Shield Viability Video for a Developer



  • In my opinion shield users should have a riposte, but somewhat slower than non-shield players. Additional mini-windup?

    Shield is quite strong (as of now) for duels though - In good hands ofc.



  • According to new players shields are the most OP things in the game.



  • @lemonater47:

    According to new players shields are the most OP things in the game.

    Well, javs are the most OP thing in game, javs got a shield, so they actually got a point there.



  • @scratch:

    I explained everything pretty clearly however I feel I must go into greater detail for someone like you to understand.

    We will start with fight one.

    Feint to poke. Very clean connection, however you followed up with a broad cleave. Cleaves deal significantly less damage and when in one vs one situations where openings are few and far between you would want to strike as hard as you possibly can. You also did a standard right to left style cleave. I am unsure if you were trying to drag it out in order to catch the tail end of his parry which even if it did connect would not only deal less damage for it being a cleave type swing but would deal less damage due to loss of momentum (you were at the tail end of the animation when the parry connected). These types of blows can scare most classes however a knight will just shrug it off because they are heavily armored.

    Next you skillfully blocked the accelerated downlooked “chop” that you caused by blindly cleaving. The loss of stamina was well worth it as those types of blows still deal significant damage even if they are not within the prime strike zone. You then create distance between your opponent and pull out your secondary weapon. So basically you are swapping to a faster weapon in hopes to land a quicker weaker blow against an heavily armored opponent who you only poked once. With that type of weapon unless you are landing head chops in the primary strike zone it is still going to take at least three more hits to take him out which means if you wished to land the kill that fight then you would have needed to catch what appears to be a skilled player with his pants down four times within a single fight.

    Anyways he does yet another overhead chop, you 180 sprint away out of it’s range causing you to negate the blow while saving what little stamina you had left. Very wise. You come back with a chop however he was clearly expecting it and returns another hit that you block and the stamina trade continues until you run out and die. Now hindsight is always 20/20 so it’s extremely unfair of me to say this however if I was behind the keyboard I know for a fact that if I dodge a mans attack by out ranging him that if I immediately swing afterwards that he is going to parry it because he is expecting some sort of retaliation for his embarrassing swing. At that point there is a dice luck roll on a feint but if it connects then it will give me time to backpeddle while I build up as much stamina as my opponent would let me. From there I do not know who the player is so it’s hard for me to predict his next two moves.

    That’s what I would have done in regards to that first fight. However I would probably still lose anyways because a skilled Maul’ist is really the bane of this game right now.

    Fair enough.



  • @LTTLWLF:

    Yep, because I want to risk eating a maul OH by attempting to flinch them in release. SMRT.

    Jump stabs and body feints don’t work against good players, and kicks aren’t reliable enough to be used liberally. Besides you generally don’t want to be close enough to kick to begin with because you don’t have riposte. You need room to move and read.

    And as I already said, feints and FtP should be avoided where they can, but drags will only get you so far against better players. This is the state of the game.

    Also, the only reason Tim gets away with it is because he has the advantage mentally so he can afford to play aggressively. Throw him up against anyone that refuses to be intimidated and it changes immediately.

    +111111111111111111111111111111



  • @Darenger:

    Just reduce the stun time after being stamina drained, so it actually takes a bit of skill to seize the moment. Not only for shields but in general and no stun reduction when being heavy kicked with a shield.

    would not solve much.



  • @wildwulfy:

    As far as we all can see in the video, the mistake lies within your play style which gives the Maul Knight a advantage. No matter what weapon or shield you are using, you will always lose against a Maul in the long run because of its stamina drain, so you will have to make it short, somehow. Use feints effectively, mind that Mauls are pretty straight forward and cannot perform too many moves, so if you play right against your opponent and leave no room for him to play his Maul, you should be all fine. but in this case, I would say the problem lies with you and not the game itself as the Maul Knight is actually using his weapon for what it is intended for, good gameplay from him.

    Now we all know that Maul can be harsh to fight in long run, due to its very high stamina drain. But it drains more stamina from shield because the calculation bases of the weapons base damage rather than the parry drain value.

    For weapon parries, it works as simple as:
    Parry Drain - Parry Negation = Parry cost

    though as for shields, it is:
    Weapon Base Damage / Shield Negation = Block cost, which in this case is a Maul versus a Kite shield, a Maul overhead has the base damage of 132, whilst a kite shield has a negation of 5, so if my values and calculation are right, it would be 132 / 5 = 26,4 stamina per hit, which means you can block four times before you run dry.

    If you pulled out your longsword in two hands, it would be as following: Mauls overhead drain of 35 versus Longswords negation of 17, so that would be 35 - 17 = 18. which you can block additionally six more times before you run dry on stamina.

    All it takes is to press one button, you put yourself at a disadvantage when you fight a Maul with shield. Why would you even need your feint-resistance to back up your lack of reading when it is versus a Maul afterall? A maul can’t even feint that good, so just swap to Longsword and carry on.

    Faulty lies within your gameplay and loadout, so quit bitching just because shields actually have some bits of disadvantage, wish they reworked shields to make them more reliable and less retarded and fail-safe secure for people who can’t face one core combat manouver in chivalry.

    They should be acting like just another parry weapon, with the additional to being able to block projectiles aswell. if that was the case, archers wouldn’t be so overpowered if knights could use a shield as if it was a weapon he would parry with.

    That is a lot of detail and a lot of thought to be so wrong. I could not have handled the maul much better than I did. Sure I could switch to 2h and maybe done a bit better but this thread is about asking for shield and any setup to as viable and balanced as the next.



  • @LTTLWLF:

    Good shield knights generally have insane footwork and patience though, bearded’s too short to even get close to landing a hit 90% of the time.

    RIP in peace bearded axe, your combo feints will not be missed.

    The good guys will have no problem hitting you with any weapon regardless of how good footwork.



  • @lemonater47:

    According to new players shields are the most OP things in the game.

    Shield is overwhelming to new players who are not used to/know of all the game mechanics. To someone who knows the game mechanics, its like facing any other weapon.



  • why bother responding to multiple people in a single when you can HECTAPOST



  • @Userper:

    why bother responding to multiple people in a single when you can HECTAPOST

    Whats hectapost



  • @gref:

    The lack of riposte and shield up/down time is already very punishing. The stamina drain is a brutal handicap.

    There’s nothing you can do in a 1Vx with shield because of no riposte and shield block timings. YOU’RE JUST TOO SLOW! I can’t believe the complaining people have done over the swing animations for shields because in practice, actual fights, shields are incredibly slow.

    I’ve won a few 1Vx with shield but only because my opponents were not being careful or were noobs and because I was using really good footwork.

    Against two decent players, you have to block, retreat as best you can and hope that a teammate comes to save you. With no riposte, you have very few answers against two aggressive, smart opponents except to be stammed out without being able to even land a hit.



  • @Najo:

    The good guys will have no problem hitting you with any weapon regardless of how good footwork.

    Good players don’t use bearded though ahah. I get where you’re coming from though, but I will admit I’m a lot happier going against a good player with a bearded than the same player using a messer or a dubble, purely because I know I can kite and matrix that shit with ease in comparison.



  • @Najo:

    would not solve much.

    Would solve much especially against Maul, cause he can’t perform the overhead in time, needs to use low damage stab so you get a chance to recover and should have enough stam for another feint.
    Also you need to back off more and regen stam. In the clip you made him miss a couple times and he stopped sprinting to cftp, instead of backing off to regen stam you hit his parry and put yourself in range for a riposte. If you time it right you can pretty much turn around sprinting and dodge his attack 90% of the time when he’s running at you, in other words recover about a hit on your shield with every dodge you do.
    Also the Maul is a bullshit ez mode weapon and every nub that uses it should kill himself.



  • Not so much a shield issue but rather the fact that the maul is just OP. It’s so easy to use- it’s a joke.



  • Maul untouched by TB.

    Suddenly OP.



  • @lemonater47:

    Maul untouched by TB.

    Suddenly OP.

    Maul slash windup from .7 to .65 and recovery from 1.2 to 1.1
    Maul overhead recovery from 1.2 to 1.1 and damage from 125 to 132

    “Untouched”.



  • @lemonater47:

    Maul untouched by TB.

    Suddenly OP.

    Did you miss where they made it faster and strong enough to 1 shot knights? Did you miss where all stamina values changed so drastically in favor of the maul?



  • @SOC:

    Did you miss where they made it faster and strong enough to 1 shot knights? Did you miss where all stamina values changed so drastically in favor of the maul?

    ^ this

    to be fair maul stam drain duels are fun



  • @SOC:

    Did you miss where they made it faster and strong enough to 1 shot knights? Did you miss where all stamina values changed so drastically in favor of the maul?

    That was a very long time ago though. No one said it was OP back then when the changes were made.

    25th of June 2013 as a matter of fact. Almost a year and a half ago.


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