Fool me once



  • So, I know asking for an opinion about a product ON THE PRODUCTS WEBSITE is begging for a huge bias in favor of said product. All the people who have quit this game obviously don’t go on the forums, and given that the number of players seems down from when I started, I know there have been people quitting.

    I love this game in concept, I really do. And the execution isn’t that bad. But why, oh why, did you release it as an alpha at full price?

    There are so many glitches, so many bugs, so many issues. So much obvious proof you didn’t bother play testing, didn’t even have QA, that you rushed it out… I know it’s being patched. And I’m sure in a year it will be much better.

    I know it’s the style now a days to release a game early, and then patch it. But this is insane. Broken animations. Game breaking bugs where you loose the ability to input commands. A completely non-functional tutorial. And I hate to say it, but I know exactly why you released it in this state. Because you could.

    I’m sorry, I really am, I’ll get my money’s worth out of this game I’m sure. But I don’t think I’m ever buying a Torn Banner Studios product again. Ever. I don’t think I’ve ever been quite so disappointed in a game since Ultima 8.



  • The only question I see is asking why would you release an Alpha for full retail price. This game did had a beta and when it released aside from server browser problems it worked well. So well in fact I became a huge fan, got active in the forums, and later became a moderator to the forums of my favorite game. I haven’t experienced any game breaking bugs. Sure there are still some bugs but most are being addressed or aren’t ruining the experience of hacking people’s heads off. You may take my response with a grain of salt since I am mod for the game. But the truth is. I am gamer who became a mod for the game I love.

    I hope you stick around, because this game is amazing and only getting better. And as far as the game population shrinking, it has in fact grown from a couple of months ago.



  • What’s with all these ‘gamebreaking bugs, I want my refund’ threads? Seriously. There are a few annoying bugs, like getting stuck on a wall or a rock or something for a few seconds, but other than that, what really is there? Hits going through shields, sometimes? Sometimes chat doesn’t work? I’m literally straining my brain to think of them.

    I honestly think it’s the culture of fps kids thinking this should play like an fps. Broken animations? What? Learn the mechanics, and stop crying broken. Just because you can’t 360 noscope someone, or can’t come up behind them and hit one button for an instakill, does not mean this game is flawed. It actually makes it a few hundred times better that you can’t do that stuff, in my opinion. It doesn’t play other traditional games, or like an fps, because it isn’t an fps, or some generic RPG. Chivalry is in it’s own genre, and attempt to learn it before you complain it’s broken.



  • @Molvanian:

    I’m sorry, I really am, I’ll get my money’s worth out of this game I’m sure.

    I think that is all that matters really. I paid $25 I think for the game. Where I am that is 3 beers. 3 beers is good for 90 minutes. I have 100 hours so far out of the game. Talk about value for money so far.

    As for players down, seems pretty steady around 5,000 people on at any one time. Pretty damn good I think, rates in the top 20 of all steam games.

    I think I have got stuck in a map maybe once in 100 hours and only for 30 seconds. Attacks through shields, not seen that as long as I parry properly - shields do not make you immune to attack.



  • as someone has put a few hundred hours into the game and I really like the game but thereare a ton of game breaking bugs like the guy said there bugs with the animations and for game based around those animations I mean you need to be able to play the game those animations should be perfect before the game is released. However they are still extremely buggy. On my phone but I’ll comment more later

    Edit: After reading the post below mine and the responses to that I have to say you guys are either flat out lying or don’t pay attention. I meet those issues more times than I can count in a typical session of chivalry, they are annoying and pretty gamebreaking as I said for a game that revolves around attack animations. And the clunky terrain is just awful, that more than anything tells me that no one is playtesting this game



  • While the OP’s post may seem harsh to the game’s die-hards, I’m nearly one of them (rank 41). This post won’t make me very popular either but, the truth is the truth. If you’ve been playing this game since release and you can’t find any huge bugs then you must be happily drunk the entire time. Now ask yourself, fellas:

    How many times have you gotten hit before the animation played?

    How many times have you been fooled by a ghost swing, that isn’t real and goes right through your parry, only to be hit by the real swing a half second later?

    How many times have you gotten stuck on geometry?

    How long has flinching been confirmed to be broken or buggy at least? I’d say flinching not working times when it should breaks a lot of class mechanics.

    Does anyone remember the time when ducking with certain weapons would T-pose you?

    Anyone remember when getting off hit off the ballista would often cause you to be stuck in “ballista mode”, unable to switch weapons?

    Don’t get me wrong, these things happen on occasion but you’re almost guaranteed to run into it 3-4 times a round, sometimes more.

    And god help you if your ping exceeds 150ms.

    How many speed hackers have you come across? How many speed hackers evaded your detection by clocking at just 115%-120% faster than normal? Did you know there is a widely available and free fix for most UDK games?

    I’m not saying they should be punished for having bugs in their game, its a natural part of game development. I’m saying a released game has minor bugs at best and maybe one or two huge bugs that get patched quickly. Fine release your big content patch, but please fix these huge problems that should not have made it into release way before that.

    I got my moneys worth though, this is just my 2cents. Yet, the company’s image is what’s at stake here, not if the game was worth it. I want TB to be received well.

    Edit: Some other less important criticism that I neglected to mention but wanted to.

    The server browser is poorly done, laggy/slow, and near featureless. The friend tab doesn’t work at all. The history tab doesn’t sort by last played date (what’s the point of a history tab then?).

    The scoreboard doesn’t show me what server I’m playing due to some bug but shows its IP…

    The ragdolls limbs get all screwed up for most death animations which was the first thing I noticed about the game. Other than its inherent awesomeness.



  • @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten hit before the animation played?

    0, unless I was lagging.

    @Slight:

    How many times have you been fooled by a ghost swing, that isn’t real and goes right through your parry, only to be hit by the real swing a half second later?

    0. I have however encountered, in rare occasions that attacks go completely through players without doing any damage whatsoever. As if you were swinging in the air and not at an enemy’s body. I think in the 130 hours I’ve played, I encountered this ~4 times.

    @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten stuck on geometry?

    This does happen from time to time. A single kick (or dodge with MaA) got me unstuck right away. This only is a real problem when it occurs right in the middle of a fight, which has never happened to me.

    @Slight:

    How long has flinching been confirmed to be broken or buggy at least? I’d say flinching not working times when it should breaks a lot of class mechanics.

    In the heat of combat, when everything is turning into chaos and a red haze clouds your view, you’ll often get the perception that something appears to be buggy, especially a mechanic as flinch, of which the concept already has a somewhat glitchy animation.

    @Slight:

    Anyone remember when getting off hit off the ballista would often cause you to be stuck in “ballista mode”, unable to switch weapons?

    And exactly how often do you encounter a ballista? Let alone use it. This remains however, indisputably, a true bug.

    @Slight:

    And god help you if your ping exceeds 150ms.

    Haven’t had any ping-related issues (unless I was playing on high ping servers).

    @Slight:

    How many speed hackers have you come across?

    1

    I have played 130 hours of Chivalry up to date, so I think I should’ve gotten a fair chance to encounter all this.

    @Slight:

    After all, the company’s image is what’s at stake here, not if the game was worth it.

    This is the first game of a indie company. When buying such a game one should always be mild when criticizing it. But even so, TB has done a remarkably good job. They were #1 for a while in the Steam Christmas sales. And even despite all the bugs, with which I disagree for the most part, you’ve described, Chivalry remains a unique experience, unlike any other game.



  • @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten hit before the animation played?

    0 but I am not sure if I would recognize it in the heat of battle.

    @Slight:

    How many times have you been fooled by a ghost swing, that isn’t real and goes right through your parry, only to be hit by the real swing a half second later?

    0

    @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten stuck on geometry?

    Once

    @Slight:

    How long has flinching been confirmed to be broken or buggy at least? I’d say flinching not working times when it should breaks a lot of class mechanics.

    I agree there is something annoying about flinching that I see more frequently

    @Slight:

    Does anyone remember the time when ducking with certain weapons would T-pose you?

    I never duck. The few times I see someone duck under my attack I think wow that was impressive.

    @Slight:

    Anyone remember when getting off hit off the ballista would often cause you to be stuck in “ballista mode”, unable to switch weapons?

    Never, only been hit off the ballista by a jealous player who wants his turn.

    Don’t get me wrong, these things happen on occasion but you’re almost guaranteed to run into it 3-4 times a round, sometimes more.

    @Slight:

    And god help you if your ping exceeds 150ms.

    I have good ping.

    @Slight:

    How many speed hackers have you come across?

    0

    @Slight:

    How many speed hackers evaded your detection by clocking at just 115%-120% faster than normal? Did you know there is a widely available and free fix for most UDK games?

    I dont think I could tell. There were maybe a couple of times I was suspicious.

    @Slight:

    I’m not saying they should be punished for having bugs in their game, its a natural part of game development. I’m saying a released game has minor bugs at best and maybe one or two huge bugs that get patched quickly. Fine release your big content patch, but please fix these huge problems that should not have made it into release way before that.

    I think that is fair.



  • @Molvanian:

    There are so many glitches, so many bugs, so many issues. So much obvious proof you didn’t bother play testing, didn’t even have QA, that you rushed it out…

    It’s obvious? So you tested the game before it was launched then, correct? Because obviously you know what state that it WAS in before, and the progress that was made in order to make your claims.

    You didn’t? Well then, you’re just speaking out of your ass - and THAT is why you get hate on forums. You make claims you have no facts to support. For all you know, it was 10x buggier before it launched, and it’s improved leaps and bounds.

    Next time think before you post.



  • Ya it is really buggy, for sure.

    • I expected things like the animations to have been good right out the door. It does definitely come off as alpha quality.

    • changing FOV, the model is all f’d up and you see his shoulder pads, or part of them.

    • weapons floating in the air, people who look like they are wielding 2 swords in their hands.

    • The game browser which is complete and utter crap. You can’t even re-size columns. That’s like basic shit. Then servers don’t show up which you know are there. There is no way to add a server manually.

    • The one bug I do love because it’s just too comical and happens all the time is when you get out of the way of an attack and you are literally right beside the guy who is poking the air or stabbing the air and you are watching him, you attack and then all of a sudden you are dead. That’s really poor.

    • Or when you have your reticle on the guy, you run/leap and poke the guy and you miss but at the same time you run into him.

    • Or the long sword/light saber thing where people stab and then like spin around and get you with a jab and maybe others. It looks dumb. And you can do it with poking with the pole arm weapons. It’s dumb and super unrealistic/fake!

    • Then there is uneven surfaces like hillsides, stairs and people try to con you to go to them because they can hit you but 50% of the time you can’t hit them.

    • Or the weapon that passes through slabs of concrete/rock and kills you.

    • Or people are on fire, yet there is no fire on them, then they die and then you see fire.

    • People kicking people for no reason because the kick system is ubber garbage. Then the guy you kicked, keeps coming back. LOL!

    • Definitely the getting stuck on things is really annoying. It’s not just rocks or in the forest kinda things. I’ve gotten stuck on a door frame, the steps out of a hut or along the tree line.

    I do however hope this game see’s a patch very soon to address this stuff. We are 2/3rds into this month and there is nothing yet there was a promise for new content and stuff.

    Yeah, there are lots of bugs and I’ve only covered a few of them but it’s still fun. I keep going back to it every night.

    I recommend to everyone running servers, this is UT, UT handles different pings worse than any game I know. Put a ping filter on your servers. A server with a bunch of guys with ~50ms ping should not allow a n00b on with +150 ping. This isn’t CS or COD.

    EDIT: Another thing that is useful is people posting their server configs and getting them stickied to a forum. Maybe we can curb the crappy servers out there that are letting on bad pingers and we can play a less laggy game.



  • @Siegfried:

    @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten hit before the animation played?

    0, unless I was lagging.

    @Slight:

    How many times have you been fooled by a ghost swing, that isn’t real and goes right through your parry, only to be hit by the real swing a half second later?

    0. I have however encountered, in rare occasions that attacks go completely through players without doing any damage whatsoever. As if you were swinging in the air and not at an enemy’s body. I think in the 130 hours I’ve played, I encountered this ~4 times.

    @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten stuck on geometry?

    This does happen from time to time. A single kick (or dodge with MaA) got me unstuck right away. This only is a real problem when it occurs right in the middle of a fight, which has never happened to me.

    @Slight:

    How many speed hackers have you come across?

    1

    I have played 130 hours of Chivalry up to date, so I think I should’ve gotten a fair chance to encounter all this.

    I expected this exact response.

    It’s good that you’re passionate about this game, but the bias in your post is overwhelming, so I doubt you’re being honest here. I mean hell, by your description, this game is perfect and without flaw.

    Even when you admit certain things need fixing, you get defensive. Please realize that I’m not attacking the game. And while you may like to trivialize all the points I’ve mentioned and/or say they don’t exist, the reality is they have been posted countless times on this forum and are easily encountered in game. All it takes is for one person to be lagging slightly, whether it be you or another, for these things to pop up.

    This is an excuse by the way:
    @Siegfried:

    In the heat of combat, when everything is turning into chaos and a red haze clouds your view, you’ll often get the perception that something appears to be buggy, especially a mechanic as flinch, of which the concept already has a somewhat glitchy animation.

    It’s a game. The “heat” of combat fades a bit when you hit rank 20 where you should be paying plenty of attention to exactly what your opponent(s) are doing.

    Flinch could have no animation for all I care. What I care about is my opponent being able to start an attack a millisecond after I’ve just hit him because I hit him in some sort of recovery animation state that shrugs off all damage, which I hear is being fixed. There is a video floating around demonstrating this.

    I really don’t think you’re being honest with yourself. Does everyone on your server have 40ms ping or something?

    @gregcau:

    @Slight:

    How many times have you gotten stuck on geometry?

    Once

    You’ve only gotten stuck once? Oh come on! This is one thing you simply cannot lie about. Please load up darkforest right now and go run through the tree area at the start and tell me you do not get stuck…

    I did read rest of your post btw, its similar to siegfried’s and my comments are the same.



  • good to hear it is being fixed this affects other classes too. Just wish that patch would come soon. Well I better go please my CMW addiction now. I love when people whine about Vanguards when I’m kicking their butt.

    I’ve gotten stuck many many times. It’s literally occurs every match somewhere somehow. I doubt they will fix all that, gonna take many patches. lol



  • No game breaking bugs? Really? Have you read the bug forum? How about the one where blocking could become COMPLETELY DISABLED not even allowing you to attempt the animation? That was a fun one, and one I know a number of other people complained about.

    Kills not counting for weapons, or the counter reverting? How about the hit registration, when I used to be able to walk through arrows, bolts, and ballista shots? Oh that was fun. Completely ignoring projectiles.

    Now you issues with people blocking behind them, somehow, with weapons counting as getting through shields due to the model passing through and counting as hitting from a different angle, and hits that occur instantly due to animation issues. Either the simple “look down, do chop, instantly hit” exploit (And I doubt the designers intended that to be a tactic. Nor is it realistic. So yes, it’s an “exploit”) to simple animation glitches that make combat… awful at times, to be honest. And let’s not talk about falling into or through the map, getting stuck, or simply coming to a full stop because you hit an invisible bump.

    Someone asked the reason for all the refund threads. It’s because this game is below the quality we’ve come to expect… in an age we’ve come to expect games to start out buggy rather then being released finished.

    I understand why so many people like this game. Even if it can’t fill a 64 player server even on weekend nights anymore. It’s a great idea. Very few mass combat games out there.

    And I respect the hell out of the attempt with limited kickstarter funds. But this… this is not good. I spent my money on a product. The product did not deliver as advertised. I am, thus, unhappy.



  • Does the game have issues? Sure, can they all be fixed? probably not, but most will.

    You say you will get your moneys worth but then end saying you will never buy another TB product again, that does not make sense to me.

    Fact is, I got my moneys worth playing it, I played this game so many hours and the game cost very little money, 20 dollars it cost me I think or 25 and I played it for a lot longer than many games costing 60 dollars. I might stop playing this game very soon, not kidding, but the value I got out of it was insane and I will for sure keep an eye out for TB future products.

    I also think this game does not belong in esports and people trying to forming clans etc are making a mistake, as does anyone taking this game serious or even devs investing too much time to balancing for this reason, it is however extremely entertaining. I also do not think it is even possible to make a melee based esport game for many years to come due to technology. But forget that, have fun!

    Anyway, take care but I had to add my comment to your critique because it just does not make any sense.



  • just play baked



  • I am perplexed by the constant complaints of this game being glitchy or buggy. I think it is the best game of 2012. All of the classes are well balanced, the game looks good and performs well, and all of the maps are very well designed.

    All of the issues I have encountered are pretty minor, like getting stuck on the geography sometimes. I have not encountered a single ‘game breaking’ bug other than the occasional UDK crash. I guess I have a good computer and fast internet, so that must solve 90% of the issues people are having. Gameplay for me has always been fine.

    Sure, the game isn’t as perfectly coded as a big budget studio title, but I guess I never expected that from such a small developer. I have been extremely impressed with what they were able to achieve.

    And the game costs $25! Seems hard to complain about that. That’s like a really cheap dinner out. With the time I’ve spent playing the game,



  • @Slight:

    You’ve only gotten stuck once? Oh come on! This is one thing you simply cannot lie about. Please load up darkforest right now and go run through the tree area at the start and tell me you do not get stuck…

    I did read rest of your post btw, its similar to siegfried’s and my comments are the same.

    Depends on your definition of stuck. Stuck as in cannot move, unable to continue for 30+ seconds, should press F10 stuck? Once.

    Glitchy things where you shudder for a few seconds before working yourself free, sure happens a lot and its annoying.


Log in to reply