Archer game mechanics are the problem



  • For a few people who hate archers and declare them fine, no one takes you seriously.

    I love the game but archers are not fine. I played mount and blade all classes and I think the vanguard and knight are well done. Archers and Man at arms are underpowered. I don’t think a damage buff is the problem. Maybe the short bow needs a slight buff because it is useless.

    I played mount and blade for years and I pulled of some amazing shots with it, something that is not possible in this game. I think the goal should be to buff archers so they are viable, without making them a dominating class. An archer with great skill should do great. Both at range and in melee. I think the melee is fine, I can win if I outmove my enemies but have disadvantages.

    The archer firing mechanics are not realistic and make the bows nearly worthless. The three issues are, the hitbox size, the arrow speed and the firing delay. In order to make arrows land when properly fired I think the arrow speed should be increased and firing delay eliminated.

    When I release my fingers from the mouse the arrow should release. The target shouldn’t be able to move a couple of meters, changing direction twice before the arrow arrives. I like the small hitbox, that just means more skill is required and keeps archers from being overpowered. Although not exactly realistic, penetrating armor shouldn’t be easy so it balances it out.

    I cannot stress enough that the firing delay is the worst part about the class.



  • I have no problem at all playing archer, it’s really easy both in melee and range. If anything i think they are overpowered, i can easily take out anyone in one-on-one, before they even reach me and if they do i just bring out the dagger or the cudgel and take them down. The fact that archers can block an enormous broadsword or a mace with a tiny dagger is ridiculous and makes archers so easy to play.
    You can’t claim that the class is broken when it’s obvious that you’re just plain bad at playing it.



  • @Sitrec:

    I have no problem at all playing archer, it’s really easy both in melee and range. If anything i think they are overpowered, i can easily take out anyone in one-on-one, before they even reach me and if they do i just bring out the dagger or the cudgel and take them down. The fact that archers can block an enormous broadsword or a mace with a tiny dagger is ridiculous and makes archers so easy to play.
    You can’t claim that the class is broken when it’s obvious that you’re just plain bad at playing it.

    Right, it is clear you don’t play an archer an you are just a hater. I never was bad at being an archer in Warband, funny how I should just be unskilled all of the sudden. I’m sorry that you can’t spam your broadsword and kill an archer but from your comment we can derive that you are butt hurt.

    The fact you didn’t even comment on the game mechanics shows you have no experience playing them. Of all the games I have played, an archer has never finished near the top. It is clear you are a hater trying to detract from real arguments, but the facts are , archers never finish near the top.



  • Archer are not Underpowered, you are just bad

    I join Sitrec idea for say archer can be overpowered specialy for melee, they are able to kill all class

    for show you archer are not underpowered :
    Archer can oneshoot every class with headshoot
    2-3 arrow can kill everyone without headshoot
    you can shoot throw shield by aim little area no protect by shield
    Archer can be protected by knight or vangard and shoot without probleme other player, it’s a team play

    In LTS archer are often in first position
    Not in objectif because they prefere stay at range



  • I don’t do well with archer but I don’t think they are underpowered- they certainly don’t feel underpowered when on the receiving end so the logical conclusion is that I suck with archer. :P

    To be honest though I don’t really play as archer because, aside from personal preference, usually there are too many already on my team.



  • Men at arms underpowered? that is just untrue.



  • As a primary MaA and shortbow archer player I disagree on all points.



  • The moment I see one archer finish in the top five I’d reconsider my position. At the very least, the slow arrow speed and release delay are annoying and clunky.

    I do well in melee, far from overpowered though. I outmaneuver spammers easily but the top players beat me in melee consistently.

    I was able to slightly improve by lowering mouse sensitivity to 20, but that only helps line up moving targets. There have definitely been some adjustments to arrow speed, hit box size and release time since beta. Maybe a nerf was called for, but the clunky mechanics need some adjustment.

    For those claiming archers are overpowered, post a screenshot of an archer getting the most kills, no bots.



  • It shouldn’t be easy to get kills if you’re staying safely out of the way of direct combat.



  • @SirPorkAndBeans:

    Right, it is clear you don’t play an archer an you are just a hater. I never was bad at being an archer in Warband, funny how I should just be unskilled all of the sudden. I’m sorry that you can’t spam your broadsword and kill an archer but from your comment we can derive that you are butt hurt.

    The fact you didn’t even comment on the game mechanics shows you have no experience playing them. Of all the games I have played, an archer has never finished near the top. It is clear you are a hater trying to detract from real arguments, but the facts are , archers never finish near the top.

    Just the fact that you use the term “hater,” negates all intellectual debate on your behalf. It may help solidify a valid point in middle/high school, but not in the real world.

    Oh, the insults based upon assumption don’t help much either. Maturity goes a long ways these days, just an fyi!



  • @SirPorkAndBeans:

    For those claiming archers are overpowered, post a screenshot of an archer getting the most kills, no bots.

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f … =114815985



  • While I still think the archer mechanics are a bit disadvantageous, I solved most of the problems. apparently I was only getting 15-20 FPS. The game looked slightly low on FPS but it was enough to fool me. Once I lowered the graphics down it smoothed out a lot. My impression of people jerking around and tiny hit boxes was due to players not being where they were on the screen.

    Well, I see that in a 5v5 where at least 4 of them joined at the last minuted an archer can take top spot. But in a real match it is a lot harder. I have gotten the top spot but it doesn’t last and only a few archers are up there with me.



  • http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f … =114928729
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f … =114928691

    I really don’t think it should be possible for an archer to hold a spot at the top of the scoreboard unless the server is filled with new players where it’s pretty much a pubstomp. Archers have the advantage of being able to stay completely out of danger from melee players so it should be fair that their overall effectiveness is lower than a player who has to constantly put himself at risk of being killed up close.



  • @SirPorkAndBeans:

    @Sitrec:

    …just a hater…Warband, …derive that you are butt hurt…
    …clear you are a hater … archers never finish near the top…

    Thanks for the laugh first of.
    Now I totally disagree with everything you said. Mostly on account that your reference here comes from a different game and not from this one. (Chivalry Medieval Warfare that is!) - Or to be put bluntly- I don’t care what you did in Mount and Blade (thats teh name right?) or that other game you played an archer in. Those games are not Chivalry.

    Currently (and as stated here already by the person you attacked in your reply) - the only oddity with an archer is their ability to block a large weapon with their dagger, which is not very realistic and yet makes a lot of sense game wise. I would personally like to see it ‘fixed’ for the sake of realism but I am completely fine with it the way it is right now! Oh right, the other game is Warband! Sorry.

    Anyway. If you are going to start a discussion (since this is a forum where people bring their ideas for discussion) I would really recommend not attacking the first negative reply you get and perhaps look into it! Like stated already- It shows your maturity here, which is in large part of your reputation in this community. - These forums exist to show the developers what we think of their creations, and this particular sub-forum is to suggest ideas that we think could make the game better- all under the assumption the support comes from the entire community which means you need other people to agree with you- which brings me to what i just said about attacking the first reply that isn’t cool with you. :)

    Additionally- I have played an FFA server on my own as an archer and won fourth place with 17 kills and 5 deaths- Using just my fists. I am sure you can do it too if I can because I am not special at all.
    On Team Objective (TO) I believe archers will have a more difficult time finishing with a high score because they are a supportive class, much like the MAA. They don’t have armor, and they are very good at picking off people while the ‘bigger boys’ fight. That is essentially their purpose as far as I can view it. So no surprise there- But then again, winning is not all in life.

    So I suggest you play the game more and enjoy it.
    If you get frustrated with not being able to deliver kills so easily with a supportive class with no armor and relatively inferior speed to the other supportive class- Train more! Or find another game to play.

    Perhaps Warblade?

    Cheers.



  • @SirPorkAndBeans:

    Archers and Man at arms are underpowered. I don’t think a damage buff is the problem. Maybe the short bow needs a slight buff because it is useless.

    Did you just… :shock:

    Stopped reading there. No offense man, but when you say MaA is underpowered and the Shortbow is useless, you obviously haven’t put a whole lot of time in the game.



  • @David:

    I really don’t think it should be possible for an archer to hold a spot at the top of the scoreboard

    yes they should 8-)



  • @Siegfried:

    @SirPorkAndBeans:

    Archers and Man at arms are underpowered. I don’t think a damage buff is the problem. Maybe the short bow needs a slight buff because it is useless.

    Did you just… :shock:

    Stopped reading there. No offense man, but when you say MaA is underpowered and the Shortbow is useless, you obviously haven’t put a whole lot of time in the game.

    I see MAA are not underpowered, there just weren’t many good people playing on my servers. Now that they have been discovered, they are the biggest pain in my ass.

    As for dismissing Warband and Mount and Blade, which are the same game with an expansion, I would consider what the devs think of it. It is the first and only real competitor to this game in the genre. I assure you the Devs played it and decided they could improve upon it. In most ways they did, but in arrow ballistics and realism for archery they fell a bit short.

    Warblade is a bit more RPG, so more unbalanced, but if you give it a try, you will see where they Devs drew their influence. The handling of the melee classes is almost identical, except at a high level due to the RPG element.

    So me comparing my skill in that game to this, is very valid considering. Also, there are quite a few archer hating trolls who do not want to see archers buffed and will troll to get that done, stating there is nothing wrong with archers is just denying the obvious.


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