Hillside rebalance



  • Seeing as you have people working on maps at the moment TB, is there a chance you could look into rebalancing hillside while you’re at it? It has the potential to be a decent map, but as it stands its just not possible to defend properly past a certain point.

    All you currently need is a clear on a trebuchet and you can get a complete capture before any defenders can respawn and contest it. Increasing the destroy times by 15-20% would allow defenders to recontest the trebs at least once, alleviating the current imbalance quite a bit.

    Allowing Mason to use the ballistas on the final stage would also open up gameplay quite a bit, forcing contests of the back ballista (which currently gets no attention), and making the bottom ballista more of a challenge to get to. Spawn times may have to be tweaked a bit to compensate, but it would go a long way to making the final stage more of a challenge.

    Any thoughts?



  • agreed, good ideas



  • Masons should be able to summon the ghost of treb 3.



  • I agree, especially with Masons using the ballista. They can use it on Citadel, seems silly they can’t use it on Hillside.

    @dudeface:

    Masons should be able to summon the ghost of treb 3.

    Spectral Trebuchet



  • yeah, Masons should be able to use the ballistae and longer respawn times for destroyed ballistae would be good.



  • using ballista on last stage is having 2 archers that instakill anything, and then 1 real archer that damages. In pubs it would be okay, in comp it wouldn’t be great for balance. The trebs though could certainly take more time.



  • Maybe just bringing back the old treb 3 would balance it? Storming that place from all angles including above was one of my favourite things in chiv.



  • Why did they remove it in the first place?



  • Moar cover for last stage regardless if ballistas get changed or not. That is a fucking archer haven and I hate to play on the map.

    Remove the ammo box near the spawn so MAA can’t barrage you with firepots.

    Add a new objective before the pyre that lets both teams spawn closer.



  • Just reintroduce treb 3.



  • @Rekrab:

    Why did they remove it in the first place?

    Because Hillside was basically impossible for attackers before.
    The pyre took a year to burn down
    There was an extra treb and they all required more time to destroy.
    The ships required 10 shots each from the ballistas. (You got like 100 points/hit as well, that was fun)

    Now:
    Pyre burns really fast, masons can’t run from their spawn to the pyre during the time it takes for it to burn out. (this might be fair though as it’s hard to get there).
    Trebs are easy to destroy, barely takes any time.
    Ships require 3-5(I think it’s 5) shots each.

    I’d say keep the pyre stage as it is, perhaps add 5-10 seconds to the burn time.
    Give us back treb 3 but keep the time it takes to destroy the trebs.
    Give the defenders a faster route to the lower ballista, ie make the drop down from the wall possible without losing any health.



  • Old treb 3 was only imbalanced because archers could snipe people who were fighting on the treb from their spawn ramp which being immune to melee.

    Once they added that large wall that blocked LOS into the point, that would have made it a lot better in terms of balance. It would mean that Masons would enter the point relatively blind and not know what was awaiting them.

    Masons being able to use the ballista would certainly help a lot in TO, but like others said it would make it imbalanced in smaller 6v6 etc. comp games. If it wasn’t too difficult, having two separate versions of the map, one which was balanced around comp. play and the other around pub play would be the best scenario.

    I really miss old treb 3 :<



  • @DokB:

    If it wasn’t too difficult, having two separate versions of the map, one which was balanced around comp. play and the other around pub play would be the best scenario.

    So something like tournament mode having specific map variants that rebalance some areas for comp play? Sounds good to me.



  • @DokB
    You can just have a rule for comp games that masons aren’t allowed to use ballistas, simple as that.



  • The quick fix seems to just make the time to destroy a trebuchet 10% longer or something. No we don’t want trebuchet 3 back.



  • ^There seems to be more people who want it back though, someone should make a poll.



  • I dunno. I think 3 feels like the right number things to capture. 4 is a chore.
    Maybe you could swap treb one or two with old-three though.

    Increasing cap time a bit would probably be good.



  • @dudeface:

    I dunno. I think 3 feels like the right number things to capture. 4 is a chore.
    Maybe you could swap treb one or two with old-three though.

    Increasing cap time a bit would probably be good.

    Or remove the current treb 3, old treb 4, as it’s just annoying and not even worth defending.



  • b-but… how else will you have a chance to kick people off the bridge?



  • maybe add a forward mason spawn in that room underneath treb 2 that looks out onto treb 3. agatha have to capture treb 3 to deny mason that spawn area.

    also limit the angle of rotation of the ballistae on the last stage. agatha usually have so much time to complete the objective that they just toy with the enemy.