A bit of my opinion on CMW Archer



  • Hello, today I would like to discuss Archer class, compare crossbow and longbow, describe my vision for this class in CMW.
    I intentionally will not mention third type of Archer - Javelineer, because I do not have enough experience to compare.

    AoC Longbowman - Pros: a more direct trajectory of arrows (respectively the highest accuracy and more range), fast reload (can reload while walking), more ammo.
    AoC Longbowman - Cons: less damage, need to draw and slow speed while bowstring is drawn, slightly weaker armor, a little slower projectiles.
    AoC Crossbowman - Pros: great damage, the possibility to shoot at any time, a little more powerful armor, a little faster projectiles.
    AoC Crossbowman - Cons: trajectory of the bolts is more curved(respectively the difficulty of aiming and low range), very long reload (can not move), low ammo.
    In fact performing the same task - sniping enemies at a distance and counter to classes that do not have a shields, in fact, impose very different requirements to the tactics and skill of the player.

    The changes that I would like to see in the CMW:
    CMW Longbowman - Buffs: ability to run without changing the bow on a shortsword and maybe a little higher run speed over Crossbowman. When aiming for more than three seconds add a little zoom, only to track the flight of arrows and point of contact. Perhaps a bit more powerful shortsword than Crossbowman. Possibly quiter shot noise and quiter sound of arrow flight and possibly more silent walk/run of Longbowman. Damage from the arrow remains the same throughout the flight distance.
    CMW Longbowman Nerfs: more arc in arrow trajectory(I know that more straight trajectory in AOC was made for a balance, but it’s absolutely non realistic). Slight decrease in speed of arrow flight. After 5-7 seconds after a draw his hand start shaking and after 8-10 seconds he removes the arrow.
    As a result, Longbowman become more mobile, quiet, but as always quickly and damaging shooting class. Change of arc will require more skill to use him, but will allow to lob arrows.

    CMW Crossbowman Buffs: more straight bolt trajectory. Slight increase speed of bolt flight. I look forward to the appearance of a shield(pavise) which will cover Crossbowman while reloading.
    _CMW Crossbowman Nerf_s: need to switch to another weapon for running. Maybe a little less running speed compared to Longbowman. No zoom. Maybe a little less powerful shortsword than Longbowman have. Louder shot noise and louder sound of bolt flight, possibly louder Crossbowman walk/run. The damage from the bolt begins to decrease after a certain distance. Speed and trajectory of bolt begins to fall after a certain distance.
    As a result Crosbowman becoming a little more focused on the oneshoting of the enemy at medium-close range. And while getting more accurate shooting, he does not get distance that has Longbowman. And being a visible and audible target, he does not become more vulnerable due to the shield.
    All Pros and Cons are not mentioned in the list will remain the same albeit they were in the AoC. Just wanted to mention the terrible reload animation for both weapons, especially reloading of crossbow - you never will be able to pull the string with one hand! For this purpose both hands or hook on belt and foot in crossbow stirrup were used. Later began to use the levers and cranequin.

    I hope my opinion will help make the game better. Good luck!



  • For the most part, I share similar thoughts to what you’d like to see. There were definitely some issues with the ranged weapons in AOC which made them very ‘static’ and ‘noob friendly’ weapons and also had some very strange design decisions such as being forced to switch weapons if you wanted to sprint, something which I never liked personally as it made little sense. They’re constantly being evaluated throughout the Alpha, and we should have a really awesome ranged weapon system come Beta phase ;)



  • In AoC, generally, if you’re an archer player, you’re the medieval version of a camper - Not doing objectives, hiding behind teammates farming k/d.

    Because archers need teammates to distract enemies to make sure they don’t get shieldwalled into, when the archers’ team is dead, or absent, they can’t hold an objective, making high amount of archer-based teams in AoC pretty bad at objectives.

    IMO, it’s going to take a lot of work to change this and make archers a part of the team.



  • It sad to say but i blame lack of game markers, level design and some balance issues in AoC rather than class balance and design.
    For a large amount of time, I did not know what the next objective to do on most maps when i started playing AoC. Even with game markers added, it still possible to do sneaky back-capping and sneaky flag-runs without all of opposite team aware of it on Firecrag, door blocking on Monastery(and Archers are weak indoors anyway), shield blocking while still doing objective like capturing flag and there’s nowhere to hide behind, when doing most objectives and there lots of fast running classes who can change course repeatedly while running at you and doing 360s.
    I know most of this were adressed and i hope Archer become more skill based and a bit(at least) objective oriented in CMW.



  • Oh hey, now that you’ve mentioned it, I read somewhere here that people will now have “momentum” and won’t be able to dance as well anymore.

    This is the lighter classes’ primary defense vs archers in AoC.
    Shield walling won’t work vs a mixed classes team because the teammate of the archer will make sure you’re facing him and not the archer with your shield.



  • I say no to the shield that will come up while the crossbowman is reloading, if there is a shield that comes up while hes reloading then how the heck can you kill him as melee class? You come up to him while he is reloading, you swing at him but his shield blocks it, then once he is done reloading, BOOM you get head shoted. Also, no to the increased mobility of the longbowman, there attack is already fast enough to make up for the lost in walking/running speed i think and an increase in mobility would just make them too hard to kill them when up close.



  • @Iron-Sentinel:

    I say no to the shield that will come up while the crossbowman is reloading

    Crossbowman shield never intended to block melee attacks or at least control your block direction. One biggest problem Crossbowman have it is his reload time, on maps like aoc_battlegrounds where you are in open field and there is nowhere to hide from enemy Longbowmen(they can reload while moving) it becomes quite frustrating. And when i said about Longbowman speed increase, i meant not faster than MaA, no, i meant little faster than Crossbowman bearing a shield and a crossbow.



  • A shield for reloading crossbowmen? Hah, no…. Very stupid idea. Wouldn’t make it tactical in anyway, having to just stand there in the open and reload and not have to worry about getting killed. In Battlegrounds, there are PLENTY of places to reload. Behind the walls in the field, behind that broken-down siege tower. I say no, keep crossbowman the way it is, with a few tweaks to glitches and what not.



  • @SPY:

    @Iron-Sentinel:

    I say no to the shield that will come up while the crossbowman is reloading

    Crossbowman shield never intended to block melee attacks or at least control your block direction. One biggest problem Crossbowman have it is his reload time, on maps like aoc_battlegrounds where you are in open field and there is nowhere to hide from enemy Longbowmen(they can reload while moving) it becomes quite frustrating. And when i said about Longbowman speed increase, i meant not faster than MaA, no, i meant little faster than Crossbowman bearing a shield and a crossbow.

    Oh so your saying that the shield will only block ranged attacks while reloading? So what would happen when you hit the shield as a melee class, will it just break the shield and go right through it?



  • @Iron-Sentinel:

    , if there is a shield that comes up while hes reloading then how the heck can you kill him as melee class? You come up to him while he is reloading, you swing at him but his shield blocks it.

    you know you could go up behind the crossbow man right if he sets the shield down while he reloading he shouldnt be able to pick it back up and move it while reloading and it would be on his back while he runs and shoots much like the riot shield on mw2 but with an movement penalty.



  • @Iron-Sentinel:

    Oh so your saying that the shield will only block ranged attacks while reloading? So what would happen when you hit the shield as a melee class, will it just break the shield and go right through it?

    Hmm developers should take decision about it. But i think that you should be punished for letting melee class come close to you, by possibility of shield breaking(by heavy weapons) AND taking damage.
    @fallbackorchid:

    you know you could go up behind the crossbow man right if he sets the shield down while he reloading he shouldnt be able to pick it back up and move it while reloading and it would be on his back while he runs and shoots much like the riot shield on mw2 but with an movement penalty.

    I dont like idea of having passive blocking. I agree with “no passive blocking” rule in AoC. In AoC blocking with shield gives you full frontal sphere on block, while in MW2 you have like 120 degrees of block with vulnerable legs, slow speed and loss of main weapon, which not fully compensated by passive blocking.
    From what I’ve heard developers think about balancing shields, therefore, it can be a good idea to consider.



  • I think the amount of time the bow has been “charging” should change the way the arrow acts. A short charge would result in the arrow veering off course a tad bit. A medium charge time would make the arrow more accurate. A long charge would slowly lower the FOV, which essentially removes peripheral vision and zooms the center of your view in, as if the bowman is focusing. A long charge would also greatly increase accuracy. But if you “charge” the bow longer than that, just like SPY said, your hand would shake, and the arrow accuracy would get worse and worse until he puts down the bow. The FOV would fade back to normal once the bow is put down, or immediately change back to the standard FOV if the shot is fired. That’s my vision for the bowman.
    :archb:



  • There is pretty interesting topic about charged shots http://www.chivalrythegame.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1144
    I very like your idea and i think arrow must gain more straight trajectory rather than damage from longer charge. And FOV zoom and additional visuals completely must.


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