Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1)



  • Opponent swings but you parry the blow = Condtioned Response; the swing being the familiar stimuli and the parry being the response.

    Opponent swings but drags the swing and you get hit = Unconditioned Response; you expected a swing, but not the drag—with the drag being the unfamiliar stimuli. You parried early and got hit as a result.

    To Be Continued (In a Hour)

    CONTINUED.

    Understanding classical conditioning is crucial; not only for situations like dragging and feinting but also entire playstyles.


    EXAMPLE

    I was in a PC duelyard and my spear skill was on fleek, being #1 in a lobby full of level 30s and some 40s.

    But there was one thing I didnt count on… a level 24 that had no qualms about feinting and combo feinting…

    Feinting is frowned upon in most NA duelyards, so I didnt expect him to use them and it led to my first death. (UNCONDITIONED RESPONSE TO UNFAMILIAR STIMULI)

    After getting wrecked a couple times, I noticed a pattern forming in his technique (LEARNING)

    1. He starts off with a LMB feint, then an alt LMB attack every time.

    2. If he starts off with the alt LMB attacks, 99% of the time it wont be a feint.

    3. If I manage to read his LMB feint, he will facehug stab feint, and then stab.

    4. On rare occasions, he will OH feint, in this case it is crucial to read his OH every time.

    I was ready to kick his ass after 5 times of losing (CONDITIONED RESPONSE, TO FAMILIAR STIMULI)

    I planted him at least 10 times after learning his technique.


    The End.



  • @Hoplite-x-Viz are feints easier to read on high FOV?





  • @Zer0x593
    Most players from PC to console suffer from the same mindset, that feints are bad or cheap. This leads to their use being frowned upon and makes people have no clue how to fight against or with them.

    They then tell the new players that are feinting cause the game tells you to that it’s bad. Repeat ad nauseam.



  • @Naleaus said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    @Zer0x593
    Most players from PC to console suffer from the same mindset, that feints are bad or cheap. This leads to their use being frowned upon and makes people have no clue how to fight against or with them.

    They then tell the new players that are feinting cause the game tells you to that it’s bad. Repeat ad nauseam.

    IMO being able to read most feints is the greatest feat any Chivalry player could achieve.



  • @Hoplite-x-Viz said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    @Naleaus said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    IMO being able to read most feints is the greatest feat any Chivalry player could achieve.

    I thought the greatest feat a chivalry player could achieve is a successful counter votekick
    laugh



  • @General-Firefly thats one also lol.

    Going back to pc duels and feints, I dont feint unless feinted.



  • It takes skill to read feints. The only people who complain about feints either don’t know how to read and counter it or how to implement them their selves.
    Part of knowing the feints is exactly as you stated… learning their playstyle. But also you can go in for hit trades when they feint…



  • @GeneralGatelo
    That’s called gambling and is low skill.



  • @Naleaus lol what. Gambling puts an extra element and makes your playstyle less predicate. And usually I can see the motion he moved his body for the feint and go in for an quick rt hit trade and in merc 9x out of 10 I can stop his swing even after the release



  • @GeneralGatelo
    There’s prediction and there’s gambling. Attempting to hit trade feints usually falls into the latter, as predicting usually doesn’t lead to a hit trade and most players don’t predict.

    Gambling though is easy. They have initiative? Fuck it, I’ll attack anyways. It’s what low ranks that spam attacks do. Instead of doing that, kick em. They’ll lose stamina and you won’t be a hit closer to dying too.



  • Cause that gambling shit only matters in duels. In team fights, you hit traded, yay, now the vanguard picks you off cause you’re flinched. If all you do is duel, then you’re bad at the most important part of the game.



  • @Naleaus you don’t gotta tell me how to play bro. I know exactly how to use the tactic without gambling… kicks are phasy on console and I hit people in their wind ups all the time…someone smacks me once and combofeints and rt with their back straight I’d crouch and accelerate an rt easily and hit him in his wind up. Feints are easy to read by just holding your parry and even easier on the pc by turning up your headphones and listening for grunts
    I mean you posted in this that when he does something unexpected you got sat down. So using all elements to your disposal gambling included will help your game tremendoudly… it’s always good to switch up your playstyle



  • @GeneralGatelo said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    @Naleaus you don’t gotta tell me how to play bro. I know exactly how to use the tactic without gambling… kicks are phasy on console and I hit people in their wind ups all the time…someone smacks me once and combofeints and rt with their back straight I’d crouch and accelerate an rt easily and hit him in his wind up. Feints are easy to read by just holding your parry and even easier on the pc by turning up your headphones and listening for grunts
    I mean you posted in this that when he does something unexpected you got sat down. So using all elements to your disposal gambling included will help your game tremendoudly… it’s always good to switch up your playstyle

    Grunts desync pretty easily on PC. You can actually force grunts by feinting really late on some weapons.

    Your second part, I have no clue what you mean. Where did I say I got sat down? The fuck does that even mean. I’m saying there’s better ways of dealing with feints instead of trading and gambling.



  • @Hoplite-x-Viz said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    EXAMPLE

    But there was one thing I didnt count on… a level 24 that had no qualms about feinting and combo feinting…

    Feinting is frowned upon in most NA duelyards, so I didnt expect him to use it
    I was ready to kick his ass after 5 times of losing

    You said he beat you with the easy tactic. I don’t deny that gambling is an unorthodox way of countering feints, But it is a way.

    Example:

    When I hit someone twice and i miss the final swing and he hits me once with a slash and is winding up a second one, a log of the time I’d accel my swing or run towards one of his sides away from the wind up, if he rt’d first I’d run towards his right side and get a hit trade in…this is unorthodox in team fights but I mostly duel on pc … in my eyes I can go in for a hit trade so the gamble really isn’t a gamble. I catch so many players off because I don’t telegraph the hit trade.



  • @GeneralGatelo
    That wasn’t me.

    My typical tactic to handle feints are to not give initiative if I’m playing aggressive (easier on PC cause aiming is easier), know when they can feint and back up to give space to make reading/dodging easier, then double parry matrix, run under overheads or jump back parry if those fail. If the jump back fails, still probably only a leg hit.



  • @GeneralGatelo Naleaus has been playing since the birth of chivalry. If there was such a thing as an OG in this game, he’d be one of them. He knows a lot about the game…He actually hittraded somebody, but parried the enemy attack in a split second. This guy is arguably the FTP king so he knows a lot about this particular subject.

    Gambling IMO, should only be used if you know a feint or drag is coming, or your opponent is one hit away from death. Its ok to roll the dice and swing in sometimes but a skilled player will just stop trying to swing at you and FTP to riposte if you do it enough.

    Maul is gamble proof, before I forget too T.T

    Hittrades, the act of deliberately swinging in with the high risk of taking damage, is something a low rank/low hour would make use of frequently–its just a bad habit to get into and again, can be countered by FTP and riposting.

    The only legit use of hittrades is if you don’t mind taking damage for a kill if the player is one hit away.

    TL;DR -------> Sometimes its ok but don’t crutch.


    HOWEVER! I do get your point, if you fall prey to multiple gambles and hittrades, then that is indeed your own fault, and you should know better.

    To fall prey to a conditioned stimuli, is your folly.



  • @General-Firefly said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    @Hoplite-x-Viz said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    @Naleaus said in Chivalry and Classical Conditioning Part ll: Drags and Player patterns (BRAIN CELL +1):

    IMO being able to read most feints is the greatest feat any Chivalry player could achieve.

    I thought the greatest feat a chivalry player could achieve is a successful counter votekick
    laugh

    Parry and repost a vote kick.

    Dang… godhood achieved



  • @Hoplite-x-Viz you dont need a paragraph to tell you how to block stab and ovh. This game is muscle memory.