BETA - Chivalry: Medieval Warfare Patch 30



  • Nerfing is good (it just only misses brandi + messer nerf like messer windup time… really guys :/ ), finally maps are included ! Which is very good.
    And thanks alot for the ballista glitch fix



  • Another small issue. Switching to fists will cause you to leave a floating broadsword behind, no matter what weapon you’re currently using.

    http://i.imgur.com/MQmDfFa.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/kaVtdUo.jpg



  • I don’t get why ppl now say “GS overnerf” the overhead nerf was definitely needed since lookdown overheads were just far too fast so if +0.1 is already too much then why nerf it at all? Imo the GS nerfs are fine and should make it more fun to play against especially with those nasty instant lookdowns “out of the way” (ofc they still exist but should be easier to read and block now) so I appreciate that.

    On the other hand the messer nerf is kind of a joke. I don’t really get why 5 less slash damage should make it unviable against MAAs now since every other strike (except the kick now) will still 2 hit a MAA easily. But as others have already pointed out it hasn’t been needed in the first place anyways.
    Messer basically has the same problems that GS had (even though it’s slighty more fair since the reach and speed are a very slight downside and GS had no downside at all) which is the ridiculously fast lookdown overhead that does tons of damage while still being very fast which simply doesnt match with the whole approach of the game of trying to make high damage weapons slow and low damage weapons fast as it has both the advantage of speed and damage. So actually increasing the messer overhead windup is where it’s at.

    As for the rest of the patch (brandi changes included) I’m “happy” with and I hope that the ballista glitch is truly fixed now as it was one if not the most annoying bug in the game.



  • There’s a bug, will try to get screenshots with archers and shields, Jav archers have like some weird invisible shield on their back and if you go crossbow and pavise you have a second pavise shield horizontally on your back which is weird.

    Also the GS complaints sound like sour g-r-a-pples to me, its still faster in recovery and combo times then the Zwei. I think it fits in better now with the other swords. If you revert the changes people will just keep using it.

    Also Messer is fine with 90 lmb damage. I don’t think it HAS to one shot MAAs it will still one shot archers at that damage to the head

    Also heavy kick will still kill a MAA after an lmb to the head now with a messer (or it will be very close)

    apparently the fruit g**** is sensored



  • I think the great sword changes are alright. but WHY did tbs nerf the messer slash? Its all about the super fast overheads that 2 shot knights. Now messer is completely unviable against maa but still has the problem of being better than most other 2 handed knight weapons against knights/vanguards. And as others said about the chase mechanic being buggy where its about losing LOS or your cursor isnt on them is the problem not the chase mechanic speed. Also people saying nerf archer damage by 50% is absurd as nobody would play the class anymore, 15-20% would be reasonable.



  • @bigs:

    Its all about the super fast overheads that 2 shot knights. Now messer is completely unviable against maa b

    MAA’s are kick death or should be after LMB to the head (heavy kick) i know kicks are unreliable but being able to take away 95 or so health from any class in a single swing doesn’t scream nonviable to me. If you’re afraid of being able to get a second hit in on the maa (which every knight had to do anyway if they missed the headshot) then pull out a secondary



  • Messer slash damage was fine, if anything nerf the OH damage so it can’t 2shot knights and increase the windup a little bit.



  • Bugs:

    1. On Cove, there is an invisible wall on the last objective right at the front of the final building:

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=319037134

    2. Also saw a javelin archer today whose buckler was invisible.

    Balance:

    Many of these are a step in the right direction. I agree with the chorus that says the messer OH windup is what should be touched and not its 1hk on MAA’s. I also think the GS could use a tiny bit of love (bring the OH back down to .55 or .575) so it isn’t equal to the Zwei OH windup. Faster recovery and combo times aren’t enough to compensate for the zwei range and damage (the OH on the Zwei has 25 more base damage with longer range!).



  • Any screenshots for the new Tabard Designs?



  • Awesome :)

    I’ll check out the cove changes tomorrow when I’m more awake :3



  • So glad you are fixing some of the persistent bugs. The ballista bug was running rampant the last few months.
    And the vanguard customization and adding the contest maps are great ('bout time :P).
    Really hoping that the server browser crash is fixed once and for all, but it seems to always finds its way back or we won’t get any servers showing up in the list again, so i’m staying very cautious.

    As for Balance. Do not reintroduce the forward chase mechanic. i always see people complain about 1vN situations and stamina, yet they then want to be hypocrites and make it harder on themselves if they are outnumbered and on the defensive. Again this will remove any good footwork and range prediction as well as buff maa with dodge stabs even further. The 10% increase is a good enough buff to begin with and if it isn’t enough to catch those few and far between trolls I don;t know what is.

    Weapon balance wise, i’m very skeptical about. Mechanics need to be fixed before adjusting the weapon values imo.
    Please fix dodge out of flinch with maa, they should never be able to attack you instantly after you hit them.
    and archer range damage should be heavily nerfed on leg shots at least. Then we would actually have shields as RELIABLE counters, not a luck based chance to counter.

    I’ll leave my opinion with GS and messer alone for now, just remind people that they should never ever rely on hit trading as a valid and skillful tactic, of which the messer is currently prized for.



    • Fixed bug where one would have to repeatedly download the same workshop content if they remained on the same server where it was initially downloaded from

    Oh my fucking god you have no idea how long I have been waiting for this.



  • inb4 MAA OP.

    How did you not see that?



  • Thanks JRMFTW :applouse:



  • Found a pretty major collision blunder in Cove. It’s located where the Agatha spawn is just up from the Library.

    Where I am standing there is huge invisible walls that I assume used to be the doors to the cathedral that make it extremely frustrating to walk inside.

    On the other side of the entrance the door textures are there, but you can freely walk through them.

    Needs to be fixed asap.



  • @Skl3ros:

    GS had no downside at all

    The downside of the greatsword is that it’s on the van class, which is basically a knight with one less hit of effective hp. In CMW, where victory is a matter of how few mistakes you make, the allowance of one less hit is a huge disadvantage.

    I think some people are forgetting that when you compare weapons you have to take into account the class platform. Van has basically the same effective health as a MAA, but no dodge and no great movespeed. It’s usually a 2-hit death. Van needs statistically better weapons to compete with the greater hitpoints of the knight and the greater maneuverability of the MAA. That’s why van weapons are longer, stronger, and faster than average. They’re a berzerker class that needs to get work done quick, because they don’t have long to live in a face-to-face fight.

    Now I agree that the greatsword overhand needs a nerf, but not this kind of nerf. I’ll detail why in another post.



  • I
    Sorry for the essay, but-

    I think this is the wrong way to nerf the greatsword. I’ve got lots of experience with van swords(80,000+ kills), and I don’t think this is the right way to approach the too-fast overhead problem.

    The problem with the greatsword overhand lookdown isn’t with how fast the windup is. The problem is the animation/tracers. With a greatsword lookdown overhand, the tracers seem to hit before the weapon model hits. It’s the same problem as the ‘handle hits’ from polearms(those were patched out, weren’t they?). If the greatsword overhand tracers were changed to begin farther back, we could have an extra .1s grace time before being struck. Appearances would match up with player expectations and they would be able to parry it properly.

    I think that by giving greatsword a .6s OH windup, it will become just a weak zwei. It will lose it’s role. Yes, it has significantly faster combo times, but these faster combos are still relatively normal and easy to parry - they’re not as great as an advatage of the huge power and draggability of the zwei. There wouldn’t be much of a reason to choose greatsword over zwei.

    My main problem with slower windups on the greatsword is this: A .6s windup in CMW is on the slow side. Slower windups give the enemy much more of a chance to interrupt or deliver a profitable hit-trade. I think increasing such vulnerabilities for greatsword vans would make them easy meat for sword knights and MAAs. In my experience, sword vans are already an easy kill for a sword knight.

    The greatsword van is a brawler class. To do work, he has to get in with the knights and adopt their role as front-liners, whacking and parrying and taking hits. Spear and halberd vans don’t have to do this. They have the advantage of extreme range and can stay well out of danger while still delivering hits. But greatsword really isn’t all that long compared to knight 2H weapons. All knights have to do is land one parry and they can close the gap. Then it’s a guaranteed 3-hittable knight vs a likely 2-hittable van. Is that okay? All the van has to do is hit the knight one extra time. But I think that’s where the .6s greatsword OH windup would show its weakness. Any veteran knight worth his black hat is going to be able to take a nap and still make a hit-trade with a .6s greatsword OH.

    To summarize the above: a slow windup greatsword is an uncompetitive greatsword. Zwei users don’t often brawl - they skirt the edge of the fight and land support hits before they dive in because they know their weapon is too slow to challenge the reaction times of knights in a face-to-face fight. If the greatsword becomes that slow to windup, I think it won’t be competitive enough vs sword knights(the most common knight) in a brawl. The van will be stuck with a slower weapon and less effective health. Providing equal skill between the knight and van, and predicting an outcome based on the numbers, it’s a likely loss for the van. In a brawler role, the greatsword van will be obsolete. But that’s greatsword’s main role.

    Maybe I’m just nervous because greatsword is an old favorite of mine. Maybe I’m wrong and a .6s windup OH will work fine in practice. I don’t know, I’m still downloading the beta; I haven’t yet tested. When I get it DLed I’ll test a bunch. I just wanted to get some discussion out there. But my past experience leads me to believe that greatsword will be made sub-par, like the falchion and grand mace before it, if the nerf goes through in this state.

    If Torn Banner is gong to keep this windup nerf, I’d like to ask for a .65s greatsword thrust windup. It seems odd that the thrust is the same windup speed as the zwei thrust(with slower recovery, what what?), and yet .1s slower to windup than knight sword thrusts(.7s vs .6s).

    TL;DR: The GS overhead speed problem is one of animation, not windup speed. I think that a slow windup greatsword will be too similar to zwei and be uncompetitive with knight 2-handers.



  • You’re not wrong, i’ve been saying it for months now. 2h sword animations are overpowered and have a similar issue to polearms before the handle hit patch. Increasing the windup is a way to balance around the animations while ignoring the main issue (animations). Slowing 2h swords is the only way to make other weapons competitive. As for the GS, .6 windup is probably too high, but i have yet to test it.



  • People need to stop asking for silly requests like 50% archer projectile damage reduction. 15-20% damage reduction max, and then you adress their fire rate. Reloading should have a stamina penalty and they shouldn’t be able to perform any action without the required stamina. They throw mauls across the map at a ridiculous pace without any penalty whatsoever, why give them so much freedom? It doesn’t take any skill at all. This is suppose to be a melee oriented video game, yet you make the range class the strongest and most anti fun of all classes.

    Messer slash nerf is fine as long as you nerf MAA dodge and walking speed. It’s the overhead that needs immediate attention. These overheads are so ridiculous it turned ‘‘competitive’’ players into cavemen, and the current meta is all about hit trading, unacceptable.

    • MAAs dodging out of flinch needs to be fixed NOW.

    • Parrying requires too much stamina.

    • Vanguard charge with 2h swords is broken and anti fun, consider disabling it until you can come up with a proper animation for it.

    • Something needs to be done about the 2h sword stab feint window, the animation makes them unreadable at close/facehug range, if there’s a way to reduce its feint window, then consider it.



  • @TobiwanK3nobi:

    I
    The problem is the animation/tracers.

    Which is probably the issue with the broadsword - animations/model not matching the tracers, well either that or its stab is quite long for a secondary.


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