Balance Patch – Some food for thought



  • This is a thread for when discussion about the balance patch kicks off. I’m just going to list what I feel needs to be touched on in Chivalry. I’ll try to keep it short and sweet.

    Archer

    • Backstab bonus change/removal
    • Crossbow projectile speed change
    • Damage changes all round for Archer primaries except the Sling weapon tree
    • A more dynamic system of damage which rewards headshots over anything else (less damage when shot in the arm/hand which currently registers as torso damage for instance)

    Man-At-Arms

    • Major bug fixes to the current form of dodge (Please do not try to “balance” the MaA around bug fixes by changing the dodge mechanic, fixing them should be first priority)
    • A look into a foot speed adjustment
    • Broadsword nerf to encourage use of other weapons available
    • HWS nerf (stab damage, wind up times, release times, combo times etc.)
    • Dodge rework of some kind
    • Oilpot rework

    Vanguard

    • Greatsword nerf
    • Brandistock nerf
    • Bardiche buff
    • Knockback rework
    • Making charge more consistent

    Knight

    • A look into a foot speed adjustment
    • Possibility of making the Knight more resistant to projectiles
    • Messer nerf
    • Giving the Knight more of an impact in team play (somehow)
    • Making 1h Bastard Swords more appealing/viable

    General

    • BUG FIXES (FiR, Dodge bypassing flinch times allowing him to attack early, )
    • Stamina
    • Kick rework (shouldn’t do stamina damage, needs to be made more consistent, shouldn’t camera shake you)
    • Flinch time change

    List anything you feel needs addressing which I might not have covered, try to include why you think so. Tell me what you think of my list even, critique other peoples thoughts on current balance and what needs to be done etc. Try not to get stuck down on a single topic here, try to keep the scope broad and cover a whole range of issues.

    Maybe put it in a list like I did so TB can run their eyes over it and so it’s easier for them to pick out problems.



  • -Shields accelerating attacks needs to go
    -Something for stab feints that start inside your body perhaps? Could be a lockout rework or maybe something cooler.

    Suggestion for the oil pot rework: Make it so once you hold it up there’s a fuse or something that goes down over a few seconds, and if you don’t throw it fast enough it blows up in your hand setting only you on fire (to minimize team damage in pubs). Also get rid of the fire effect that goes in your face while on fire, that shit’s annoying and only gets in the way (the side screen effects are okay, it’s the main one in the middle that’s bad).



    • Server-side hit detection. ;)
    • I believe (look at server-side hit detection thread of analysis and calculations) this will impact and improve upon many of the current ‘OP’ Weapons and techniques. OH lookdowns, projectile dodging would be more consistent, fast weapons will be far more parryable including ripostes (for higher ping people), facehug shenanigans will be reduced, shield up time wont be such a hindrance to the defender, accelerated shield attacks will be easier to defend against, MAA footspeed will natually not give as strong an advantage as well as dodge.
      So many things will be impacted positively, for a minor cost in Attackers attack animation running slightly ahead of the servers real animation, although I have also suggested a way to mitigate this in the thread.

    -edit: Also it would allow for high pingers to actually play, as their ping won’t impact every other player, it will only be a disadvantage to them, they will be flinc-able, they wont hit well before their animation plays on your computer, etc. We wont have to kick those poor bastards that have no choice but to play on their closest server at 180ping…

    • Significant damage reduction from projectiles on Knights should make them more useful in team play.


  • I’d love to see knights get a resistance to projectiles making them more useful for team play and I agree with most of what’s been listed so far.

    I hope Messer doesn’t see a significant nerf, I really don’t think it’s that OP compared to a lot of the other weapons available especially with its short range for team play. I’d be fine with a rework of it’s riposte lookdown OH but I think a lot of weapons need to be slowed down a bit on that attack.



  • I’d be fine with a rework of it’s riposte lookdown OH but I think a lot of weapons need to be slowed down a bit on that attack.

    It’s not the speed, it’s the delay of the attack information to the defending client that is the problem.

    OKOK I’ll stop spamming now.



  • not gonna go over the obvious ones other than mentioning them because everyone already knows what needs to be done to most of them

    flinch/fir

    projectiles nerf

    gr8sword nerf

    hws nerf

    messer nerf

    brandi nerf

    **broadsword nerf

    **give it some drawback plz

    shortsword nerf

    warhammer buff

    this weapon needs a lot to really be a viable choice. personally think it should have 2 of the following 3. length, good stab, or extra speed. a good stab (maybe put a spike on the tip of the model as well), making it like a 1 handed polehammer would be neat, i dont want it to be fairly quick and a little longer just like the flanged mace.

    bearded axe rework/buff

    anyone got any ideas?

    claymore rework/buff

    claymore is sort of intertwined with the gs nerf. maybe nerf gs oh and slash to .55/.525 and then basically take the old claymore but make its oh and slash .525/.5 like the current ls? slightly faster, slightly shorter gr8sword? something like that.



  • My suggestion for Oil Pot: Make it like in CS where it doesn’t deal damage until the fire has spread which takes like a second. The fire could have a bit of a more devastating effect in the AoE to effectively hold people off.



  • server side hit detection would fix 90% of the issues in this game.

    But i would also love to see more weapon become viable like

    all MAA/Vanuard axes
    MAA/Knight 1h Blunt exept HWS
    Falchion
    Quarterstaff
    Billhook,Bardiche

    I strongly suggest Messer, HSW , GreatSword, Brandi and all Archer CC weapons get nurfed


  • Mod

    Claymore is fine imo.

    Longsword could use a slight buff I think. Other than that, I feel DokB has covered everything I feel needs to be sorted.



  • I really don’t think they’re going to recode the game to work with server-side hit detection, so people should probably just forget about it.

    I agree with most of the ideas here, except I don’t think Brandi really needs that much of a nerf. You don’t see people dominate regularly like they do with greatsword or messier.



  • There is already a mod that has started it, it shouldn’t take too much I would think. My thoughts are if the mod can prove it works well, and moves it all across. Then TB can juts take the changes and wake it into a beta build, little effort on their part.



  • I agree that MAA footspeed needs to be looked at.
    In particular the acceleration should be lowered.

    A MAA can currently be backpedalling full speed and then change direction to a forward sprint, and he will be full sprint within fractions of a second. It is extremely hard to read what is going on in that situation, especially with the lightning fast (and huge range) of broadsword stabs.

    They range is effectively similar to a spear. It is kind of ridiculous to me.

    It seems like my only move is to try to hit trade in that situation (unless I am also maa) because It is nearly impossible to block effectively (even if I do he just changes direction and runs away super fast with super acceleration)

    He also has extremely fast acceleration after dodges.

    PS
    I could be wrong about this one, but I am pretty sure that if a MAA combos an attack after his dodge that part of the attack animation is concealed by the dodge. So many times a MAA dodges away and I chase just to get insta-stabbed by something I could not even see. I usually just pre-parry in this situation, hoping for the best.



  • Maa shouldn’t be able to dodge right after a parry, if they fell for a feint or a drag they should be punished for it like every other class.



  • @Peckles:

    Maa shouldn’t be able to dodge right after a parry, if they fell for a feint or a drag they should be punished for it like every other class.

    But if he dodged he didnt fall for it
    Its important that you are not being an idiot then fighting MAA. If you are attacking from a range that a MAA can dodge out from then prepare yourself to turn 180 and run. So he cant hit you with his stab. Or better get in a position where dodge doesnt work.

    All in all MAA speed should be buffed further to counter dancing Vanguard and making chasing easier



  • We don’t need this kind of shit thread, daggyzo made a thread about that some times ago and every proposition was in there, and even a list that many people agreed on was made, so stop this.



  • server side hit detection would fix 90% of the issues in this game.

    People should look at the thread and see the downsides to server-side hit-detection that this tard isn’t mentioning.



  • @Edmund:

    We don’t need this kind of shit thread, daggyzo made a thread about that some times ago and every proposition was in there, and even a list that many people agreed on was made, so stop this.

    Then link it.



  • I really want to see kick damage removed (or limited to just 1 point of damage). I think that hits to kill are massively important in this game, and should be a factor in your weapon load out selection. If you fail to get the one shot kill, why should you still be rewarded because that 5 points of kick damage could finish the job all the same? Might I also add, this is unblockable damage, which I am seriously against.

    A lot can happen in one hit, making kicks trump that last hit completely ruins good fights. This is my opinion.

    On the man at arms oilpot rework, could we get something similar to counterstrike global offensive molotovs? Simply put: you do not take damage for the first 100 or so milliseconds (based on armor), giving you time to begin running out. They cover a much wider area, and do significant damage over time trying to run through. It also is blinding because of the fire and smoke produced on the ground, without relying on a full screen effect. Also, there exists some variation in the fire, if it is thrown in an area where the fire would be unable to fully extend horizontally, it increases in length. Also fix the bugs associated with the oilpot (such as hitting a wall or uneven surface causing invisible fire).

    This is in stark contrast to how it currently is: 30 damage over time you cannot avoid, and damage for running through with immediate ignition. Also an extremely blinding fire effect in the dead center of your screen. Don’t we have enough to worry about without having to see through a blinding centered fire effect?

    These changes make the oilpot an area denial tool, where it currently behaves only as direct damage, which is largely unavoidable (good man at arms won’t miss).



  • @Gauntlet:

    On the man at arms oilpot rework, could we get something similar to counterstrike global offensive molotovs? Simply put: you do not take damage for the first 100 or so milliseconds (based on armor), giving you time to begin running out. They cover a much wider area, and do significant damage over time trying to run through. It also is blinding because of the fire and smoke produced on the ground, without relying on a full screen effect. Also, there exists some variation in the fire, if it is thrown in an area where the fire would be unable to fully extend horizontally, it increases in length. Also fix the bugs associated with the oilpot (such as hitting a wall or uneven surface causing invisible fire).

    I use a lot of fire pots and i am rightfully hated for that.
    Giving People the chance to walk out of it isnt a nerf ,because this is an objective based game you cant have fire pots that block massive patches of ground and then do insane amounts of damage. How are you gonne stand next to a trebutchet? use ballistas?…

    The way they are now is fine, people mostly ignore them and walk through the flames, but you gain an advantage over them.



  • I could care less about the range and damage of oil pots.

    The biggest problems for me are the still pretty mysterious flinch it causes and as Gauntlet pointed out, the ridiculous vision blocking from the fire on your screen.


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