Bring back flinch in release already





  • but people cant get enough of dem trades man. theyll put in the old code and game will just be people walking everywhere to make sure they dont get flinched and can still do their hi skill lmb/roh trades



  • they should just enable flinch in release without the sprint thing so its consistent

    its just annoying being traded by lag or whatever, i have faster input and read feints and i still get traded sometimes when i punish them its disgusting

    trades are the only bad thing in chiv right now tbh, trades and range is 90% of the dmg that hits me that fucking says something

    when someone is low hp hes just a free kill 95% of the time because you can just trade him fast and thats like half the meta right now, when you have the ability to kill someone with 1 more hit, you trade him.



  • No. Flinch in release is the worst crap ever. crushed be quiet. did you have to do with the suggestions that led up to the changes in the june 2013 patch? i wouldn’t be suprised.



  • Flinch in release only makes sense if their weapon is bigger.
    Mace, Axe, Sword, from heaviest to lightest. Going by this logic, maul would have the advantage of not being FiR’d except by other mauls, plus this creates a type of rock, paper, scissors playstyle which is also terrible, but just re-enabling FiR is also a bad idea. If we nerf archer damage to Knight/Van then restore projectile flinch, that would be a good start.



  • @Psyfon:

    No. Flinch in release is the worst crap ever. crushed be quiet. did you have to do with the suggestions that led up to the changes in the june 2013 patch? i wouldn’t be suprised.

    FiR would be a great thing to have in the game assuming it was handled in its own patch and not merely a small change in the code. weapon timings would need to be adjusted on a lot of things like maul but the game would benefit greatly as it would properly reward initiative, recognizing when an engagement with an opponent is at a stale mate first and attacking…god it’d be great. current flinch system allows you to literally be lazier or slower than your opponent in reacting to the situation and come out as good or better than him. its retarded.



  • @CRUSHED:

    they should just enable flinch in release without the sprint thing so its consistent

    its just annoying being traded by lag or whatever, i have faster input and read feints and i still get traded sometimes when i punish them its disgusting

    trades are the only bad thing in chiv right now tbh, trades and range is 90% of the dmg that hits me that fucking says something

    when someone is low hp hes just a free kill 95% of the time because you can just trade him fast and thats like half the meta right now, when you have the ability to kill someone with 1 more hit, you trade him.

    yeah i was just joking with the sprint thing but i doubt tb would dedicate an entire balance patch to enabling FiR which is what I think would be necessary, considering how big a buff this could be to maa and how big a nerf itd be to something like maul, or maybe even worse weapons like polehammer that are already pretty bad but at least niche. then again, even if they just added FiR and kept everything else the same, it probably wouldnt be any worse and still might be better than what we have now lol.



  • Flinch in release suited my playstyle, so I never wanted it gone. I liked punishing overly aggressive hit traders who’d sprint through the reach of my polearm to do so. Though smarter players would just sprint up and then stop sprinting for the trade. Depends on both the player and the weapon he’s trying to trade with, sometimes that stop sprint hit trade attempt would enable an escape route.



  • The game even has a hit trade in the advertisement banner, where a blue Vanguard is about to connect his hit, trading a blow with a red MAA, that hit him in his side.

    From a gameplay perspective, I enjoy having no flinch in release, since it smoothens the playing field and gives people a higher chance to hit. This makes dodging and footwork more important. I think it reduces the skill cap in team based games, without reducing it in duels, so people with less skill can have fun and get some hits in without constantly being stun-locked/flinched.



  • Both are annoying, but I think the game is slightly more annoying with it gone.



  • @UsF:

    The game even has a hit trade in the advertisement banner, where a blue Vanguard is about to connect his hit, trading a blow with a red MAA, that hit him in his side.

    From a gameplay perspective, I enjoy having no flinch in release, since it smoothens the playing field and gives people a higher chance to hit. This makes dodging and footwork more important. I think it reduces the skill cap in team based games, without reducing it in duels, so people with less skill can have fun and get some hits in without constantly being stun-locked/flinched.

    I hope I don’t come off the wrong way here but this is exactly why no FIR is bad for the game. Anything that reduces the skill cap and gives an advantage to lesser skilled players is the opposite of what this game needs.



  • Gud, TB why you no put this idea in the next beta so we can see the practical effects of it?

    Thanks TB



  • No. Make stamina values better so ftp and cftp are good options again. Ripostes should never be flinched, release should never be flinched.



  • I liked flinch in release because I could use it to my advantage, although I think most of the caveman meta problems lie in flinch time. FiR isn’t perfect because it’s not as consistent as you would often expect, plus it rewards gambling fast 1h stabs against anyone whose foot speed or weapon is considerably slower. I wouldn’t care if they reintroduced it because it’s only a problem for me when I play spears or other weapons that benefit from not comboing all the time (like Norse stab->recovery->stab for example).

    Recovery or combo time being longer or equally long to your opponent’s flinch time is what contributes greatly to the current caveman meta; it’s still too easy to spam and trade with some weapons in between your opponent’s combo or after his recovery. Of course it’s your fault if you let it happen because you read the situation wrong, but it’s too easy to be on the receiving end of a finishing blow and force your killer to parry, CFtP or hit trade every time you’re gonna lose a fight.

    I wanted (and still want) longer flinch times.



  • Yeah, I played a few games a little while ago and I noticed that MAA is harder to play to a noticable degree; it’s hard to get openings in teamfights because you will get traded so often. I think that the lack of flinch in release really buffed longer reach weaponry and nerfed the MAA’s playmaking ability.

    To put this into perspective, MAA were and still are a very powerful class in a duel setting, but now, with the lack of flinch in release, they feel more underpowered in teamplay. Previously, the MAA was pretty balanced in teamplay imo.

    Also, the slowdown of all of MAAs weaponry really exaggerates this problem.



  • cheaper cftp is just a bandaid again hittrades. You can allready spam an attack if you dont see your opponent riposting and it will become more viable if you can cftp out of your greedyness.

    The problem lies with the great amount of situations in which no player is clearly at initiative.
    For example : Maulknights can run 3meters afters getting hit by a spear but you would think that the spear was at initiative at this great distance.

    Lately a few bugs have also made hittrades more common
    1)Projectiles cause flinch animation but no flinch hence can hide an attack
    2)MAA fists dont flinch correctly anymore
    3)Hitting someone in late windup then flinching him but you still take dmg
    4)Ripostes being unflichable in combination with being able to riposte on so many people even your own teammates can help you start the riposte train
    5)Some people are able to riposte seconds after parry making no flinch even more horrendous
    6)No teamflinch



  • @Dire:

    I hope I don’t come off the wrong way here but this is exactly why no FIR is bad for the game. Anything that reduces the skill cap and gives an advantage to lesser skilled players is the opposite of what this game needs.

    I disagree. A game needs certain shortcomings in its combat system to level the playing field for players, so they can work as a team more easily and also not have the strongest players win all the time (which would cause other problems like winning team joining etc). What I mean by that is that if the strongest player wins all the time and the beginner players have no chance to hit them, they get discouraged and might stop playing, hurting the game in the long run. Also if they get some hits onto the enemies, they feel encouraged, like they might be able to beat him next time, if only they could’ve gotten that last hit in.

    If the game has no shortcomings and you could win by mastering every game mechanic, then you have a game similar to instagib UT or Quake. Not sure if they are known for team-modes, but individual prowess and skill. I’d rather have a slightly watered down mechanic like no flinch during release and take a few more hits to have better overall combat flow between groups.

    Gameplay wise it might affect the skill floor, but I don’t think it affects the skill ceiling directly. What it certainly affects is class vs class play (MAA vs knight) as well as weapon balance. I still think it is beneficial and realistic for the game to have no flinch during release.

    I also have no idea what ftp or cftp means (I assume flinch to parry and combo flinch to parry).



  • @UsF:

    if the strongest player wins all the time

    but this is already the case 90% of the time, no flinch in release causes hit trades that look dumb visually (e.g your attack hits way earlier but you still get traded, you read a feint and attack but you still get traded), its digusting and frustrating and nothing else

    ripostes should stay unflinchable im just talking about normal attacks, its pretty broken atm against people who can force hittrades

    MAA would need a slight nerf (no dodge in parry recovery) but other then that i dont see much problems with it since most hits arent hit trades these days, they are a annoying minority that somewhat ruin the overall combat atm



  • ^They can’t dodge during parry recovery, but they can dodge during an active parry, which is silly. I don’t mind parrying during a dodge but dodging during a parry on the other hand. . . No thank you.



  • you said slight nerf not classbreaking nerf. How are supposed to dodge an projectile while parrying, there is allready enough situations there you cant do anything against some random archer shooting you. also the thing with feints ;)


Log in to reply