My MAA observations, feed back welcome



  • I mostly play archer as its my favorite class but Ive been really enjoying the MAA with great mobility and rush down focus play, the following post is a complamation of my experiences playing as a MAA and my personal opinions. There is a brick wall i’m running into however, it is the weapon and shield selection. I also reefer to the chivalry wiki and https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc … Znc#gid=17 data spread sheet to aproximate weapon stats however they seam either outdated and unreliable on a lot of stats.

    As of right now I see a majority of MAA use a naked dane axe as it seams to be hands down the best weapon. The dane axe is fun but it gets boring fast and i see why its so popular. Shields kind of suck at blocking, I mean you can block feints with ease with a shield but your blockign is very resticted and must be more spot on than with a parry. The buckler is also far more strict. With a buckler on no mobility loss is noticed but heather shield shows noticeable slowness.

    There seams to be only 3 viable weapons being the the dane axe (#1), the broad sword (#2) and the hatchet (#3) with honorable mentions to the falchion for being a slight mix of the hatchet and dane axe and the fanged mace for the best blunt weapon. The following weapons aren’t “useless” but seam inferior to the others making the wielder ask “why use this weapon?”

    The weapons I tend to enjoy seam to be very sad or under whelming, others I don’t care much for also seam lack luster. The the morning star is just a poor mans dane axe / broad sword lacking stats in all departs from both (range over dane axe) with only the pierce blunt damage as its only gimmick, however the raw damage of the axe does more to knights and vangaurds than the morning star so whats the point.

    The holy water sprinkler is a fun weapon and I see it as an extended dagger but its really just a short ranged cudgel. Its similar to the morning star with its gimmick damage type but the hatchet pretty much does everything it does but better unless you count the extra 3% reach worth it, the thrust is ok but the damage is really questionable from data sources. The thrust time is good but its still no hatchet or cudgel. Playing as an archer the cudgel is an awesome melee tool, and is much like a long reaching 30% range dagger with blunt damage.

    Norse sword = a bad broad sword in every way except for 5 damage on thrust …

    The war axe looks like it’s a beast on paper but its a victim of its own illusion. You’d think the thrust would be piercing but it appears to be a low damage blunt despite the spike on its tip. Other wise its just a much slower hatchet with a bit of reach. On the flip side it feel exactly like the dane axe except short range, the thrust seams faster but that’s about it.

    Secondary weapons tend to be over shadowed by the short sword and cudgle, daggers are too short ranged and do too little damage to be good at all. With sever lag, glitchly character movements and attack animations its unreliable to flinch lock someone, you could just 2 shot people with the hatchet instead if your going to ave no range. Saber also lacks damage very badly, its a poormans falchion but at least its a secondary weapon. I often find that even when I land an attack during the start up of the enemy move but before the active frames (I’m not dead yet from the hit so the active frames of his weapon haven’t begun yet) the enemy still gets their attack off anyways. This seams to be most prevalent with 2 handers and specifically the vangaurds halbard (even more specifically the thrust)

    Lastly shields are a blessing and a curse, the protection box they cover from arrows is MUCH bigger than the shield its self, coming form the MAA point of view and the archer I often see arrows float in mid air near the MAA’s feet or head but attached to the shield magically? For blocking its very strict and i often see players just abandon shields and use them solely for back arrow protection. I really like the buckler for its mobility but it just seams like an uphill battle.

    What are your thoughts so far from the MAA. The class is solid and the dodge is probably a little OP because its a free in and out, but its a lot less fun when your stuck using the same weapons. Do you find all the weapons balanced or at least closely viable. Are any irredeemably awful or just worse versions of one another. I don’t have enough data to go on to pick a weapon i really want but I personally really really love the holy water sprinkler and the morning star with a buckler. Do you find shields a waste outside of arrow blocking?

    Edit Some typos



  • The spreadsheet is up to date, but with the latest beta build right now. In future, there will be a separate one for each of live/beta as I know some have gotten confused and quoted beta numbers for live discussions, and the purpose of the spreadsheet was to ensure the right numbers were always quoted.

    On the whole I agree with everything you said. I find it ironic how the Norse Sword was the best sword at one point, and is probably now the worst of the three because it and the Falchion are less effective with stabs than the Broadsword and the Broadsword is longer and does more damage on the overhead (which I personally combo into a lot). I use my Secondary in public games as opposed to my Sword of War and I switched from Norse to Broadsword after the changes. Saber is definitely the worst of the 3 auxillary weapons and offers not much additional damage or range compared to the much faster and higher damaging stab of the Shortsword. Morning Star has gotten a nice little buff in the beta build, which puts it a bit more on par with the Flanged Mace. In the right hands, the hatchet is probably more deadly than what the Norse Sword used to be it; people complained about the Norse Swords ability to 3 hit everything extremely fast, but the Hatchet 3 hit kills everything even faster than the Norse Sword - I just think it takes a tad more skill to use because it has slightly less range than the Norse Sword so is rarer to see, but definitely a beast in good hands.



  • Your post is more a weapon analysis than it is for the class itself. Regardless, I’ll agree that the only two weapons a MAA needs are the Broadsword and Dane Axe. I don’t really prefer one over the other. Usually once I’m bored we with one I’ll switch to the other. The morning star will probably be thrown into the mix with it’s upcoming buff. The Broadsword will most likely remain my favourite since the stab is quite powerful, making it the most versatile.

    As for shields, I never use them. I also don’t parry much either as I prefer to use the MAA’s speed to maintain proper distance and counter attack. Plus having throwing knives or an oil pot give the MAA some interesting ranged attacks. Besides, experienced players can hit and shoot around shields with ease.



  • I just don’t get all the commotion over a few numbers here or there with each weapon people keep trying to squeeze or study.

    As a man at arms, I prefer the Mace and Shield, but have no issues with using any of the swords or axes, as two well placed attacks generally drop any of my targets regardless of what I am using…. Maybe three hits depending.

    I just play and have fun… I don’t care if this weapon takes 2 extra hit points over that one… I pick my weapons based on my style and whether or not i feel like lopping limbs off or bashing things into lego pieces.

    Trying to nit pick over which weapon will give you the easiest route during game play based on the numbers just ruins the fun, imo.

    Sure i could drop this guy faster and easier if i use that weapon, but if i use this weapon, i can watch their helmet fly that way and then watch their brains and skull fragments go in the opposite direction with the follow up swing.

    I don’t want to just rush through dropping bodies and not looking back… I want to take my enemies apart and watch them slump into the pile of goop I made them into… Then laugh at their misfortune as I head for their buddy next… Sometimes giving their corpse a couple of extra swings to add insult to injury.

    Maybe it’s the Irish / Scottish / Native American blood I have in me while growing up Canadian and now living in Australia… My Irish blood line comes directly from Donal Cam O’Sullivan Beare…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donal_Cam_O’Sullivan_Beare

    but I’ve bantered on long enough with tales of the old’n ways…. Carry on.

    Too long? Didn’t Read?

    Just enjoy the game and have fun… Things are going to be tweaked soon anyways, so until then, there’s no real reason to debate weapon changes as they are going to change anyways and we won’t know exactly how until it’s done.



  • I really like the war axe… Just going to put that in here for whatever reason :lol:



  • About the three primary swords for the Man-at arms :
    I really liked that there was a unique balance between Broad, Norse and Falchion. Broad was basically the hybrid that could deal decent Swing and Pierce damage and it had the most reach, Falchion is a very good swing weapon that are able to deal high damage with powerful swings, and then in the end we had the Norse that was basically a very decent stabbing weapon, maybe the speed on the stab was a little bit too high, but that could have simply been adjusted rather than giving the sword a full nerf.

    Right now it serves as the “Faster” Primary sword for Man-at arms.
    It could in somewhat way still be used if a Man-at arms wants to use it due to its fast attacks, but I feel like Broadsword and Falchion in some what way dominates over it.

    I would also like to state that I really really dislike the Man-at arms ability to dodge at anytime.
    They are able to dodge; While comboing, middle of a parry and of course in the middle of an attack.
    There is no proper way to actually prevent them from doing so except for draining their stamina.
    I don’t know about this, but I think that the Man-at arms could be fine without its dodge ability, they are still agile can move in and out of range and deal medium-high damage to the opponent with quick strikes.



  • I like using he war axe and the Norse sword two weapons the OP thought were bad or a least not good. I also use the first mace. Morning star is too slow for me and I always swing too early with the holy water sprinkler.



  • More more thoughts:

    Hatchet - I really enjoyed using this weapon while unlocking the axe line. It’s really fast, does a ton of damage but really lacks in range. However if you can get in close you can dice your opponent up pretty quick.

    War Axe - I have a love/hate relationship with this weapon. It does more damage than the Hatchet and is a bit slower, but combos better. Thrusting however is currently broken because despite the fact there’s a big spike on the end of it, it only does 30 damage and it’s damage type is blunt. It looks like in the update it’s been increased to 50 damage and does pierce damage. If this change stays then this might be my new go-to weapon. Although it still lacks in range compared to the Dane Axe there’s will now be three viable attacks, making the user less predicable.

    Flanged Mace - This is probably the most underrated MAA weapon. Although the only class it can 2 shot without headshots is the Archer it works wonders against Knights. What MAA wouldn’t like to take down a knight with 2 headshots followed by a body shot or a kick? The speed is decent on it although it too lacks in range.

    Morning Star - Another weapon I have a love/hate relationship with. It’s a good single strike weapon as the combo time is brutal on it, and so is the recovery time. It’s damage is getting a nice buff with the patch so it should see some more use. It does have the most range of the three maces though.

    Holy Water Sprinkler - Never really did get into this weapon but I hear it’s good for duels because it’s probably the best weapon to use for making single strikes. The combo time is brutal on it, but then again so is the combo time on the Morning Star. The upcoming patch significantly increases the damage output, especially the stab, but the release time is getting a huge nerf.



  • @Cpt-Praxius:

    I just don’t get all the commotion over a few numbers here or there with each weapon people keep trying to squeeze or study.

    As a man at arms, I prefer the Mace and Shield, but have no issues with using any of the swords or axes, as two well placed attacks generally drop any of my targets regardless of what I am using…. Maybe three hits depending.

    I just play and have fun… I don’t care if this weapon takes 2 extra hit points over that one… I pick my weapons based on my style and whether or not i feel like lopping limbs off or bashing things into lego pieces.

    Trying to nit pick over which weapon will give you the easiest route during game play based on the numbers just ruins the fun, imo.

    Sure i could drop this guy faster and easier if i use that weapon, but if i use this weapon, i can watch their helmet fly that way and then watch their brains and skull fragments go in the opposite direction with the follow up swing.

    I don’t want to just rush through dropping bodies and not looking back… I want to take my enemies apart and watch them slump into the pile of goop I made them into… Then laugh at their misfortune as I head for their buddy next… Sometimes giving their corpse a couple of extra swings to add insult to injury.

    Maybe it’s the Irish / Scottish / Native American blood I have in me while growing up Canadian and now living in Australia… My Irish blood line comes directly from Donal Cam O’Sullivan Beare…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donal_Cam_O’Sullivan_Beare

    but I’ve bantered on long enough with tales of the old’n ways…. Carry on.

    Too long? Didn’t Read?

    Just enjoy the game and have fun… Things are going to be tweaked soon anyways, so until then, there’s no real reason to debate weapon changes as they are going to change anyways and we won’t know exactly how until it’s done.

    You do make a fair point but variety and theory crafting is fun to myself and many others. Its not fun when based on frame data and damage that your weapon is quantifiably worse/inferior to other weapons. I’m glad they are patching and changing it soon but its still frustrating having to work that much harder for a similar result with a worse weapon and this overall leads the inferior weapons require a much more skilled player to beat an opponent. When matches are close and at their prime, every little edge you can get makes a difference, if you got stomped perhaps you’d tie and if you tied perhaps you’d win.

    Its not like the sky is falling or game breaking but just frustrating, however there are other glaring issues that need more addressing like many bugs and glitches.

    Aside form a weapons analysis I’m discouraged to see the shield so hated and unused. Personally I love shields especially the heater shield (captain america shield). I can’t confirm but it appears to slow you down slightly but almost unnoticeable, the buckler doesn’t slow you. The shield bash is a great perk as it seams faster and the only bad shield bash animation is the javelin archer buckler (it feels so awkward and no forward movement). It’s great to be useful against archers but when you use a shield you basically have to either jump and block down or crouch and block slightly up to avoid stabs and even slashes from hitting your feet. Additionally you really have to look for the weapon tip with a shield, I feel its fine how it is but parrying is just too efficient atm.

    If anyone could give me any feedback on tier shield using experience (maa specific) and if you feel its worth it. The pros are arrow control, shield bash and safety closing the gap. The cons are a slight speed decrease, losing another ability slot and the buggy mechanics that are shields (attack shield bug) and although you can hit past the shield often times attacks will go strait through!

    Perhaps its just that dodge is so good right now many MAA don’t need a heavy block play and can solely maneuver around on speed, if/when it does get nerfed people will actually need shields again. I really want shields to be viable on MAA



  • I for one love the holy water sprinkler. Yes it has almost no range but its insanely fast, fast enough to get a hit off a kick on people with low stamina and under certain situations.

    I don’t ever rock a shield as a MaA. I find it slows your whole gameplay down (not just your speed). I would rather have the firepot to get a group of people lower on health before I go in. Also useful for pesky knights and archers.



  • Personally I only really play FFA so maybe my perspective doesn’t match your guys.

    LMB slash (swing) is a big deal in 1v1, you get to the side and swing to the back of their head for a kill shot.
    I usually go to the right hand side for this. If I go to the left hand side, I use mouse wheel down for a chop.

    I’ve played entire matches doing stabs + fire pots and done really well, but I find LMB with a buckler is the sweet spot.

    Shield bash or dodge, strafe to the right, LMB, strafe to the left + LMB, strafe to the right + lmb = dead.

    Maybe you guys are playing against higher caliber opponents or different game types but in most any 1v1 I get into I use alot of LMB + mousewheel down. Stabs I find situational as a MAA and I typically never go into a fight planning on using one. Less damage… for little benefit. You can’t adjust your aim while stabbing to screw up their parry (swing, then move mouse to the right so they are done parrying before your swing connects) and are making sure you won’t hit anyone else (which is only useful when you’re zerging down one guy).

    I used to use falchion and loved it. I noticed regularily though that 1h axes would often slip past my buckler, so I switched to the Dane. Then I decided the heavier hit d of the waraxe was better still and haven’t looked back. I’ve had very few problems with range, but I do have to avoid fighting on slopes because of the range.

    I load up with War Axe, Skinning Knife (good slash spamming) and a buckler. If I’m in a crowded FFA (arena) I will swap out the shield for the flame bomb.



  • @VanuTycon:

    Aside form a weapons analysis I’m discouraged to see the shield so hated and unused. Personally I love shields especially the heater shield (captain america shield). I can’t confirm but it appears to slow you down slightly but almost unnoticeable, the buckler doesn’t slow you. The shield bash is a great perk as it seams faster and the only bad shield bash animation is the javelin archer buckler (it feels so awkward and no forward movement). It’s great to be useful against archers but when you use a shield you basically have to either jump and block down or crouch and block slightly up to avoid stabs and even slashes from hitting your feet. Additionally you really have to look for the weapon tip with a shield, I feel its fine how it is but parrying is just too efficient atm.

    If anyone could give me any feedback on tier shield using experience (maa specific) and if you feel its worth it. The pros are arrow control, shield bash and safety closing the gap. The cons are a slight speed decrease, losing another ability slot and the buggy mechanics that are shields (attack shield bug) and although you can hit past the shield often times attacks will go strait through!

    Perhaps its just that dodge is so good right now many MAA don’t need a heavy block play and can solely maneuver around on speed, if/when it does get nerfed people will actually need shields again. I really want shields to be viable on MAA

    Captain America used a round shield… like the buckler.

    I constantly use the shield, I think it’s amazing. The shield bash feels so much more fluid and fast compared to a kick (this could be purely in my head though, don’t know) and just opens so many guys up to a strafe+swing.

    It’s great for approaching archers. I usually use a bit of stafe and run pointed away from them to apporach to maximize the shield. I have only used the larger shield 3-4 matches ever, I find no advantage to it. Maybe you block more arrows? I doubt it though. I know I fight alot of MAA with the kite shield and they are as easy to hit around as the buckler is.

    I’ve never once jumped up and blocked down or crouch+block up. Play aggressive to win, dodge/strafe/shield bash (whichever, situational), strafe to the side, swing to the face. Guys who parry, usually are bad at it.

    Once in awhile I do come up against someone really good who takes no damage from me and flawlessly kills me repeatedly. These are rare and typically don’t cost me the match anyway so w/e.

    In my head, I’ve totally accepted the fact that I can only have a chance to win 95% of my 1v1s, there are some players I don’t beat unless they screw up badly.

    TLDR SHIELD FOR THE WIN

    *edit
    I don’t parry+combo, so for me theres no downside to not having the shield unless I can make up for it with fire bomb kills.



  • One could argue that a shield is pointless because as a MAA, you should be approaching archers from behind. Also, a good MAA knows exactly where the archers are, or will be on every map so should never get taken by surprise. Finally if an archer does indeed get a shot off at you, it’s simple to dodge out of the way. If you get shot in the back you’re doing it wrong.

    As for myself, it takes a really good archer to take me down before I can I can close the gap. Most of the time anyway.

    EDIT: The above is based on team games, not FFA.



  • @T_Roy:

    One could argue that a shield is pointless because as a MAA, you should be approaching archers from behind. Also, a good MAA knows exactly where the archers are, or will be on every map so should never get taken by surprise. Finally if an archer does indeed get a shot off at you, it’s simple to dodge out of the way. If you get shot in the back you’re doing it wrong.

    As for myself, it takes a really good archer to take me down before I can I can close the gap. Most of the time anyway.

    EDIT: The above is based on team games, not FFA.

    Some would say the sheild isn’t useless for MMA. I’ve seen MMA with tons of arrows in thier sheild. More than I’ve ever seen a knight have.



  • @lemonater47:

    @T_Roy:

    One could argue that a shield is pointless because as a MAA, you should be approaching archers from behind. Also, a good MAA knows exactly where the archers are, or will be on every map so should never get taken by surprise. Finally if an archer does indeed get a shot off at you, it’s simple to dodge out of the way. If you get shot in the back you’re doing it wrong.

    As for myself, it takes a really good archer to take me down before I can I can close the gap. Most of the time anyway.

    EDIT: The above is based on team games, not FFA.

    Some would say the sheild isn’t useless for MMA. I’ve seen MMA with tons of arrows in thier sheild. More than I’ve ever seen a knight have.

    There are those that believe a buckler or heater shield full of arrows is a sign of a bad archer(s).



  • The community up and decided the Dane Axe is the only ish. I swear by the War Axe. I can’t find any reason to change using it.



  • @tlbww:

    The community up and decided the Dane Axe is the only ish. I swear by the War Axe. I can’t find any reason to change using it.

    The reason I use the broadsword over the war axe is for the stab. The upcoming patch is buffing the stab so the war axe should get more play time from me.



  • Remember when the norse sword was a viable weapon? Those were the days…


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