Dual Wielding?



  • Is there anything that has been said about whether or not a person would be able to use a florentine style? Two axes, two mace, two swords? I feel like this would add a fun level to game play without a shield. Sure it couldn’t be double the damage but maybe something like you take a hit to the power the weapon posses when using one in both hands but your attack speed is higher. or even make it a class feature of say the skirmisher. So that Knights, Archers and Vanguards couldn’t do it.

    (again sorry if this has been covered.)



  • Yes, it was posted before but i dont remember outcome, if it was.
    As for dual - wielding weapon Lancebringer should have something to say about it. Of what i know when someone fights with sword and dagger, or two sabers properly, he has a great advantage of that who wields only one weapon. More striking occasions, better defence, but also much harder fighting technique which i don’t think is easy to implement just using keyboard and mouse, unless its highly simplified.

    Cheerz.



  • …Probably the only way i know someone should develop a combat game with two swords is by supporting a “Razer Hydra” controller…

    ciauz^^,
    Jab



  • There are some games with dual wielding, though simplified, as i said. PvK2 has axe and sword, prince of persia - two sabers. When You dont know how to use dual-wield advantage, even razor hydra wont help :)



  • @yush:

    There are some games with dual wielding, though simplified, as i said. PvK2 has axe and sword, prince of persia - two sabers. When You dont know how to use dual-wield advantage, even razor hydra wont help :)

    …This two game have same combat system of “C:MW”…?

    ciauz^^,
    Jab



  • No way, bro ^_^

    i havent played PoP, but i heard there is dual, and in Pirates Vikings Knights (very nice game - free on steam), only one guy has double, and its simple. Check urself.

    g2g cheerz



  • Yush, you are correct that I have something to say about the fantasy concept of ‘dual wielding’.

    Ill create a scenario for you.
    World Boxing Heavyweight Champion vs Jeet Kune Do Champion.
    They will exchange blows, boxer may not land the first few minutes. The Jeet Kune Do Champion will land blows, but not very strong, nor effective at that.
    Then BLAM!!! The boxer lands a planted right hook straight to the chest, down goes the Jeet Kune Do Champ.
    A heavyweight boxer can deliever over 1200 ft-lbs of force in one blow.
    Jeet Kune Do delievers about 400 MAX.
    Now lets reference this to the Medieval Arts-Martial.
    A chain or leather wearing fighter whips out two falchion, a deadly effective weapon thats capable of hewing limbs.
    In comes a Sergeant-at-arms, his rank and position do not permit him to wear plate armors as he cannot afford it, nor is of station to have it ‘issued’ to him, even munitions grade.
    So he wears a brigandine coat of plates, with spaulders, splinted arm and leg cannons, and an open face barbute, in his right hand, he wields a german style mace, and in his left, he has a heater shield.
    These are equal in their own right, the dual wielder wears more leather than chain, but his chest and shoulders are protected by chain, he has a norman style helm on his head.
    They come to blows, the Sergeant swings his mace with assurance it will strike and crush limb, but the ‘scout’ , if you will, has enough mobility to step out of weapons reach, the heavy weapon continues its course, but the sergeant is quick to recover, pulling his shield up as the scout tries to land an overhead blow with his right hand, and cuts horizontally with his left. he strikes the sergeant in the chest and forearm, but due to the lack of force, does little but scratch at the plate and cut the leather. The sergeant leaps from his position, shoving the shield into the assailants throat, stunning then subsequently crushing the skull with the mace.

    this is but one outcome that could occur in a real life scenario.
    The moral of the story is, dont fuck with something you aint equipped to deal with.
    Dual wielding is something that works with elves and jedi.
    Not with knights and men-at-arms.
    but with two EQUALLY equipped, (ie two viking of same stature both physical and social) the outcome can vary based upon the choice and expertise.
    Its better for dual wielding in a pinch, say you are ambushed in your camp, grab the nearest axe and blade, and go at it, using the axe, to pull aside assailant weapons and shields, so your sword may strike true to the vitals.
    unfortunately, the game engine just isnt equipped for this sort of combat (see kingdom of heaven camp attack early in the movie, Odo does just this with hand-axe and migration style viking sword)

    I honestly wouldnt mind seeing this if vikings were in the game, considering they used it predominately on raids to slaughter the innocent fast and efficient, but note they ALWAYS had a sheild on their back just in case someone with a weapon dared show face.



  • Dual weilding? i think that notion is very arcade. With the large group of game just pandering to the appeal of having 2 weapons i believe it has no place within the battlefield or Chivalry. i agree ith lance in this regard.

    The use of 2 weapons is a raiding method for sure, as for battle i dont think it would stand up to the methods of a well oiled war machine.



  • There another myth comes down :)
    Thanks lance, but i personally thought more about a dagger in other hand, but it still dont fit into medieval battlefield…cause there is armor :)

    At first i really hoped they would make some blows landing on the cuirass or any armor just drain stamina instead of “health”, or do just nothing…but i will face reality, or “reality” in the game :)

    No game will withstand real-life swordfight, we all should accept that.



  • @yush:

    There another myth comes down :)
    Thanks lance, but i personally thought more about a dagger in other hand, but it still dont fit into medieval battlefield…cause there is armor :)

    At first i really hoped they would make some blows landing on the cuirass or any armor just drain stamina instead of “health”, or do just nothing…but i will face reality, or “reality” in the game :)

    No game will withstand real-life swordfight, we all should accept that.

    Main Gauche was used during the Renaissance, so Rapier and Gauche use was quite promenent in the 1600s and on.

    So in effect, dual wielding did see use, not on the battlefield, but on the challenge field between two civilized men.



  • One more thing.
    The dagger saw FREQUENT use on the battlefield, and the reason you dont see many dead knights is because of this one detail almost no one realises.

    Fights between two armored knights ALWAYS ended in a grapple.
    The weapons were to keep distance, but once that range was closed, a knight would grasp his opponent, and throw him to the ground, he would then use a dagger either suspended from his armor, or belt, to make the other knight cry for ‘mercy’.
    Once mercy was cried, a knight would then be taken prisoner, his armaments sometimes sold or re-used, often times not, for the respect between two knights, even of different nations, was VERY high indeed, besides, a fully trained knight was worth FAR more than a common Men-At-Arms.
    So he was ransomed back to his patron nation, and the process would repeat. This also caused the blacksmiths to have more income, due to the need of a new suit of armor, weapons, and possibly an outfitted horse.
    (equin armor saw frequent use)



  • sigh…being a knight badass…thats my dream… :)



  • Keep dreaming HAHA!!

    Grab yourself a mace and get cracking, youll soon forget about dual weild



  • I prefer long range melee, such as greatsword, voulge, halberd. But in game of course :)



  • I think it would work to have dual wielding use the left and right mouse buttons and force the user to dodge instead of blocking as a payoff to their increased damage and hit opportunities.



  • So far it seems to me that dual wielding will not have a play, your hands are full from combat alone, please watch the dev videos on combat (parry/block/hit/etc.)



  • @Lancebringer:

    Yush, you are correct that I have something to say about the fantasy concept of ‘dual wielding’.

    Ill create a scenario for you.
    World Boxing Heavyweight Champion vs Jeet Kune Do Champion.
    They will exchange blows, boxer may not land the first few minutes. The Jeet Kune Do Champion will land blows, but not very strong, nor effective at that.
    Then BLAM!!! The boxer lands a planted right hook straight to the chest, down goes the Jeet Kune Do Champ.
    A heavyweight boxer can deliever over 1200 ft-lbs of force in one blow.
    Jeet Kune Do delievers about 400 MAX.
    Now lets reference this to the Medieval Arts-Martial.
    A chain or leather wearing fighter whips out two falchion, a deadly effective weapon thats capable of hewing limbs.
    In comes a Sergeant-at-arms, his rank and position do not permit him to wear plate armors as he cannot afford it, nor is of station to have it ‘issued’ to him, even munitions grade.
    So he wears a brigandine coat of plates, with spaulders, splinted arm and leg cannons, and an open face barbute, in his right hand, he wields a german style mace, and in his left, he has a heater shield.
    These are equal in their own right, the dual wielder wears more leather than chain, but his chest and shoulders are protected by chain, he has a norman style helm on his head.
    They come to blows, the Sergeant swings his mace with assurance it will strike and crush limb, but the ‘scout’ , if you will, has enough mobility to step out of weapons reach, the heavy weapon continues its course, but the sergeant is quick to recover, pulling his shield up as the scout tries to land an overhead blow with his right hand, and cuts horizontally with his left. he strikes the sergeant in the chest and forearm, but due to the lack of force, does little but scratch at the plate and cut the leather. The sergeant leaps from his position, shoving the shield into the assailants throat, stunning then subsequently crushing the skull with the mace.

    this is but one outcome that could occur in a real life scenario.
    The moral of the story is, dont fuck with something you aint equipped to deal with.
    Dual wielding is something that works with elves and jedi.
    Not with knights and men-at-arms.
    but with two EQUALLY equipped, (ie two viking of same stature both physical and social) the outcome can vary based upon the choice and expertise.
    Its better for dual wielding in a pinch, say you are ambushed in your camp, grab the nearest axe and blade, and go at it, using the axe, to pull aside assailant weapons and shields, so your sword may strike true to the vitals.
    unfortunately, the game engine just isnt equipped for this sort of combat (see kingdom of heaven camp attack early in the movie, Odo does just this with hand-axe and migration style viking sword)

    I honestly wouldnt mind seeing this if vikings were in the game, considering they used it predominately on raids to slaughter the innocent fast and efficient, but note they ALWAYS had a sheild on their back just in case someone with a weapon dared show face.

    There another myth comes down :)
    Thanks lance, but i personally thought more about a dagger in other hand, but it still dont fit into medieval battlefield…cause there is armor :)

    At first i really hoped they would make some blows landing on the cuirass or any armor just drain stamina instead of “health”, or do just nothing…but i will face reality, or “reality” in the game :)

    No game will withstand real-life swordfight, we all should accept that.

    Well got disagree if you have ever done reenactments or anything you would realize that even if you got hit in a part that’s heavily armor still hurts and knock the wind out of you slightly crush the metal pinching or cutting you or breaking bones and wont actually just make you tried and if you applied that to weapons that aren’t blunted its even worse.

    Well claiming all this crap about knights and no references completely goes against all knowledge about them that I have and additionally claiming that duel weild styles were ineffective is just a bunch of bullshit. In truth it is by far more effective than normal 1 weapon / shield or two-hander and in actuality took far more training to BECOME EFFICIENT which did make it highly uncommon though and obviously some person like you picking it up for first time would suck total dick but if you trained day in day out like some did historically they were EXTREMELY effective, and idea it was only used on raiding scenarios is a bunch of bullshit too.



  • So you are SCA hmm? A Proper harness does NOT knock the wind out of your nor does it pinch or hurt. If your armor hurts you, you are wrong. Go back to school boy, the Men are talking.

    Addendum, you need to read my posts on armor and like items, look into realistic weapon physics and the like. You want to talk about this child, be prepared to be smacked back inside the womb of hence you came.



  • flames…

    …discredited



  • @yush:

    flames…

    …discredited

    You will believe what you choose to believe, im tired of the wannabe’s claiming they know something because a half-assed organization takes to doing it, or they see it in a video game. You know how many people compare ancient blacksmithing to what they see in Skyrim?
    How about the people who believe armor looks like what they see in movies?
    Who can forget the individuals who think sword-play should be like what they see in video games or movies.
    I put the facts out there, you know this, most know this.
    I wont post anymore information, I am quite fed up with these kinds of people consistently trying to claim that they know everything.
    I certainly do not, and if I do not, I do many hours of research just to make sure my facts are straight. And If I still cannot find a definitive, I post my opinion on the subject matter.
    I know from first hand experience dual wielding is an incredibly ineffective method, and only would lead to death of someone quite fast.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFiIDl_m … ure=relmfu
    here, these guys put combat on a near perfect display, its fast and deadly. no game will ever be able to truely capture the feel of real combat like i have experienced it (i train like these two for the record) But this game provides many hours of fun medieval styled warfare.

    here you go dual wielding fans
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4UQcN_v … re=related
    the fool thinks he can use two swords, and promptly gets his ass handed to him.

    http://www.youtube.com/user/theARMAonli … relchannel
    these guys are reviving true medieval and renaissance techniques.
    they are ARMA-Association for Renaissance Martial Arts

    The history channel series “Conquest” does some good bits, quite accurate, but not 100%
    Then again, the more we study, the more we discover.


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