Feinting Poll



  • This topic has been very hotly debated recently, and I’d like to open up a poll to get a rough idea of where the majority of people stand on the implementation of feinting in the game, in its current state.

    Feel free to leave constructive comments of any kind, and please vote honestly.



  • I remember people suggesting allowing feint to be only activated at the start of a windup, etc. In my opinion, all the problems with feinting stem from a single potentially unchangeable factor - animation complexity.

    Why is it so bad that feint can be activated at any time during a windup, be it the first 0.1s or the last 0.1s? I see nothing inherently wrong with that design, but combined with certain animations feint becomes rather… cheap. For example, the stab/heavy animations for spear type weapons remain almost static during windup. Unless a player can accurately count the windup time, it will end up being a matter of luck or distance management.

    I think it’s pretty unlikely that so many animations may be improved for the feint mechanics alone, since those animations work perfectly fine when feint is not involved. The first potential solution is to reduce the feint time to the starting portion of a windup, or even make a feint predetermined before an attack is even launched (e.g. similar to the new alternative direction swing, holding down a key while attacking will make feints instead of actual attacks). The other solution is probably allowing all weapons to block on top of parry. I remember reading this idea somewhere, but perhaps something similar to Dishonored’s parrying system would work well (press and hold RMB to block, first 0.5s you are parrying, after that it’s blocking).



  • I never had a problem with it.

    I don’t really use it though, nor do I see it being used often.

    So maybe there is something wrong with it?

    A twist! 8-)



  • I feel like feinting takes most of the actualy skill out of playing and replaces it with luck. I don’t like that very much… I’m a pretty straightforward guy and like my fights to be straightforward. Feints are good, however, breaking up “parry-fests” when 2 people are deadlocked parrying over and over and over again…



  • I don’t think most players have truly experienced what feinting is about or proper feinting in general, because it’s fairly uncommon to see it in normal game modes. I still prefer not to use it there, but it’s more at home in a chaotic mess where fairplay isn’t the main point.

    But when dueling against high skilled high level players it completely breaks the game apart and just makes it boring to me.



  • I don’t see a problem with it. My main defense against a feint is dictating the range and pacing - control both and feinting is pointless for your opponent.



  • For people voting on “…okay, but in need of some slight tweaks”. What “slight tweaks” are we talking about? There is no way to rework feint without some major tweaks.



  • Feinters destroy me because I always fall for it.



  • For the love of all that is sacred, don’t make changes based on what the majority of players decide. Given the recent steam sales, the majority do not have a full understanding of game mechanics.



  • @bada:

    For the love of all that is sacred, don’t make changes based on what the majority of players decide. Given the recent steam sales, the majority do not have a full understanding of game mechanics.

    Yes, so much this.

    The problem with this poll is that not everyone even USES feints, let alone understands why they’re an issue. Quite frankly, anyone who chooses the first option doesn’t fully understand and probably doesn’t even play on duel servers.

    In addition I believe option 3 is redundant. The game should be balanced around duels.

    I’m choosing option 4, though what I feel is that 2h feints (except on lookdown overheads and the halberd) are absolutely fine, but something major has to be done in order to fix 1-handed weapon feints. Thrust feints are also far too hard to read at close range.



  • Given the fact that an opponents feints are completely countered by simply swinging your own weapon, I feel the mechanic is fine.

    You don’t HAVE to parry, but you do have to make a choice. Intuition may strongly urge you to parry because there’s that whole damage thing when you get hit, but it’s not the only option available to you.

    You can also use shields, ducks, movement, distance, kicks and unique weapon strategies attached to weapons on both ends of the spectrum: Faster weapons for interrupts, longer reaching weapons to maintain distance.

    There’s only a few weapons where feinting feels somewhat cheap, and it’s because of their speed coupled with the damage they can dish out, not because of the mechanic. The Flanged Mace comes to mind here.



  • Given the fact that an opponents feints are completely countered by simply swinging your own weapon, I feel the mechanic is fine.

    If you’re happy with the feint mechanic often reducing combat between 1 handers to guesswork, then fine.



  • I think feinting is pretty much alright, but I’d like to see a slight change in the blocking mechanics.

    I’ve been playing Skyrim again, this time with a shit ton of mods, including Skyrim Redone. I bring this up because there is one thing I really like about the mod, and that is the introduction of ‘timed blocks.’ Basically, you initiate a block within a certain amount of time, and you take very little damage. If you just hold RMB, you take significantly more health/stamina damage. I think the same idea would translate very well to Chivalry.

    So, even without using a shield, you can hold RMB, but it won’t do a whole lot to protect you. It will do better than just eating a hit, though. For those who feel that feinting is broken and crushing their game, they won’t be penalized as heavily as long as they continue to try to block. For those who actually do block extremely well and can read feints with no issue, maybe getting a timed block can reduce stamina only a little. If this were somehow incorporated, I’d suggest making the window for a perfect block shorter than the block animation we have now, and decrease the stamina loss for the defender and/or increase the stamina loss for the attacker. If you fail to make the timed block and are desperately holding down your RMB, you still lose a portion of health, but slightly less than leaving the incoming blow unchecked.



  • Feinting atm takes a much bigger part of combat than it should imo and high level duels simply come down to who feints better.

    Aggressive play through feint spamming is way more viable than defending atm since it’s actually almost impossible to defend against a good feinter.

    It’s important to meantion though that i’m at 100+ ping on the 95% + of the servers. So my opinion might be a bit biased.



  • @vile.zoidberg:

    For those who actually do block extremely well and can read feints with no issue, maybe getting a timed block can reduce stamina only a little. If this were somehow incorporated, I’d suggest making the window for a perfect block shorter than the block animation we have now, and decrease the stamina loss for the defender and/or increase the stamina loss for the attacker.

    Too much lag difference and ping for this to be possible.



  • There is nothing wrong with nearly completing a action with a large, heavy weapon only to cancel it and IMMEDIATELY restart it again…. :?

    If feint really needs to be in the game it needs to have a legitimate drawback. Cool down timer, large stamina eater, Inability to combo the swing after a feint, etc. Some risk vs reward should be associated with it.

    Please see this visual explanation on how to properly play Chivalry:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdlg1I9HKt4



  • I don’t think long fights will be a problem. The long fights are the fun ones. There are other ways than feinting to kill a defender. Mouse drag for example. Movement is also a key factor. I would be more than happy if feinting was just removed or restricted to cancel attack and then block. NOT cancel attack and then attak again.



  • Feinting is absolutely fine the way it’s now. It’s a matter of training how good you can do it or parry it. Fighting without feints would be lame imo.



  • @reQ.saintelliott:

    If feint really needs to be in the game it needs to have a legitimate drawback. Cool down timer, large stamina eater, Inability to combo the swing after a feint, etc. Some risk vs reward should be associated with it.

    The risk, is that the other player could simply start his own attack, in which case you’ll eat the damage 95% of the time. This is where players have to start reading their opponents and their playstyles… not always applicable in random pub games, but very much so for straight duels.

    “I don’t fight in tournaments, because when I fight a man for real, I don’t want him to know what I can do.”

    I understand the frustration regarding feints, I really do. But I think a lot of people are throwing their hands up and surrendering to this mechanic WAAAAY too easily. However, that’s just my opinion. Perhaps one of the drawbacks you suggested may actually improve the system, or give proponents and opponents a nice middle ground they can agree on.



  • Admittedly, I’m not completely aware of all the variables behind the mechanic as it stands now but I do believe there needs to be a tweak.

    At this point there is not enough penalty for the feint. I realize its a video game and mechanics don’t need to ape reality completely, but lets just run with making it more “realistic” for a second. I wind up to swing a big ass sword and I stop mid-stream, my next attack will A) take more time to wind up than the first attack because I have to presumably reset my weapon to its “launch point” or B) I “shortswing” it at reduced power. If Chivalry had option A implemented I don’t believe many people would use it at all and would ruin this interesting mechanic. Option B though, could be quite compelling. After you feint, your next attack would be 50% power or full power after a timer elapses (no reason that it should impact you if “reset” yourself, say .5s or something. This tweak would leave the mechanic in play but punishes the user by dealing less damage. So it becomes a very much risk reward / playstyle choice at that point instead of necessity (at the high levels of play, not pubstomping). Is the opponent completely bloodied and all you need to do is land one more hit? Do you prefer to be a precision attacker but dole out the damage? It could make for some interesting choices.