Beta Heavy Crossbow Once Again Usless



  • The New patch changed the crossbows power to shoot bolts faster!

    More Power but still does the same damage? Makes perfect sense! WOOT!

    Light Crossbow bolt speed increased from 5500 to 6500
    Light Crossbow ammo increased to 20
    Heavy Crossbow bolt speed increased from 6000 to 8500
    –-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The problem we have here is that iv noticed since alpha is once you shoot someone from a distance they gonna go heal since its really simple to get your hp back in no time! So ya cool a heavy crossbow can shoot further but still doesn’t change that fact people will just sit back and heal. So increasing the distance and speed doesn’t make this weapon viable in battle. The point is the crossbow is a powerhouse archer class its supposed to kill in one shot(Heavy XBOW SHOULD ONE SHOT VANGUARDS)! BUFF IT UP!

    Heavy Xbow VS Warbow

    Reload Time < WarBow
    Reload View < WarBow (xbow looks at their feet while reloading)
    Reload Movement < WarBow (xbows cant move while reloading)
    Damage = Equal (explanation below)
    Ammo < Warbow ( heavy xbow only has 15)
    Aim < Warbow (you MUST right click before shooting a xbow)

    To Come:
    Fire Arrows < Warbow
    Haven’t heard anything about fire bolts

    Sure the heavy xbow does more damage but to such an extent it doesn’t matter, let me explain, MMA are known to use shields, therefor the chances are already decreased significantly to one shot them so therefor saying the advantage of using a heavy crossbow is killing a MMA is almost not worth it. Let alone with all the flaws with the xbows i have a better chance using a Warbow to kill a MMA then I do with a Heavy Crossbow.

    Run, turn around, shoot, Run, turn around, shoot, are known to be what Warbow users do. Cant do that with a xbow, its more like shoot, hide, reload, shoot, hide, reload. Much slower pace including the time you need to run and find a spot to reload plus the amount of time too reload.

    What Im trying to say is I have a better chance of hitting a target twice with a Warbow because of its speed and advantages than i do hitting it once with a heavy crossbow. Therefor the chances of me killing a MMA as a Heavy crossbow is same or less than a Warbow.



  • Agreed 100%… and this is coming from someone who was a dedicated crossbow user in AOC for years. I no longer use the crossbow and use the warbow instead for the exact reasons that Russian listed.

    I wrote a similar thread about this but it is older and less tactful than this one.
    url=http://www.chivalrythegame.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4353



  • Whatever the heavy crossbow is capable of doing, the war bow is better than it in most turns.



  • @RussianMafia:

    Heavy XBOW SHOULD ONE SHOT VANGUARDS)! BUFF IT UP!

    plz no! Atm you are near dead when you get hit by one (96 dmg) and that’s hard enough! A decent archer will allways kill you because you dont have a shild. (An headshot kills you anyway). Dont give them the power to onehit you easily from far distance.

    You are able to hurt him extremly hard from far distance without getting touched… how can you complain about the thing that he has a chance to survive? Support a teammate. Hit his enemy befor he engaged the fight so he has no chance to survive it!

    Buffing the power is not the way they should make xbows and bows equal. I would like to have a small amount of piercing damage through shilds. But first we has to look what the speed increase give to the xbows.



  • @Goradin:

    @RussianMafia:

    Heavy XBOW SHOULD ONE SHOT VANGUARDS)! BUFF IT UP!

    plz no! Atm you are near dead when you get hit by one (96 dmg) and that’s hard enough!

    If I shoot you in the leg, will you scream in agony and possible faint or have 4 HP left?



  • @Easterlake:

    If I shoot you in the leg, will you scream in agony and possible faint or have 4 HP left?

    I dont get the point of your post. I will have 50 hp left and now?



  • Instead of doing more damage, perhaps projectile weapons (or just crossbows) should do snare damage - meaning for a portion of time after being hit the target is slowed.

    Slowing the target with a successful hit would offset some of the crossbows disadvantageous reload time.



  • The heavy xbow should definitely be doing the same damage as the AoC xbow. That would make sense considering the reload time. Also the fact that it doesn’t 1shot HK in the head is proof there is a problem.



  • Aren’t all the problems with the h.xbow equally valid (or even more so) for the light & medium xbows?



  • @Goradin:

    @RussianMafia:

    Heavy XBOW SHOULD ONE SHOT VANGUARDS)! BUFF IT UP!

    plz no! Atm you are near dead when you get hit by one (96 dmg) and that’s hard enough! A decent archer will allways kill you because you dont have a shild. (An headshot kills you anyway). Dont give them the power to onehit you easily from far distance.

    You are able to hurt him extremly hard from far distance without getting touched… how can you complain about the thing that he has a chance to survive? Support a teammate. Hit his enemy befor he engaged the fight so he has no chance to survive it!

    Buffing the power is not the way they should make xbows and bows equal. I would like to have a small amount of piercing damage through shilds. But first we has to look what the speed increase give to the xbows.

    See here is the problem, i can shoot you once with a heavy crossbow you either run to heal because the reload time is so great you could easily find cover, or we start fighting sword wise and one stab shall kill you.

    A Warbow can shoot you once and stab you once and you’ll die just like a heavy crossbows situation but the warbow can fire couple more shots and move while reloading which inturn has more % of killing you before pulling its sword out and stabbing you once to finish you off

    get my drift?

    the crossbow isn’t viable at all



  • @RussianMafia:

    get my drift?

    the crossbow isn’t viable at all

    i nerver said that xbows are better than bows;) The patch can change this. I still disagree. You can 1 shot 3 of 4 classes in the head and 2 in the chest. beeing able to 1 shot 3 classes in the chest is op and would be very frustrating for all melee classes.
    I dont get your point. Your idea would make the archer class even more powerfull than it is atm.



  • @Goradin:

    @RussianMafia:

    get my drift?

    the crossbow isn’t viable at all

    i nerver said that xbows are better than bows;) The patch can change this. I still disagree. You can 1 shot 3 of 4 classes in the head and 2 in the chest. beeing able to 1 shot 3 classes in the chest is op and would be very frustrating for all melee classes.
    I dont get your point. Your idea would make the archer class even more powerfull than it is atm.

    Well this thread is about xbows being useless because warbows has them beat in almost every category, wats the point of having xbows when no one is going to play them,

    warbows can one shot vanguards in the head just like the heavy crossbow can

    if you played the original AoC, the xbow one shooted all classes besides 2, why changed that now?
    It was balanced, the bow shot faster and had more ammo, the xbow was more powerful with less arrows, longer reload times and the arrows flew shorter distances

    what we have now is the bow beating the xbow badly
    It needs to be balanced, xbows are more powerful and should do significalty more damage then bows
    period



  • I personally think that health regen is stupid. Another reason this game is just becoming COD: Medieval Warfare.



  • I couldn’t agree with you more Russian. All the crossbows, in my opinion, are utter trash. Longbow class is just so much easier to use, as well as effectiveness in battle is highly more tolerable with longbow. I RARELY see crossbowmen. You know why? CAUSE IT SUCKS! I wish a buff would occur to the crossbow class. I know the DEV’s probably didn’t make it one shot one kill because people would be annoyed of being “one-shotted” out of no where, but they are pretty much removing an entire class from the game because no one is going to use it.



  • As I’m completely for buffing all of the Crossbows, I’ll just present one case example.

    Let’s take the perfect Archer:

    Warbow

    1.4 (draw) + 1.4 (reload) = ~2.8 seconds. @105 base damage, we are talking ~37.5 base damage per second.

    Heavy Crossbow

    0.6 (aim) + 4.5 (reload) = ~5.1 seconds. @120 base damage, we are talking ~23.5 base damage per second.

    The arrows fired by Warbows come almost twice as fast as bolts fired by the Heavy Crossbow and because of such a small difference between actual damage numbers, both of the above weapons kill most things in 2 projectiles, and it’s hits to kill that truly count (the DPS above should just serve as alarm bells). You are only gimping yourself by picking the Heavy Crossbow because of the huge time difference, especially if you miss a shot!

    There is absolutely no reason a Heavy Crossbow shouldn’t be 1 hitting a Vanguard to the Torso, and killing a Knight with a headshot. I couldn’t care less if this will end up nerfing an already underpowered Vanguard further; if the Vanguard is underpowered because of its sprint attack or whatever, that’s an issue with the Vanguard class itself that also needs solving and is a separate issue as far as I’m concerned. The Heavy Crossbow should have been doing this from the start. This is part of another topic, but there some alternate suggested numbers plugged into this sheet that would give Crossbows (yes, all three*) the edge they need to even be considered for any form of competitive play: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc … Znc#gid=14

    *If you think the Light Crossbow is actually a useful weapon, you’re wrong. The Light Crossbow currently does exactly the same HTK up to the MAA legs as a Warbow, and then the Light Crossbow actually gets worse! In despite of that, the Warbow is faster than the Light Crossbow, only just (which in itself is fine, but the Light Crossbow’s lower base damage is not).

    On the flip side, I will say one thing, and that’s I’m not sure why the Heavy Crossbow’s bolts seem to defy gravity so much. The bolt looks slow (even after beta speed changes), but hardly drops when in flight - it needs slightly more drop so more aiming at the player end is needed.



  • @TehJumpingJawa:

    Instead of doing more damage, perhaps projectile weapons (or just crossbows) should do snare damage - meaning for a portion of time after being hit the target is slowed.

    Slowing the target with a successful hit would offset some of the crossbows disadvantageous reload time.

    This is an awesome idea, it should slow the target enough to at least reload after hitting someone from mid distance.



  • @Salesgun4Hire:

    @TehJumpingJawa:

    Instead of doing more damage, perhaps projectile weapons (or just crossbows) should do snare damage - meaning for a portion of time after being hit the target is slowed.

    Slowing the target with a successful hit would offset some of the crossbows disadvantageous reload time.

    This is an awesome idea, it should slow the target enough to at least reload after hitting someone from mid distance.

    I disagree. While this is fine and dandy in a 1 on 1 situation its overpowered when you you have other players on you team because its basically an automatic kill for your team. Not to mention it would be incredibly annoying. I’m all for a strait up damage buff.



  • How about this, Instead of speed or damage buff, just increase the user friendliness of the crossbows, remove the need to manually aim, and have it aim quickly when you press mouse 1 and shoot when you release, while equipped reduce run and movement speed to that of a knight, but allow the ability to run while shooting it, but keep the stationary reload. :P



  • @Salesgun4Hire:

    How about this, Instead of speed or damage buff, just increase the user friendliness of the crossbows, remove the need to manually aim, and have it aim quickly when you press mouse 1 and shoot when you release, while equipped reduce run and movement speed to that of a knight, but allow the ability to run while shooting it, but keep the stationary reload. :P

    Your idea is revolutionary I could say and interesting…Not bad at all Salesgun4hire(I’m not even an archer player by the way)!



  • @Salesgun4Hire:

    How about this, Instead of speed or damage buff, just increase the user friendliness of the crossbows, remove the need to manually aim, and have it aim quickly when you press mouse 1 and shoot when you release, while equipped reduce run and movement speed to that of a knight, but allow the ability to run while shooting it, but keep the stationary reload. :P

    It wouldn’t change the fact that the warbow still beats it in almost every category


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