Buff Longsword, or Nerf Messer?



  • Regardless of what you think, let me ask you… Why use the longsword over the messer? Or for that matter, over the SoW?

    Now, this is coming from someone who has ~2k hours playing SoW, and nearly 1k playing Longsword and as far as I can tell, there’s no real advantage to using the Longsword over the other two; in fact, many would suggest you’re at a disadvantage. Read carefully, I’m not saying it’s a bad weapon, in fact, it’s pretty decent. But the qualities of the other two swords sort of push the Longsword into obscurity; in the face of the other two swords, the LS is irrelevant. The other two swords have qualities that make using them advantageous. The SoW is extremely strong vs. Vanguards, decent vs. knights and good vs. MaA. The Messer is strong v. everything. And yes, the longsword is OKAY vs. everything, but why choose it when you could choose the messer or SoW?

    TB needs to give us a reason to choose Longsword again. I’m suggesting that a minor buff be given to the Longsword to make it more relevant again. And no, being able to 1 shot archers isn’t that useful lmao.

    I know many people feel the same way, but what should TB do to make Longsword a bit more relevant without making it OP?



  • Give it 1 damage on overheads and reduce slash damage by 2. SoW remains faster, shorter, less readable while Longsword would remain slightly more draggable, slightly longer with more obvious attacks, but they’d have the same HTK with their “main” attack.

    I don’t see why normalizing the HTK would be a problem, the difference between SoW and LS should be that subtle range difference and the preference of overhead vs stab. Right now, the HTK difference kills Longsword, who’s only advantage is that it can one-shot Archers with an overhead headshot, which is extremely niche (even more so due to pavise shields).



  • ^ I’m fine with that. The longsword deserves to be utilized more. Makes sense too. Longsword gets the overhead, sow gets the stab, and messer gets the slash lmb spam.



  • As a LS user I like this idea. ^



  • give ls consistent 2 htk on vanguard
    nerf sow



  • As someone who mains vanguard I have to say I fear this weapon if the wielder knows what he is doing. Can be really unpredictable. Making it 2htk vanguards would make it better then SoW imo



  • Shouldn’t they all be nerfed instead of buffing to equalize that 1 tier? There’s no reason for any knight to choose a weapon over a sword or maul. Any knight vs knight duel I generally see SoW picks instead of actual anti-knight weapons. Slow em all down and make the LS damage changes.



  • I think LS is very viable in its own right, maybe a higher HTK ratio would be nice, but the combos, range and speed feel a lot nicer for me than sow and messer.



  • How long has it been since “the patch” came out? Been saying this for years it feels like now.



  • “Give it [longsword] 1 damage on overheads and reduce slash damage by 2.”

    Why are we arguing or even discussing this? Amazing idea.



  • The longsword wins in the sexy as fuck department.



  • In my opinion the longsword is actually quite fine, has a good combination of speed, reach and damage.

    Messer is just too stronk. And I might even say it’s a bit bugged at times, I get hit while out of reach so many times. Really, really weird.

    Messer nerf needed. :P



  • Well, LS is already 2 htk on vanguard, albeit it requires a head shot. The SoW is special because it’s a strong vanguard counter (2 body shots), the Messer is just strong vs. everything especially 1 v. many. The Longsword needs to be a tad better vs. Knights than it is now; since in actual practice is doesn’t 2 shot vanguards that easily- and is (in reality) only about as good as the SoW vs. knights.



  • @TheUndying:

    In my opinion the longsword is actually quite fine, has a good combination of speed, reach and damage.

    Messer is just too stronk. And I might even say it’s a bit bugged at times, I get hit while out of reach so many times. Really, really weird.

    Messer nerf needed. :P

    Yeah, this is my point though. Of course the Longsword is fine, it’s actually a pretty good weapon. But nobody is going to choose it over the SoW or Messer unless they have a Longsword fetish (like me).



  • nerfing messer is the obvious choice.



  • @parkrangerstan:

    Yeah, this is my point though. Of course the Longsword is fine, it’s actually a pretty good weapon. But nobody is going to choose it over the SoW or Messer unless they have a Longsword fetish (like me).

    Its funny because most high ranks I know play Longsword on duels, so this fetish must be really common like the foot fetish I have. Personally I don’t play with it because I like to use range as a advantage. In fact I just play knight because Mason knight is funny as fuck and I also laugh my ass of playing dubaxe. Such glorious weapon

    On TO you can clearly see the need of a buff since damage and range seems to be the most important things on this game mode. Sometimes I think that nerfing Messer and SoW would be a step in dumbing down the game somehow so maybe its better to buff LS, but really I leave this subject to knights out there since I just go vanguard.



  • 2015 and still thinking the game will get b0lonced.



  • No reason to nerf Messer anymore the damage and OH speed nerf that was done in the balance patch was good enough. Kinda weird they buffed the OH vs MAA but I think that’s more of a fault of the damage type system the game is built around.

    Anyways the only thing stopping me from using LS in serious scrims is the lack of damage to Vanguard. I love the reach and control of LS and believe it’s feints are nearly as good as SOW but having to 3 hit a vanguard (yes I know you can 2 shot them with a headshot) in a 1v2 is just too much to overcome when you can reliably 2 shot them with Messer or SOW. If they did make it 2 shot vanguards it would probably need some kind of nerf as well though to stop it from becoming OP.

    Not really sure the best way to go about it I just wish there were more viable knight weapons in comp. I feel like you could effectively use nearly ever Vanguard weapon in comp but Knights have 3 maybe 4 weapons that are actually viable outside of duels.



  • If you nerf the messer without reverting longsword and SoW back to old values, knights will be nearly useless as they’ll die to anything 1vs2+ with no chance. Even with +1 damage on overhead with LS, you don’t land many OH in 1vs2+. MaAs will also become even more OP. The longsword’s biggest problem is it requires too many HTK in 1vs2+ and this buff would probably make it even harder since you slash more than overhead in those scenarios.



  • If i were you i’d stop with the nerffest. The game is already boring as fuck due to all the uncalled nerfs.

    Just buff shit weapons.


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