The nerve of some people (another rant on feinting)



  • I’m sure most of us have played against people complaining about feints. I use them, though I rarely rely on them to win duels or team fights. In team fights it’s true I use them more frequently because you need to watch your stamina and get rid of enemies quickly to complete the objective and watch your friend’s backs. You know, basic strategy.

    I, for my part, welcome all kind of movements. Anything goes except it’s an obvious exploit. And even if they seem unfair, I’ll try to analyse them and dissect them to understand such movements better and perhaps counter them. I think mine is a healthy attitude.

    Anyway, you’d expect complaints against feinters to come from people that never exploit any aspect of the gameplay, but it’s funny because there’s lots of players that use other “dirty” tricks and like to complain too.

    For instance, there’s 2 guys on my server that are so biased against feints that it’s pretty fun to feint just to piss them off. It’s absurd, even, because they systematically abuse other mechanics.

    One of them uses third person perspective. He’s rank 50, btw, and he’s an absolute beast. That’s right, 3PP and he’s very good. His style is quite aggressive, great drags, b0ckswings (yeah, ROHs), etc. He usually goes into 3-4-5 combo sequences, which usually desync after the 3rd hit. People have already told him that he ghost hits an awful lot from abusing drags, but his style has not changed in the least.
    He mains LS but goes with Messer too (you know, that 2handed sword people considered so OP it will get somewhat nerfed in next patch) He falls for ALL feints, btw.

    The other guy uses kite+broad/norse/HWS. He’s the most effective duelist I ever fought against because he’s mastered his technique to such an extent that he rarely falls for heavy kicks or other movements. It’s pretty much Stamina Warfare against him. The second hit of his combos, usually a lookdown stab, is almost unparriable because it’s incredibly fast, probably due to this, ehm, shield boost FEATURE.

    As I’ve already described, both these guys rely on other type of feints to throw off their opponents. Like hitting sprint at facehug, which makes your character bring his sword up a little and looks similar to a feint. The other guy RMBs likes to spam those shield feints, in which his shield is quickly brought up/down. That “feint” consumes 0 stamina and you can spam it as long as you want to.

    I’ve already took my time explaining to both of them that even though they don’t use Q/RMB to use the Feint movement, they use other mechanics that fall under the umbrella of feint tactics. And even worse, they abuse other mechanics just to get a win.

    75% of the times I duel them, I play with no feints. I’ve already told one of them that I’ll feint his ass if he fights me with a Messer and do those spam desyncs, because, hey, I need an edge too.

    What do you think makes players such as these so self-righteous? Is it even possible to make them see reason? Am I so wrong to think they way I do?

    I don’t know… the nerve of some people… right?



  • So you admitted to using the right mouse button? In public?



  • Pro-tip. Ignore what people say unless you actually cheating. And enjoy the tears.

    Also do some shit like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZ-b2TJQFgU



  • @BillDoor:

    So you admitted to using the right mouse button? In public?

    OH god, GONNA EDIT THAT REALLY FAST
    what will my family think of me



  • @ChuckingIt:

    Pro-tip. Ignore what people say unless you actually cheating. And enjoy the tears.

    Also do some shit like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZ-b2TJQFgU

    LOL@French Basketball





  • I think feints are a really fascinating aspect of Chivalry and why it causes so much turmoil with players new and old. So here’s what I think.

    I think the main reason people take issue with feints is because it’s considered a cheap tactic (they actually directly reference this in the tutorial) and easy to exploit. That last part is pretty important, “easy to exploit.” Really, there are multiple ways to feint in Chivalry, many of which like you described. But then why is the actual “feint” feint (the Q button) considered cheap and exploitative and the others aren’t? A drag is kind of a feint, right? Sprinting in face-hug range to trick your opponent in blocking is kind of a feint as well, right? The fact that your opponent falls for this is on them, and them alone. You are not at fault, you did nothing weird or “exploitative.” The big difference here though is I think that feinting by using an actual feint (Q button) is insanely effective against most players. And it is just that, pressing a button. I think it’s fair to say that dragging is not something most players can excel at when they just started playing, right? Feints though, you can just do that, and it- most of the time -works. It requires less time and effort to “master” and in a game where you can die in just a few hits it is a huge game changer in combat.

    I think it really comes down to people not being able find ways to defend against feints. I don’t believe in “reading” feints, you can predict them though, take guesses, and risks. And that’s super tense and cool, it makes combat really exciting. But for most people it feels like a cop-out and makes them feel powerless. Almost ALL video games are about power fantasies, ALL of them. Players want to feel powerful, feints take away that feeling and people get pissed off by it. I find it a really fascinating part of Chivalry and it continues and probably will continue to be a debate for as long as this game exists.



  • Everyone has their tricks. This game is about finding different ways to murder your opponent. Unless it’s a blatant exploit of a well known game bug (the old dodge out of stun) or something of that nature, then do what you want. You can’t expect everyone to be reasonable, unfortunately. So they’ll either learn to deal with it or go to a different server. Players are often sensitive in areas where they are weak (anticipating feints in this case).

    The topic of feinting has been an ongoing and very controversial one, but I can say that every scrim I’ve played in involved feints and minimal hurt of the butt. I’ve also noticed a decrease in feint complaining in duel servers lately as well.



  • @Pilgore:

    I think feints are a really fascinating aspect of Chivalry and why it causes so much turmoil with players new and old. So here’s what I think.

    I think the main reason people take issue with feints is because it’s considered a cheap tactic (they actually directly reference this in the tutorial) and easy to exploit. That last part is pretty important, “easy to exploit.” Really, there are multiple ways to feint in Chivalry, many of which like you described. But then why is the actual “feint” feint (the Q button) considered cheap and exploitative and the others aren’t? A drag is kind of a feint, right? Sprinting in face-hug range to trick your opponent in blocking is kind of a feint as well, right? The fact that your opponent falls for this is on them, and them alone. You are not at fault, you did nothing weird or “exploitative.” The big difference here though is I think that feinting by using an actual feint (Q button) is insanely effective against most players. And it is just that, pressing a button. I think it’s fair to say that dragging is not something most players can excel at when they just started playing, right? Feints though, you can just do that, and it- most of the time -works. It requires less time and effort to “master” and in a game where you can die in just a few hits it is a huge game changer in combat.

    I think it really comes down to people not being able find ways to defend against feints. I don’t believe in “reading” feints, you can predict them though, take guesses, and risks. And that’s super tense and cool, it makes combat really exciting. But for most people it feels like a cop-out and makes them feel powerless. Almost ALL video games are about power fantasies, ALL of them. Players want to feel powerful, feints take away that feeling and people get pissed off by it. I find it a really fascinating part of Chivalry and it continues and probably will continue to be a debate for as long as this game exists.

    Very well said. I think we were both typing our posts at the same time lol.



  • Haha, yup!


  • Global Moderator

    @Pilgore:

    I don’t believe in “reading” feints, you can predict them though, take guesses, and risks.

    Bingo, I Boil when people say you can predict a feint, Feint by definition = deception. you cant read deception. You can read someones movement and predict, for instant watching this Sophax charactor win the 2v2 EU comp he ran, stab feint overhead lookdown is all HE did repetitively. I dont understand how people lose to that.

    But feinting or Drags are required for game play. you cant win against an MAA or ARCHER melee with a zwei without either a drag or feint. So pick on and use it. My server is a no feint TO server and is one of the MOST popular servers to play in. I disagree with using feints, so i made one of my servers no feint. it just so happened 90 percent of the community did as well.



  • @Lilboots:

    Bingo, I Boil when people say you can predict a feint, Feint by definition = deception. you cant read deception.

    @Pilgore:

    I don’t believe in “reading” feints, you can predict them though, take guesses, and risks.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJydSOYj0FU
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2mdlNzBALE



  • You can read feints tho.



  • I just giggle at people who say you can’t read feints.

    They never even bothered to try.



  • @Monsteri:

    I just giggle at people who say you can’t read feints.

    They never even bothered to try.

    with Australian internet pretty sure you can’t lol



  • Dunno I once played against Vanguard in some ungodly ping and all his feints were pretty easy to read. Parrying, on the other hand…



  • @parkrangerstan:

    LOL@French Basketball

    Spurs champions m8.

    3 French players to the nba finals this season (prediction). They must be doing something right.



  • Honestly most feints are readable with enough practice. I used to feel the same way but after a while I decided to stop complaining and start learning. Outside of close up stab feints with some of the faster weapons and 1 handers there isn’t much guess work. It’s a mind game really and sometimes you just panic but that doesn’t mean it was impossible to read.



  • Nowadays I’m having a lot of fun watching people spin around like crazy while trying to get me to parry. Sometimes I just hit them, but I find it hillarious when they spin around like crazy.



  • @Xylvion:

    Nowadays I’m having a lot of fun watching people spin around like crazy while trying to get me to parry. Sometimes I just hit them, but I find it hillarious when they spin around like crazy.

    So you’re doing what i did, 1 year ago. Cool