Reverse over heads?



  • @Reithur oh good to know thank you im still hesitant to buy Mirrage after purchasing Chiv and getting Shived by it but its good to know that there wont be that and hopefully some of the other glitch moves. oh one more thing since i got ya here:
    How long is Tornbanner studios planning on staying with Mirrage i mean in the fixing exploits/glitches/bugs things of that nature?
    I ask because it seems like with chivalry it was a very short time after release that the game was De-prioritized for other projects leaving many of us twisting in the wind so to speak for balance and exploit fixes. Does tornbanner plan on staying with this project for more than a 3 or 4 month period to ensure quality control and product tweaking for unexpected glitches/exploits/bugs?



  • @AJABOOBOO said in Reverse over heads?:

    after purchasing Chiv and getting Shived

    good one

    You know TB was working on Chivalry for at least a year or two after release before they even thought of DW, right? Even following DW, they still continued to patch and update Chiv. On top of that, Mirage itself has been in the works for a few years, so TB has technically had 3 ongoing projects at once. They were still able to add custom skins and fix bugs. Now they have all their attention on Mirage, so its safe to say it will be getting more than 3-4 months of updates.



  • @NinjaSushi said in Reverse over heads?:

    We don’t even know how the new combat system works or how the implemented it. I’m not sure why do many people hate ROH. Once you learn how to do it, it gets very easy to block.

    I think more than ROH, people are frustrated with the player model manipulation you could achieve in Chivalry. A few spins along with matrixing and you can disguise the attacks pretty well. SittingDuck anyone? He used to model manipulate in duels and wrecked.

    I mean, if the game has a high skill cap, if it isn’t reverse overheads it will be something else.



  • I don’t understand the giant hatred of reverse overheads. It’s not like they are invisible or even hard to block in that manner.



  • @SDS-NewAgeKnight They can be turned into an attack more unreadable than SoW stab feint. They make 2v1s incredibly RNG, they allow for a cancer playstyle of just spinning around in continuous motion without any punishment. They are a cool idea IMO, and in their early state they were fine to play with until people found out how to abuse them to the fullest, which is to be expected. They would be fine if you could somehow balance them.



  • @wizardish try running a straight line. They will miss usually. Then seize back the initiative.



  • With that being said… They still don’t make sense and shouldn’t be in the game but they aren’t nearly as annoying or impossible to deal with as people make them out to be.


  • Global Moderator

    I think most of the hatred comes from a few things: it’s silly, it shouldn’t really be possible tbh and it’s just annoying to die by it and as specially a more inexpierenced player you see it as a complete broken move and you have no idea how to deal with it. I think the majority even of the people who uses them sometimes won’t miss them ^^.



  • @Skindiacus
    first off it was only about a year of real fixes for the game if that and then they started DW for the quick money and de-prioritized MW and not all there patches fixed glitches. The fact is about half made more glitches and made it easier to exploit the animations. I helped debug the DX9.dll issue in steam forums after one of there patches and got it resolved. When the “bubble” was added around characters it really busted this game IMO. Its the reason why we all seem to bounce around each other and why we cant do things like pin an maa as a knight and it also ruins what is called line fighting because the character models act more like rubber balls or magnets with the same polarity than physical objects colliding.
    Now Chivalry:MW sold something like over a million copies in a year or close to it and yet the numbers on steam for NA is usually around 1200 people give or take 1 or 2 hundred. Now to me that seems really low for NA until you realize that over 95% of people stop playing this game after a short period of time because they realize its too glitchy and too over-exploited to be worth the time. For a company who provides a product and then has something in the 90 percentile disapproval rating after purchase means they are doing something… we’ll say not right to be nice :)
    When i first saw this game shortly after release I was like: This is the best $%^#&* (yes its only odd character lol) thing ever!!! even with the massive problems such as loss of server list, interface glitches in menu, no redundancy cycle check (get stuck in a ram\internet loop until crash) and some basic random crashes I love this game and was optimistic about its future. But as time went on and the amount of focus was shifted dramatically toward projects that TB was obviously not ready to take on i lost all faith in this company. It was clear they were dropping MW like a hot potato.



  • Thats the problem with the next generation of self entitled kids. They spend $20 of their parents money and complain when they cant have 1000 hours of entertainment value. $20 buys you two fully loaded happy meals.

    gtfo

    TBS has always done their best, and they create original games with enormous amount of fun and joy. Sure there are bugs, but this is not EA, this is Steve with a small team building something out of nothing. DW was kinda fun, if not my cup of tea, but if you want updates to CMW, if you want Mirage - money has to come in to the studio.



  • @gregcau

    lmao ok so first off don’t insult folks you do not know because it makes you look like male genitals to put it clinically.
    Second: small companies do have it hard and when Chivalry Medieval warfare came out Tornbanner was brand spankin new and had very little resources so what they managed was very nice for there size and type of company. After 4 years and at least 1 million copies sold however you can no longer claim “we are a tiny, fledgling company just doing our best” you are now a fully formed and funded game manufacturer with a product that still seems like it should be in beta for many reasons but the biggest one right now is the broken combat mechanics and animations not syncing.
    Third: DW was a hastily made product that Tornbanner was obviously not ready to commit to due to the reason listed in the end of the last paragraph. DW was a blatant attempt to get quick money and not a carefully considered project that TB may have been able to undertake a year or so later after learning more about the combat mechanics and the fixes needed therein. The combat mechanics and balance patches also seemed more knee-jerk reaction rather than carfully calculated and considered tweaks.
    fourth: MIrrage is another example of TB listening to the incredibly small yet very noisy fans who wanted magic to go along with the exploits (reverse overheads and such) instead of doing real and meaningful market research. The little survey they had done on steam does not count as market research because the few players that are left are the exact players i mentioned before, the small group of noisy people who are unable to give meaningful critiques. From what i have seen it is my opinion that mirrage will not do very well due to the extremely negative image they now have among most people who bought there 1st product (Chivalry:medieval warfare) and the fact that there is a competing game called mordhau that is set to be released around the same time they get mirrage finished.

    See I complain and criticize Tornbanner studios and there products for this reason: they had great potential and still do with chivalry medieval warfare but to see it squandered in this way is sooo frustrating also from the outside looking in it looks like Tornbanner studios was only interested in separating people from there money and not doing there best to provide a good product/service.
    That is what it looks like from the outside anyways.



  • Yessss. Finally I get to break this guy down.

    @AJABOOBOO said in Reverse over heads?:

    lmao ok so first off don’t insult folks you do not know because it makes you look like male genitals to put it clinically.

    Sorry to break it to you, but hardly anyone on the internet knows anyone else, and yet there are plenty of insults. It’s more you offendee’s responsibility to not get offended than the offender’s responsibility to not offend. Also, Greg brought up some very good points which you didn’t not directly address. How could you get offended if they were incorrect?

    After 4 years and at least 1 million copies sold however you can no longer claim “we are a tiny, fledgling company just doing our best”

    Yes they can. Perhaps they cannot claim that they are a new company, but they are still tiny and still doing their best. What indicated to you otherwise? 1 million copies sold is impressive, but you must remember that a large percent of those were bought on sale. Now, take that revenue and subtract the costs of running a business for four years. To apply some scale, let’s compare TB to Valve.

    Number of Employees: TB - 19…Valve - 330
    Total revenue: TB - Less than many billions…Valve - Many Billions
    Games currently being supported: TB - 1…Valve - 2

    Suddenly TB isn’t looking like the behemoth you projected it to be, is it?

    you are now a fully formed and funded game manufacturer

    So? I’m pretty sure they were already ‘fully formed’ by the time they were making Chiv. Funded, too. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1711512107/chivalry-medieval-warfare

    This is not enough to do what you are asking of them.

    with a product that still seems like it should be in beta for many reasons but the biggest one right now is the broken combat mechanics and animations not syncing.

    Largely subjective. Many people have claimed that Chivalry’s combat mechanics are ‘broken’. This is nothing new. However, most of the ‘broken’ mechanics people bring up are actually very intentional features of the game. Also, usually they exaggerate the prevalence of them. I’ve read people stating that they see 5 reverse overheads every minute in a pub game. Give me a break.

    I will concede that the syncing is one of Chiv’s problems, but not as bad as you make it out to be. The animation desyncs are largely a network issue that is (probably) pretty hard to fix. Either way, they are certainly not gamebreaking. I might die to what I think was an animation desync once every 100 times. I die to my own lag much more frequently.

    Neither of those things make Chivalry ‘seem like it should be in beta’.

    Third: DW was a hastily made product that Tornbanner was obviously not ready to commit to due to the reason listed in the end of the last paragraph.

    Are you sure? One of their games has issues and mechanics you do not like therefore the developer is not ready to make another game? Are you suggesting that Ubisoft or EA are not ready to commit to making any more games because some of their past endeavors were not perfect?

    DW was a blatant attempt to get quick money

    That’s a pretty big accusation. It’s so big, you would have to provide some proof before I can take it seriously.

    and not a carefully considered project that TB may have been able to undertake a year or so later after learning more about the combat mechanics and the fixes needed therein.

    Again, you are presenting this as more than just opinion. That entire paragraph was like a thesis statement that you were going to back up later, except you never did.

    The combat mechanics and balance patches also seemed more knee-jerk reaction rather than carfully calculated and considered tweaks.

    What they seemed like to you is irrelevant.

    fourth: MIrrage is another example of TB listening to the incredibly small yet very noisy fans who wanted magic to go along with the exploits (reverse overheads and such) instead of doing real and meaningful market research.

    This is wrong on so many levels. These ‘fans’ who wanted magic in chiv, as far as I know, do not exist. They were certainly not vocal. I dare you to search the forums and try to find a single thread where people were ‘noisily’ asking TB for magic in Chiv.

    Have you seen how negative people were to there being magic in Mirage? TB was actively going against what the noisy people wanted in favour of making the game they wanted to make. They have explained many times why they chose the theme and mechanics for Mirage, along with why they decided to make it in the first place.

    At this point it’s pretty obvious you’re just making stuff up.

    The little survey they had done on steam does not count as market research because the few players that are left are the exact players i mentioned before, the small group of noisy people who are unable to give meaningful critiques.

    The survey you are referencing was conducted after development of Mirage had started. You cannot be serious.

    From what i have seen it is my opinion that mirrage will not do very well due to the extremely negative image they now have among most people who bought there 1st product (Chivalry:medieval warfare)

    I call this the “whatever group I’m in is the biggest” syndrome. I would be inclined to believe that the majority of Chivalry players have a positive or neutral image of TB. If the majority of players had an ‘extremely negative’ view of TB, there wouldn’t still be people playing Chivalry, would there?

    and the fact that there is a competing game called mordhau that is set to be released around the same time they get mirrage finished.

    I disagree that Mordhau is a competing game with Mirage. I even disagree that it is a competitor to Chivalry. The games are very different, and I think many players who liked Chivalry will pick up both. I kind of want to get into the mechanics of both and how greatly they differ to each other, but this is probably already the longest post on this forum’s history.

    Trust me on this one. Just because the playerbase of one game knows another game, does not mean the games will be stealing sales from each other. Quite the opposite is true.

    See I complain and criticize Tornbanner studios and there products for this reason: they had great potential and still do with chivalry medieval warfare but to see it squandered in this way is sooo frustrating also from the outside looking in it looks like Tornbanner studios was only interested in separating people from there money and not doing there best to provide a good product/service.
    That is what it looks like from the outside anyways.

    I still have to disagree with you. From my perspective, it looks like TB is a company just trying to do their thing and they’re getting way more complaints than they deserve.

    In the end, I think we want the same thing. To have a Torn Banner game be truly great. The best way for them to achieve this, though, is to get a fresh start. Chivalry’s lifespan is 4 years.

    They have not abandoned Chivalry, they’ve launched off of it. Trying to get them to fall back down to make fixes is doing nothing but hindering progress.



  • @Skindiacus
    lmao gregcau there is a bit of a fan boy. I bet they aren’t over 20-25 so w/e son. just a quick question: Ever heard of duke nukem(not 3d) or keen?
    lol don’t try to sound older than you are son because i doubt you have any experience from games before the late 90’s.

    ok so i bought this game about 2 weeks after release from beta and there was no mention nor were there any hints or guides on the “reverse overheads” and other extreme exploits on the combat mechanics. To say after release and after the complaints come rolling in that it is a part of the game is a cop-out for sure. If they were “a part of the game” from the beginning you bet your buns no one would have stayed with it long and a lot less people would have bought it to begin with.

    Never compared them to valve so i am not sure where you get that from except maybe out of a magic hat. i was saying that after so long to call oneself a small company just doing there best no longer cuts the mustard. Its fix the problems or admit you cant but you don’t try to pull this “its all intended” garbage after the fact because it damn sure wasn’t.

    Very few people play chivalry now and that is fact. There should be A LOT MOR PLAYERS for the number of sales and what you mention as a mostly positive or neutral view of tornbanner and there clearly is not. less than 1500 people at peak hours is sad for a 1 million sold so i would say that most people have a less than neutral view and at least a negative view upon this product as reflected in the numbers.

    The animations syncing is an issue with not all but around half weapons (vanguard polehammer and pole ax are not synced up close to actual position for example) for god sakes you can see then hear the difference in the weapon syncing its sad and combined with the extremely glitchy/exploitable combat mechanics does make a big difference in the game play and experience. Its also mostly not a network issue so please (insert next excuse here) for TB. Look at numbers and data and not the… NOISY FAN BOYS!!!
    Numbers don’t lie so explain to me why after over a million copies sold only less than 1500 people on average play on peak times?
    (Insert next subjective response here) Skid

    DW was a product made in haste for quick cash and yes EA and Ubisoft also make huge mistakes and failures and hence why i don’t buy there products until enough time has passes after release to see just how much of a pooch screw they are.

    Yes the DW being a hastily made product is opinion and i still think i hit the nail on the head on that one. NOTICE HOW BARELY ANYONE PLAYS and its considered a graveyard game. (its dead)

    Not fixing original mistakes or even being able to admit to them is a problem. To say that Chivalry medieval warfare is a launch point would be to welcome future failures that TB can not afford at this point.

    Not thinking that Mordhau will be a direct competitor and even take sales away from chivalry or mirrage is naive at best. People may spend money on both but if/when more people stay with Mordhau and mirrage is down to the 1200 player mark will make a huge difference. the more players the more variety and the more robust a games community and support will be and the longer the game will last.

    The magic was in the forums in steam and early forums on TB’s own site so just because your memory isn’t great doesn’t mean mine is the same. Remember I started 1-2 weeks after release so i may not have been in the earliest days but i was damned close.

    they were fully funded as a kick starter and this is what they got out? wow that makes this even more sad than i originally thought. As a fully funded kick starter the product on release date should have been a lot more stable and way better optimized to say the least. You didn’t really do TB any favors letting that tid-bit of info out.

    you are a fan of this game and anyone who has any valid criticism you try to jump down there throat. That makes you another noisy fan-boy who cant even admit there are massive and glaring issues with even the most basic aspects of there product. To call this Medieval Warfare is a bit of a joke with all the well documented problems that now plague this game. I would say you are having delusions of adequacy and are not helping TB at all but in fact hindering progress.

    this will really get your goat Skini and yes it is opinion but from the outside looking in this is what it appears to be. the level 1 - 15 servers never existed shortly after release on steam. They were put up a bit of time after release. Not sure how much time after but it wasn’t exactly a short time after release. Steams refund policy allows for something like 48-72 hours to get a refund on a game after purchase. guess how long it takes to get to level 15 on a normal person time schedule (anywhere from 1 to 3 hours a day) ?
    at least around 5 days. Now at first glance these beginner servers look like a way to acclimate people to the game but its funny that they seemed to show up around the same time the reverse overhead was becoming better known. Now this is just an OPINION but after more time and consideration it seems like from the outside looking in when you view TB decisions under the lens of “more money faster” it makes a lot of sense. If new players who just purchased this game see the “pros” (yes i use this term in quotes because exploiting a glitch is not the same as skill) and the reverse overheads they would probably go for the refund with haste or at least more people would consider it before the STEAM refund clock had run down. AGAIN SKINI it is an opinion but when placing it under the viewpoint of need for greed it makes a great deal of sense. of coarse TB wont release the data about sales and refunds because why the heck would they?..

    Skin just a word of advice: If you want to defend this company at least be getting paid for it. you may just come up with better excuses. At least be able to admit the most basic of problems.



  • @Reithur

    ok so a few of question about the “there will be no reverse overheads”.
    First: How/why are they possible in Chivalry: Medieval Warfare? What I’m looking for is a detailed explanation on what is occurring withing the combat mechanics/animations/character movement that allows this obvious glitch/exploit to the executed.

    Second: what will make mirrage so different in the combat mechanics/animations/character movement so this glitch/exploit will be literally impossible to conduct? again i would like a detailed explanation on this and not just a simple if not cryptic answer please.

    In short: why/how will they be impossible in Mirrage and why is it impossible to fix in chivalry?



  • “Exploits” like ROH are the cost of having a real time strike system and swing manipulation.

    I think that the anti-ballerina crowd needs to just deal with it embrace Chivalry and Mirage as it is or go wait till Mordhau comes out.

    If I had a dollar for every topic created to complain about ballerinas, I’d buy TB out lol.


  • Banned

    @Vesros said in Reverse over heads?:

    @AK I think you’ll find plenty of other tools in Mirage to fit your playstyle, while tools like ROH may be removed there are so many new ones added by the magic to play with!

    So is Chiv 2 confirmed?

    Or were you trained by the academy to never crack under torture… because I’m not afraid to use extreme random post tactics to make you talk.
    Lol



  • @AJABOOBOO In chivalry your weapon begins doing damage traces when it goes into release. Since you can adjust your pose based on high or low you are aiming (your spine moves with your aim) you can angle your character in such a way that the blade is behind you and fully inside your opponent’s hitbox when you go into release. This guarantees a hit with the first trace of your weapon making it the fastest way to hurt your opponent possible.

    Before Torn banner changed the player collision boxes, it was more effective to just look down and hit people with overheads. Now that the collision boxes are bigger its harder to get as close as you could in the past with just overheads.

    There are many ways to fix this behavior.

    One of them is allowing players to parry attacks a short duration before they actually start to do damage, making instant hits really not that useful at all.

    Specifically for backswings you can do a simple check whether your opponent is behind you when you hit him. These are just further refinements that are really not even that difficult to implement.



  • @AJABOOBOO Might I ask what exactly it is you want? Just for them to fix Chivalry? You haven’t really made it clear.

    Follow up question: When will TB stop being responsible for making Chivalry perfect? For most companies, it’s a few months to a year after release, and then they start working on something else. Four years is pushing it. If Mirage doesn’t have the same problems Chiv had, can’t you just be content with that?

    So I actually did a bit of editing on my last post, and I kind of deleted some sentences that may have lessened understanding. I do not deny that Chivalry has problems, desyncs, and exploits, but I believe they are really not as common as you think they are. I was also saying that perhaps not everything you think is an exploit actually is an exploit. For example, there used to be people who called feinting an exploit. That is clearly wrong.

    As for the Valve thing, I just pointed out how many resources they need just to support two games. It’s kind of unfair to expect the same of TB, which is relatively way smaller.

    Yes, the player count of Chivalry relative to how many copies were sold is a bit low, but we don’t really know it’s because they dislike Torn Banner. To find out the popular opinion about them, you’d have to do a survey or something. Either way, it doesn’t really matter. Just because something is more popular, does not mean it is correct. Source: 2016 American Election.
    You’re right. The Numbers don’t lie, but that doesn’t mean any correlation you make with them is true as well.

    Again, you stated that DW was “a hastily made product for quick cash”. No it wasn’t. You do not know what it was made for. You are only guessing. There only ones who know what it was made for are TB themselves, and you failed to provide a quote of one of them telling you this.

    Don’t get me wrong though. DW is very bad.

    @AJABOOBOO said in Reverse over heads?:

    Not fixing original mistakes or even being able to admit to them is a problem. To say that Chivalry medieval warfare is a launch point would be to welcome future failures that TB can not afford at this point.

    This is the root of our disagreement. TB should not continue fixing their original mistakes. To avoid future failures, they should be spending their time avoiding the future failures, making sure Mirage is exploit-free and polished, not by spending their time with an old game.

    Interesting theory about the timing of the Noob Servers. However, and I know you already know this, since you got Chiv on the second week it was out, the Noob Servers came out before refunds on Steam were a thing. That’s a minor dent in your theory, isn’t it.

    p.s. My name is Skind



  • ok wow so lots of response and I like it. Thank you all for the feed back especially the one on the combat mechanics.

    @zombojoe Thank you for the response and explanation on the collision boxes. Thats why it felt like there was a “bubble” added during one of the summer patches a year or so ago. I always wondered why we all bounce off each other like ping pong balls instead of being able to pin people like it was shortly after release which made more sense in combat IMO.
    A little confused on this statement

    “Specifically for backswings you can do a simple check whether your opponent is behind you when you hit him. These are just further refinements that are really not even that difficult to implement.”

    but I think i understand what you are saying. (I hope lol) although a little clarification would always be helpful :)

    @Vizzle
    I do disagree with your statement
    “Exploits” like ROH are the cost of having a real time strike system and swing manipulation."
    The anti-ballerina crowd is only looking for something a little closer to actual medieval combat and not what chivalry is now: Dance Dance Revolution (literally) :P
    It seems to me that its a bit sloppy of TB to allow these to continue. A real time strike manipulation system can be refined so it will have a maximum beginning to end swing arch. This would only effect combat slightly but it would do it in a manner where drags would still be possible but not break the animations and look far more natural then they do now and if combined with a damage system of minimal to maximum damage potential based on weapons swing and strike position would most likely help dampen the exploit factor. Now this may allow for other, unforeseen exploits but we will never know now thanks to all focus on Mirrage. Maybe TB could at least consider it and put a test version out to at least try something but who knows :(
    I would describe any potential fix in terms of a wheel in motion. When a wheel is in motion and an obstacle is placed in its path the wheel will continue to roll forward and over the object unless the object is large enough to absorb the inertial energy and stop the wheel in motion. Now if you take the same wheel in a stopped position and place the obstacle against the wheel then try to move it the wheel will not be able to roll over the object because it will be unable to build any inertia. Like placing blocks in front of car tires. This simple principal could easily be adopted into chivalry. When the swing is started and wind up is occurring its the same as building potential. Upon the initial release of the swing if an obstacle or player model is already in contact with the weapon it should count as a stop on all potential inertia and hence stop the player attack swing.
    I can’t wait for Mordhau personally it looks so freakin good. Great combat mechanics and a lot more player skin customization which lets face it, Chivalry has a lot of user generated skins but that’s really not hard to do and is a bit low priority on the things that should have been done with chivalry.

    now last but not least
    @Skindiacus
    first off love the discussions we are having. Its good to work the brain and fingers with someone who can think and discuss things logically and argue there points thus.
    I do agree that TB shouldn’t be responsible for making Chivalry perfect as it is an unobtainable goal and that most companies continue at most a year after release to continue on to the next project to stay in business. If Mirrage is not Plagued by the problems that chivalry has that will be nice and I prolly will end up getting it but thats a big if in my opinion.

    Feinting is most certainly not an exploit but a crucial part of the games core mechanics. As much as a hate them they look correct and make for much more interesting, if not sometimes annoying, fights. I would say the animations not syncing correctly on a little under half the weapons combined with things such as the ROH is a bit of a bigger issue than you say it is but we will have to agree to disagree on that one lol.

    True that TB is smaller and to support 1 game that is out and another in progress is too much to deal with for there size. If TB worked on or at least even publicly attempted to fix the ROH and other inconsistencies within the games mechanics I would be far more likely to give them the benefit of the doubt and be more forgiving on these problems but to not even acknowledge these as problems and then go as far as saying it was intentional which is clearly not the case when looking at the games hints and combat strategies after release is a big deal IMO and should not be taken so lightly when considering this companies products.
    Now to the numbers: Now true that it does not mean there is a correlation on current numbers of player and popularity with product/company but through my roughly 20 years of online gaming i would say its a pretty big indicator that something is off. The more people who enjoy a game and feel it has been made well the more likely they are going to stay with it and continue playing it for longer periods of time. Look and counter-strike 1.6 as example. I started at 1.3 in the late 90’s and it still has 10’s of thousands of people still playing it to this day. I feel that TB had a great chance to have similar numbers and ratings but has so far squandered it. So in short Correlation with numbers and popularity? maybe, maybe not but as for an indication of problems i would go as far to say yes. Less numbers over time usually means less popularity and more negative view of the games manufacturer.

    DW being made hastily is completely my opinion from observation and Tornbanner has yet to say one way or another if they just hastily threw it together. Why would they admit to doing something haphazardly when they could use more lines such as “we intended to make it this poorly” :P i jest of coarse but you know what i mean (ROH).

    The steam refund policy may not have been clearly stated but there was a policy for refunds. It wasn’t as easy or obvious granted but they still existed. I still stand by that the Noob Servers were added to eat the clock and not acclimate but this too is opinion and there has been no word from TB on this issue one way or another and there probably never will be.

    I agree that if they are no longer going to try and fix chivalrys combat mechanics and are abandoning it entirely in that sense they better be damn sure Mirrage is bullet proof and air tight before release to public. That would be there only redeeming factor and again its a big order for TB from what they have showed thus far.

    Thanks for the discussion Skind :)



  • @AJABOOBOO said in Reverse over heads?:

    @Vizzle
    I do disagree with your statement
    “Exploits” like ROH are the cost of having a real time strike system and swing manipulation."
    The anti-ballerina crowd is only looking for something a little closer to actual medieval combat and not what chivalry is now: Dance Dance Revolution (literally) :P
    It seems to me that its a bit sloppy of TB to allow these to continue. A real time strike manipulation system can be refined so it will have a maximum beginning to end swing arch. This would only effect combat slightly but it would do it in a manner where drags would still be possible but not break the animations and look far more natural then they do now and if combined with a damage system of minimal to maximum damage potential based on weapons swing and strike position would most likely help dampen the exploit factor. Now this may allow for other, unforeseen exploits but we will never know now thanks to all focus on Mirrage. Maybe TB could at least consider it and put a test version out to at least try something but who knows :(
    I would describe any potential fix in terms of a wheel in motion. When a wheel is in motion and an obstacle is placed in its path the wheel will continue to roll forward and over the object unless the object is large enough to absorb the inertial energy and stop the wheel in motion. Now if you take the same wheel in a stopped position and place the obstacle against the wheel then try to move it the wheel will not be able to roll over the object because it will be unable to build any inertia. Like placing blocks in front of car tires. This simple principal could easily be adopted into chivalry. When the swing is started and wind up is occurring its the same as building potential. Upon the initial release of the swing if an obstacle or player model is already in contact with the weapon it should count as a stop on all potential inertia and hence stop the player attack swing.
    I can’t wait for Mordhau personally it looks so freakin good. Great combat mechanics and a lot more player skin customization which lets face it, Chivalry has a lot of user generated skins but that’s really not hard to do and is a bit low priority on the things that should have been done with chivalry.

    Realistically speaking a real swordsman attempting a ROH would probably hit with lesser force than with a downward swing so it can be argued that ROHs are not really realistic I’ll admit–but hey, who said this was supposed to be a realistic medieval game?

    As it pertains to your point of setting a maximum beginning to end swing arc, I’m worried about that because could potentially mar the ability to do accelerated and decelerated attacks. In my honest opinion, trying to fix ROHs is not worth risking ruining swing manipulation or hitboxes. TB probably feels the same way since they haven’t tried to fix it.

    People could still ROH in chivalry with newton’s laws of physics in effect, as you described. An object in motion will stop when it hits an object; the swing would just stop as the very beginning of the release hits them, it would be like ROHing a wall.


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