Torn Banner's Next Game.

  • Hello, and Merry Christmas to the Community and Developers of Chivalry. My name is Dask, and I’m hoping to join and collaborate with Torn Banner on their next game.

    To accomplish this, I’ve made the more naive, less bold decision of presenting my game concept to the community in the hopes that it will garner enough momentum to become something real.

    So without further adieu, here’s The Game.

    This is all of my current documentation, in it’s unfinished form. I beseech any and all to read and to ask questions, as I am more than happy to answer them as thoroughly as possible.

    My hope is to start a dialogue and hopefully establish this concept’s viability and potential. Due to the sparse nature of this post, I’ll continue this thread with a more thorough explanation as things go along.

    Next Post: The History of the Concept…

  • …I don’t really know what to say about this. You are currently asking a newly formed game developing group, who just released an Indie game just barely 3 months ago to, which doesn’t get their first update until January, to consider a video game concept?

    This is quite ridiculous, definitely when it’s just so early to even suggest a new game when they haven’t even finished their first content update. You do know that not many people are even in the studio developer group right? That just don’t have the man power (and possibly the money) to even think about making a new game.

    I like the concept, just suggest this as a mod because there’s a slim chance that you’ll get anywhere trying to fight the developers to make this game.

  • I completely understand where you’re coming from. Torn Banner’s infancy is part of it’s appeal, however. A smaller studio experienced with realistic combat simulated with UDK is much more ideal to me than Gearbox or Irrational . TB’s success is due to their focus, teamwork, and elegance of concept. Few studios match this criteria, and as folks catch on to their talent, others will attempt to poach their talent.

    The goal here isn’t to distract TB From their work nor to butt heads with the developers. It’s to get momentum started with the community.

  • Still say this would be a great mod, Torn Banner just has too little man power to even look from their computer screen to look at the man who farted in the cubicle. Its just these guys are balls deep in Chivalry work that it’d be nearly impossible to suggest an idea into the game without it being stamped as “low priority” or “Too much effort, Too little reward”. I’m really hoping that this is not the case in Torn Banner, because i’m just assuming it is.

  • I need to clarify some things about The Game for potential readers. I’ll nutshell this the best I can.

    First, this game was conceived after years of playing World of Warcraft competitively. The influence from that game should be apparent to any veteran of the game. Instead of a WoW clone of any sort, think in terms of a typical MMO/RPG third person combat game. The easiest description is a hybrid of Assassin’s Creed and WoW.

    Second, The Game has been in development for nearly five years. To some, the information provided may seem insufficient and underdeveloped. The honest reason for this is, the game has gone through so many iterations that keeping all information and formatting current is quite arduous.

    Three, in submitting this information to the community, I’m an exposing the concept to the risk of being poached, and eviscerated by a skeptical community. This is a risk/reward situation, as this double edged sword could either lead to progressively crowd sourced development, or for the entire community to write me off.

    And Fourth, The Game has not been altered or directly influenced by Chivalry. I stumbled upon Chivalry about two months ago and was compelled by the similarity of ideals and design philosophy between our projects.

  • @JamesDask:

    First, this game was conceived after years of playing World of Warcraft competitively.

    Was this with or without a helmet on, good sir?

    You should title your pitch, “The Suck”

  • I try not to dawdle too much on names. Same as I’m simply calling this ‘The Game’, the professional sounding pitch I’m working is entitled 'The Pitch’.

    But I always enjoyed playing with my helm aethetics switched off, if that’s what you’re asking.

  • You should really get some concept art before you pitch a game. Just writing down some classes etc really doesn’t tell a story. People need to be interested first, and your presentation hardly inspires enthousiasm. Also, the English is rather bad.
    If you’re serious about getting your game made;

    1. look for a concept artist who’s willing to put in the time, this will make it easier to get people willing to be involved
    2. look for a few smaller, good game studios and ask for developement prices
    3. perhaps create a presentation video with concept art and storyline etc and create a kickstarter project. if people like what they see, they’ll fund it.

  • dem0n,

    I would love to present some concept art, but even reasonably priced free lance artists are expensive. Translating what’s mechanically possible into a still image can be very difficult however. I also understand that the presentation can come off as bland, hence the composition of text… these docs used to be excessively bland.

    The language used is both meant to be concise and narrative with subtle candor. If approached from a purely technical angle, it ends up dry and borish.

    A presentation video though, now that would be the bee’s knees. Without visuals though, the burden of proof o’ concept requires actual game play, and then we have a chicken and egg conundrum. There’s a lack of resources involved. Hell, I’ve considered LARPing gameplay scenarios in order to present the game. I just need to find a nice robe…

  • While I admire your enthusiasm, I feel compelled to move this to Off Topic as it does not directly pertain to Chivalry.

    By the way, have you heard of Forge?

  • @SlyGoat:

    While I admire your enthusiasm, I feel compelled to move this to Off Topic as it does not directly pertain to Chivalry.

    By the way, have you heard of Forge?

    I figured the ‘Ideas’ forum was most appropriate, as it could be potentially intertwined into a fantasy themed version of Chivalry, or as some have suggested, a mod.

    I’m glad you bring up Forge, as it’s a common question that I’d like to set straight. On paper, Forge does share many similarities with The Game, but there are vast differences.

    Forge’s shtick is marrying aspects from Shooters and “MMO Combat”(which essentially means ‘Like World of Warcraft’). These are two huge game niches, an amalgamation was bound to happen.

    This might seem a bit simplistic but, the only real similarities between the two games is third person perspective combat and derivative, fantasy themed abilities. That’s pretty much where they end.

    The best way to explain this is to compare Unreal Tournament and Counter-Strike. As a design choice, Forge focuses on fast paced, flashy and chaotic action. In addition, game maps are designed with many layers and surfaces for players to traverse on. Their movement system is very loose, making the player feel unconstrained to a single plane. This description can be applied to

    Counter-Strike is comparatively ‘two dimensional’ to Unreal Tournament, UT’s weapon effects. Yet it’s enjoyed by audiences that prefer a more precise and focused game, rather than softer gravity, less constricting movement and unique weapon choices. Thinking of The Game and Forge in this context helps for a few reasons.

    The Game is primarily focused on precise, refined and masterful third person combat. The goal isn’t to create a clusterfuck of visual effects, but instead a graceful melee and spell system that engages players with intuitive visual feedback that is both fun to watch, and more importantly accurate enough to master.

    Where players of Forge can fly around like a helicopter, or get knocked back a hundred feet, The Game is much more grounded, and movement is much more important, involving negative consequences if not properly utilized.

    Now I’ve gotta be honest with ya, I would love it if my game could incorporate Wall Jumping, encouraging players to skillfully and swiftly navigate dense towns. But this is one example of a mechanic that would counter the level of balance I’m trying to achieve.

    In my opinion, Forge does not concern itself very much with Balance, rather instead relying on your aiming reticile to deem the game skill based. The truth of the matter is, when you combine a fast and loose movement system with bright and colorful, screen filling visuals for abilities, and then limit players to rotating around the same 8 abilities the entire game, you end up with with homogenized chaos.

    The Game isn’t about hopping around hackn’slashing. I don’t believe this sort of system is not compelling enough to keep Players for a long term. The ultimate goal is to fill the void players have for a place where they can truly customize their character, play in a game that doesn’t reinvent it’s balance every year or so, and still be able to play with all of their friends in one singular place.

  • So, back On Topic. As many who have visited the documents can see, The Game is not yet complete. My goal is to get external input from opinionated players, and I’ll list off the target areas where assistance would be greatly appreciated.

    ‘Aetherals’ Were very recently made. Prior to revamping the archetype, they were ‘Elementalists’ that could control the four elements. The concept was to create a powerful but challenging class that could use two different elemental energies in each hand. Players could then individually form that energy into an attack, or fuse those energies together to create powerful attacks.

    However, I ran into issues when trying to contemplate proper functions for Earth and more specifically, Water. The main problem revolved around the underlying function of earth element. Fire for damage, Earth for Defense… Wind for Knockbacks… Water, well…

    The concept evolved into attempting to use Water as a tool that modified the other elements. Combined with wind, it would have a freezing effect. If a wind attack was used on a target with the water effect ‘Souse’, they would freeze. But then, would freezing be the sole, main snare effect for Aetherals? Earth and Water for an AOE Quicksand? It just ended up seeming lame and uncompelling.

    Rebuilding the class around the magical, maleable ‘Aether’ concept could use a bit of work, but I like it’s direction so far. Suggestions welcome.

  • I understand that your only trying to be nice and polite here, but I’m going to have to agree with some of the others and say…

    While ideas and concepts are nice, they mean little on their own. I myself and the dreamer type, and while I enjoy coming up with ideas and challenging developers’ thinking, you have to realize they have their own ideas and plans too. It is unlikely they will take your own ideas over their own priorities.

    Let me give you a little advice. Try doing it yourself. Not the whole thing of course, that’s pretty unreasonable for one man and the ideas you have, but try it. The UDK tools are free if you aren’t making money off the project, and there are plenty of other game making devices that you can experiment with. Or if not, trying making some art or writing a story for it (if it has one). Just something. Like with anything else in the world: if you can’t do it yourself than you don’t need to be telling others how to do it, and some written mechanics does not show anything about what this supposed game idea is supposed to be about.

    I admire your determination on this idea, but you will need to put forth much much more than this. Don’t expect other people to do this for you. That’s not to say you have to do it all yourself, but asking others to make your dreams a reality for you is completely unreasonable.

  • Developer


  • @JamesDask:

    Rebuilding the class around the magical, maleable ‘Aether’ concept could use a bit of work, but I like it’s direction so far. Suggestions welcome.

    Just so I’m not overly critica (and because I’m bored)l, let me try and compliment some of your ideas with elements and effects here. Here’s an idea that’s easy to visualize.

    Imagine this image: A plus sign “+” transposed over an “x” like an eight sided star or a compass.

    Each spoke of the plus represents an element and each spoke of the x represents a type of ‘force’. An element on the top of the spoke would be next to two forces on the top-left and top-right. An element on the right would be next two forces on the top-right and bottom-right.

    So, on the top, right, bottom, and left you have each element and on the top-right, top-left, bottom-right, and bottom-left, you have a type of force. When you cast a spell, you cast a unique element, one of the four primary directions, as well as the two complementing forces it is next to on the angled directions. So each spell consists of an element and two types of damaging forces that make the spell type unique.

    Here’s what I have in mind.

    Top: Water element
    Top-right: Impact force (push away)
    Right: Earth element
    Bottom-right: Crush force (reduce guard)
    Bottom: Fire element
    Bottom-left: Injure force (damage over time)
    Left: Wind element
    Top-left: Debilitate force (Weaken and slow)

    So Water is next to debilitating forces and impacting forces, earth is next to impacting forces and crushing forces, fire is next to crushing forces and injuring forces, and wind is next to injuring forces and debilitating forces. When you cast a spell, you combine the element and the two forces with it to make the attack. So that would work like this:

    Water spells (water, impacting, debilitating): Water mages drown foes with massive waves; pushing them away and suffocating them to make them weaker. You can also conjure globs of poisonous ooze to cripple foes or hit them with intense steam jets to blow them away.

    Earth spells (earth, impacting, crushing): Earth mages overwhelm foes with raw power; pulverizing them and burying them with rock showers. They can conjure up roots to tie enemies and render them defenseless, or summon up giant boulders to send them soaring.

    Fire spells (Fire, injuring, crushing): Fire mages exceed in the long run with their punishing fire that both devours and destroys. Molten lava flows repeatedly damage anyone inside them, and the lingering flames of a fireball will continuously eat away at an enemy’s armor until it is nothing but ash.

    Wind spells (wind, debilitating, injuring): Wind mages cast deadly storms that freeze enemies to death while knocking them senseless. Icy blasts can inflict painful frostbite that slowly eats away at the victims life, and thundering cyclones can spin enemies around until they are so dizzy they can’t see straight.

    So, like that. Water can knock back enemies while crippling them, a support type. Earth breaks blocks and knocks back, a good defensive role. Fire reduces guard and deals damage over time, a solid front attacker. And wind both weakens and injures, a good support fighter.

    What do you think about that?

  • Framing the concept for ‘Mages’ around such a system is not a bad idea. When considering options like the one you suggested, I didn’t further my thoughts down that road because they seemed impractical for a few reasons. So here’s what lets do.

    I’ll spend some time shoe-horning that theme into my old ‘Elementalists’ prototype. Here’s a new document where the tinkering will happen; … BAOBo/edit

    But first lets crack open a beer and figure out some nuances and implications. I’ll use your image as a baseline and connect some lines. Once that’s finished, I’ll upload it to the doc. Then we’ll go over the pro/con list.

    Quick edit, it’ll take me till tomorrow to finish.

  • @JamesDask:

    First, this game was conceived after years of playing World of Warcraft competitively.

    Even if it is a joke . Still it is cynic a lot , maybe because this is a thing must be started with ?
    Not to mention the ‘’ strange ‘’ ( let’s don’t use other word … ) sense of humour .


    Someone is trying to get so bad profit for something done much before by others .
    WoW with other skins & textures & models is pretty much mod* of WoW , regardless of your own classification .


    Too much medicines these days ?

    Worst wishes

    *mod = modification , understand ?!

  • @JamesDask:

    So without further adieu, here’s The Game.

    I think I lost.

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