the time because people can’t read combo feints/drags? Thats some serious mind game right there.

    If someone combo’s and you are both on full HP and you have a hard hitting weapon you’d be a fool to not trade mid combo every single time. Now you might say, you can anticipate that and just CFTP, but this situation shouldn’t happen or there is no point to combo besides people can just feint you mid combo if you try to trade and get a free hit.

    Don’t overcomplicate the game with uneccesary changes and try to justify it as adding more mindgames which is basically more gambling in the form of mid combo trades. Keep it clean, reactionary and fluid. If you get hit you will need to rely on your defensive capibilities or kick them not gamble your way out of it with a fast 1h.

    @CRUSHED:

    .8 flinch def. adds skill ceiling, but also more tears from shitters.

    Comes from the guy who proposed it very unbiased. Its a retarded idea. There is no need to try to defend it.

    I suggest you keep it to map making because you don’t know anything about skill. Just the fact that you crutch on broken weapons like the HWS says enough. I guess you like your mid combo gambles since you don’t have a solid defense against feints or drags.


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