Feedback and suggestions
Xylvion last edited by Xylvion
I know that it’s all being worked on and we’re still in the alpha stages, even so I may mention some obvious issues, except for the start screen. I may ask some questions during the course of the thread when they seem suitable as well. Most, if not all, of the feedback will be about things I find slightly annoying or want to see improved. This is my opinion of the game, and also parts of what I’ve discussed with both Gremp and Cyanide. I wrote all of this in one go so I have probably missed something, or added something to some part after I had written that I wouldn’t talk about it. I am saving my opinion about performance for a while longer as I have yet to try any massive battles, or battles with decent ping. Although 160 ping vs 50 ping wasn’t too bad, but 160 ping vs 200 ping was a bit more iffy.
The GUI is obviously under heavy construction as of right now, what is in a somewhat complete state looks marvelous, for example the class selection screen, or the HP/block strength indicator. But everything is not perfect.
-When you first get into the class selection screen after having picked a team the mouse usually doesn’t respond to the first click, which is rather annoying, sometimes it happens after just pressing m as well.
-As a personal opinion I would love to see the stats, background, abilities and such of the class I hover over. As of right now, only the background behind the character avatar changes colour; in my opinion it would be nice if the information about the class changed just by hovering but perhaps not the selected class.
-At the end of (or start of?) a map you get to see the objective and some slight story about the map itself, maybe it could be a column on the class select screen when you’ve loaded up the map instead, or is it intended to be used as the full loading screen instead of a few seconds before the blackscreen appears?
-I hate the idea that it would show up with points on the middle of the screen. Right now we don’t see them, but there’s some greyed out stuff showing up slightly to the right of the screen as you kill someone. I would prefer it to be kept simple, aka only the top right corner and no cluttering of annoying text where my enemies may appear.
-I would love it to be similar to the old chivalry one where you could see your accuracy, your K/D, teamdamage, enemy damage, objective points and so on at any time of the match.
-The idea to see the opponents abilities being used is both up and down. It might be good for information, but in a competetive game it may kill the element of surprise if your enemies are aware that you have the possessed rocket equipped for example.
-Slight information about the current objective would be nice to have access to too. I absolutely love the tiny progress bar at the top of my screen, it’s perfect in size and all that, but just for clarification of what I’m doing.
-Not much to say about it, right now it intersects with the abilities which is rather annoying as I usually press the wrong keys at times and have to correct some words.
-Even though I really like it transactioning between maps I hate the fact that it at the start of a new map shows what was said in game around the time I joined the server before it scrolls down.
-Far to small it needs bigger impact on the screen, more about it under melee, but it also applies to abilities.
-Like in chivalry it would be nice to press the button twice and have the order change, pressing V then 0 on the keyboard is a bit of a hazzle when you’re in the midst of fighting.
Abilities is what differs Mirage from Chivalry, it’s the improvement, or addition of the skill ceiling, including projectiles that can be parried, and awesome high damage special abilities or get away asap from combat and so on. I really like the idea of them but there are some issues surrounding them and some things I think could be improved.
-For example if I use Rock throw (or boulder toss, forgot the name), the cooldown will not start until the rock hits the ground, or Distortion field won’t appear until the field itself disappears, or tsunami that has to perform the animation, then wait two seconds until the cooldown even starts. During this time the icon will appear fully useable as well. Instead of having the cooldown start later it would be better if it started as soon as you used the skill. There’s no real problem with it as you could just increase the cooldown timers, however it would gray out the used ability at once and you would see it count down from the very second you use it.
-Not only for overly telegraphed abilities, such as the Vigilist’s and the Taurant’s but even for faster abilities it would be nice to have a windup on them that you can cancel, because just like with melee you may notice your opponent doing something as you started your ability and they flinch you, or you notice a second opponent and you can’t do anything against the incoming attack except hope that it will miss you as you’re slowed down or stuck in the air.
Melee is the most important aspect in my opinion, that’s where the skill lies, in knowing how and when to parry, knowing how and when to attack, how to drag, when to feint, when to just move out of the way or crouch under an attack. That’s where the most skill lies. However I will not touch upon feints, drags, or parries (except for CFtP) until the next update when there will be timebased parries and the battle becomes more fluent.
Feint to Parry, Combo Feint to Parry:
-Without the ability to do this 1v1 duels are a bit stale especially when you can play range by using your backdodge (which I love that everyone has), the transaction between canceling a melee attack and being able to parry is far too long. Perhaps make it a single button click?
-2v1 situations are completely hopeless as of right now as you’re sort of stuck in parry once you started.
-Needs to be faster, when I fought Cyanide and Gremp at the same time yesterday and tried to riposte from Gremp’s attack into Cyanide who started an attack around the same time as I riposted but with Vypress instead of Vigilist. He managed to cancel my riposte. Perhaps it should not even be flinchable similar to chiv, but if it remains with the flinch, there’s some serious need for a speedup.
-Needs a separate button, I tried rebinding it in the DefaultInput.ini but it would still only cancel with RMB; which is annoying as for example a Vypress as you instantly dodge when you try to cancel an attack, or perhaps your parry raises even though you didn’t want that to happen.
-Unlike in Chivalry when you get hit in Mirage there’s no real impact behind it, several time when Gremp and I fought eachother yesterday either one of us thought it was a hit trade until we saw the other one combo suddenly and turning out that person didn’t lose the slightest bit of health. MINOR screenshakes or something of the sort to show it was you that got hit would be a great help.
Hitting an opponent:
-Same as when getting hit, it doesn’t feel as if I hit someone, there’s no real impact, I do enjoy the little crosshair hint, but that’s not enough in the heat of multiplayer battle, I only just noticed it as I tried against a bot.
-Would be nice to be able to bind them to other keys instead of holding shift.
Attack queue (Edit):
-As of right now it feels sorta sluggish and not fluent at all, it feels like it queues several attacks when I double click an attack button instead of waiting until the next attack in the queue’s windup. This might just be imaginary due to not being able to cancel attacks reliably.
Movement is a part of the melee combat, footwork is the base for being a good player in games like chivalry, in the same way as knowing how to turn and how much boost you need is how you get around in games like Rocket league.
-I love this, it brings a new element into the game, considering everyone has it I think it’s rather balanced unlike in chivalry where you could only dodge as a MAA. However I see a few problems with it when there’s no real sprint.
-When you jump forwards it feels rather slow and sluggish, then you hit the ground way too fast, I would prefer the forward jump being slightly longer and higher than the backwards and sidejumps. But not as much as the Tinkers dodge ability.
-Why not just make us able to sprint with the shift key when we want to? I see no reason for this as second wind is simply just another name for sprinting, but you can’t choose when you activate it. Alternative attacks and possessions could be bound to LeftAlt instead which would make me a whole lot happier.
-It is far too limited, being able to avoid an attack by crouching is almost impossible in Mirage, or being able to bend your body backwards to not get hit by that stab aimed for your head. It brings a whole new element to the game. It doesn’t have to be as over the top as chivalry, but being able to control your own characters torso was an amazing aspect of your last game.
-The spectator cam is a bit fast, I just imagine it from the perspective of casters from MGA etc. I don’t mind its current speed, but being able to pan it around slower would be much appreciated.
I’m not going to add that much feedback about the maps for the moment being as there’s not alot to add about them for the moment being.
-Too short on most maps, Gov has 4 objectives which is nice and all, the map itself feels somewhat perfect. Market and that Ruins thingy are a bit too short imo and could have a lot more added to them. market would be perfect for something similar to stoneshill with burning houses (in this case stalls because the houses are made of sandstone) and killing peasants/commoners. and The ruins could easily have a king stage or something of the sort at the end.
More Z-axis focus:
-With the ability to climb ledges I would like to see more focus on parkouring around the maps, perhaps onto roofs, between crates through windows and running through living rooms. Now I know this would be a lot of extra work, but with the ability to use the Z-axis unlike in chivalry where you really couldn’t climb anything there is a huge amount of potential for it.
-(This could obviously mean the addition of another movement ability, aka running on walls, not sure if people would enjoy that, but for me it’d bring in a new element of surprise and skill as it’s about movement.)
Classes, their abilities, and balance changes.
The classes of the game are rather funny but quite different. There’s the two ranged based classes, Alchemancer and Entropist, The heavy melee classes, Taurant and Vigilist, and the amazing light classes, Vypress and Tinker. There will obviously always have to be balance changes in any type of game, people notice new “exploits” or unintended ways and features of certain weapons, or in game skills at all times. Remember this is how they are during build 48108.
I’m not very fond of his base-helmet, but the other two look badass, or you could have him looking like Vin Diesel. The class itself is quite good, it has the most HP, and the weapon seems to deal the most damage, however he lacks abilities to avoid attacks and only has 2 ranged abilities to choose from, which is a good thing. His weapon is a little slow, if he misses an attack the enemy will surely hit him in between, but that has mostly to do with there not being a CFtP or FtP. As of this build his abilities are far too telegraphed, all of them, which makes them hard to land at all, except if you throw a boulder at the wall behind someone, that’s quite funny. He is easily beaten by all classes except the Alchemancer as of right now.
- Rock Throw:
Such a long windup anyone can walk away from it, the bounce helps a bit though as you can use your surrondings tactically.
- Slam Hog:
It’s a nice ability, slightly faster than Rock throw and with a mix of melee and ranged damage, probably the only skill I really like with him.
Quite a fair attack, a bit too much telegraphing perhaps, but it works quite well if it hits, the damage isn’t that much higher than his regular overhead though. perhaps giving it a bit of an AoE effect would help?
Way too short, it needs extended range to be viable at all, think about Link’s sword when coated in magic.
- Leap Slam:
Too much telegraphing, otherwise a great ability as you get some allevation and it has quite some range.
Quite an okay attack, perhaps some more control while performing it would help.
I love his voice commands, and his abilities are fun, though they may need a bit of tweaking He himself needs a lot of work in my opinion as he atm can’t evne parry which is a basic game mechanic which a majority of skill will most likely revolve around. Give him a parry, it could be a force field looking similar to the distortion field of the previous alpha build but in the colour of the team. Not being able to parry is a pain. His regular attack is too fast and spammy, right now if you riposte against him, even as a Vypress you will trade the riposte, it’s even worse with the two slower classes.
Needs a better name like Heart of the Phoenix :^). It is far harder to hit than the other choice, the possessed rocket, while it makes sense, I see no real reason not to use the rocket as of right now.
- Possessed rocket:
While it’s fun to use it has to have an end timer, being able to avoid your opponents parry over and over again just to turn around and go towards him/her again is a pain to be occupied with. I like the idea of it, just not that it can go on forever.
It needs to be controllable on the Z-axis and not only X and Y. (same with magic carpet.)
I love it, it’s a bit of a trolly move, but it is really helpful at certain times.
Oh Vypress, it is a really nice class to play, with some ninja skills that I like, the character looks great, with the helmet or with the hair. her weapons are different as you use two instead of one which I’m a bit two-faced about as I hated it in DW. The dodgeparry is annoying, she can dodge by jumping backwards like all other classes, when I was fighting Gremp and he played vigilist I could just keep spamming the two and he would never hit me.
The ability to drag it made my accuracy with it a lot worse, I love the fact that it bounces around and in my opinion that should be enough for it.
- Extended melee:
As the contra-ability to the shuriken it feels a bit iffy, first you press E, shoot out your next melee attack, but the cooldown is so long there’s no real reason to pick it over the shurikens. Sure the addition of Death Explosion afterwards is quite interesting, but I would much rather have it attached to the projectile I fire off with my melee than having to use the ability again right after.
- Dash kick:
Seems a bit short in my opinon, it is a fun to use ability however as you can dodge projectiles by sliding under them.
- Dash attack:
A bit meh, nothing special about it, a bit too long telegraphing followed by a short attack, slightly longer might be nice?
Completely useless compared to pounce, I might not take damage during doing it, but it’s so short it’s easier to avoid attacks by doing a 6 meter leap with pounce.
I love it, it’s a great ability.
It is a great class, I’m a bit surprised by the decision to lower its HP as it seemed to be the tanky class previously, which I still kinda think it seems to be. Just like the taurant her skills are a bit too telegraphed.
- Ward strike:
It’s a great ability that comes in handy a lot of times, not much to add to it.
- Extended spear thingy:
Not really too impressed with this ability, it’s short, and doesn’t seem to be anything special even if it takes ages to perform.
Quite a cool ability, though a bit overpowered as it can’t be parried atm. if you use it, then the ward strike you get off two free hits on your opponent and you get up in their face right after.
- Slamming down intro the ground miss attack:
The large jump with the shouting may be a cool ability, but I’ve never hit with it as people can simply just walk away before I’m done with it, or they can hit me while I’m in the air if they’re close enough; it may need some more allevation. Right now there’s no reason not to use tsunami.
- Iron Dome:
I like it, it’s a great teambased ability forcing enemies to close in with melee.
- Healing Totem:
I have yet to see the point of this, right now I can put down an iron dome and hold down R to heal faster, which also my team could do after the use of the iron dome. Perhaps if it stayed a bit longer and healed a few HP/second that it was placed if you’re inside its proximity.
The Tinker is by far my favourite class in the game as of right now, I love all of her abilities, though she only has 3 atm, but the 4 that were removed were also great, if we don’t count the distortion field which was moved I really see no reason as to why the abilities are no longer with her. Halo stab was great, the gravity bomb was awesome and the placed turret thingy was also quite good.
- Grappling hook:
I feel it’s a bit hard to notice an enemy using it, some particles really showing that she’s loading the crossbow would be helpful.
They’re not too OP as they explode after a set amount of time if no one set them off, the main problem is that they can activate through objects such as a door or behind a pillar. At some places you can place them hidden inside stairs and such as well which is a bit of a problem as they can’t be seen.
I love it, atm I use it as an offensive ability, jumping in and attacking the opponent, but it can also be used to climb ledges that are higher up, or as a way to get out of being surronded.
Last but not least we have the Entropist, he’s fat, he’s jolly, he’s a mix of ranged and melee, he’s amazing in so many ways, especially, the Z-drags with his fully charged projectile, I love that. What he lacks is good offensive abilities (not counting the bugged drop bomb).
I like it, but I prefered it when you had some time in the previous build to place it wherever you pleased instead of just clicking. It has saved me a fair amount of times though, eben though a lot of classes can deny it by simply using their teleportations or jumping abilities to climb above it.
- Drop Bomb:
It is annoying to say the least, especially now that it’s bugged, I also dislike that I can’t block its projectiles by crouching and looking up while parrying. In this build it may not be easy to hit with it in a 1v1 situation, but if you do, the opponent will instantly die.
- Magic Carpet:
Same as Levitate, it needs to be controllable on the Z-axis as well.
- Distortion Field:
I love it, I see no downside to using it, but I think having to choose between that and the wall is a better idea than having to decide wether you use the carpet or the massivly superior distortion field.
MrGrumps last edited by
More on the Alchemancer:
I think the Alchemancer’s base fireball speed currently is too fast. It leaves little room for mistakes on the opponent trying to close in.
On the other hand, as soon as the opponent closes in the alchemancer is a goner.
If the base fireball speed was lower, but the alchemancer had the ability to parry, then it’d balance the class out. The Alchemancer will be able to survive in close range, and his fireballs will not be so OP in such a range.
(One of the reasons the Alchemancer leaves little room for mistakes on the opponent trying to close in is the lack of parry into parry - but we’ll get to that once timed parries are in.)
shived last edited by
@Xylvion The z-axis definitely needs to be actionable on levitate and flying carpet. Preferably hold jump/space to go up and crouch/ctrl to go down. I would also like to see it as an on/off ability rather than one use and done. Could float for 3 seconds then come down and immediately go back up again for 7 vs going up for 10 and having to wait for cooldown. When not it use have it regenning mana or whatever.