STAMINA: key to a deeper, richer experience
Now THAT’S sth you really need to get right. Maybe some of you guys played Demons’ Souls
and/or Dark Souls.
These games implemented the imho best melee combat system to date.
The hit detection is not as accurate and ambitious as in Chivalry: MW, but hell - the stamina system is brilliant.
So basically, the stronger (or heavier) a weapon, the more stamina it will consume per blow.
Fairly basic stuff here. But then, blocking, also consumes stamina, and different weapon types consume more or less stamina when blocked. For example, blunt weapons deal the most amount
of stamina “damage” because, the force generated is higher like the force dealt by slashing weapons.
I think you get the idea here. But there’s even more, and important mechanics to it, especially
when you think of a competitive game like Chivalry: MW.
So, stamina consumption is key. But stamina regeneration is just as important!
The heavier your armour, the more slowly your stamina will regenerate.
And that’s not all. In a competitive environment, you wanna penalize people for maintaining for example a blocking stance or even the stretching of a bow. So they only use the block when necessary. And don’t kinda spam it. The blocking stance does not CONSUME stamina of its own. But it SLOWS THE REGENERATION.
But there’s even more to it: What happens if you run out of stamina,
and for instance try to block a blow, that consumes more stamina, than you have left?
Then, your opponent just succesfully broke you guard, and you are very vulnerable for a brief moment. In this game, that would likely end in a decapition or sth similar.
Imagine the satisfaction, when you experience this as an attacker.
For a brief moment, you have free reign over the guy that just lost to your superior fighting skills.
That system would make this fantastic game, an even better, deeper and more tactical experience.
And therefore, more competitive and rewarding!
I know, there is some kind of stamina system integrated atm.
But no details were mentioned so far.
I was so happy to here that, that I decided to register to the forums right away and post my experiences and thoughts about it. I mean, this game initially drew my attention when I first saw it in a video. It looked so promising that I didn’t even think of stuff like that.
They just did a lot of stuff right. The ambitious fighting system maybe beeing the most obvious.
But then I saw all those great, rich environments like the area around the castle and the arena.
And even the gamemodes promise a fresh and authentic experience! Awesome!
So, anyways. What do you think of my suggestions?
Really love what you’ve done there Torn Banner Studios!
And of course I pledged some money on kickstarter. 16 days to go… and most of the money is in.
That’s a safe bet there.
I may appologize for any spelling mistakes. English is not my native language, so… ^^_
Well, there is a stamina system, and it is somewhat what you described. The light class, the Man-at-Arms, does a lot of combat actions that consume stamina, such as dodging, jumping, kicking and comboing - but he also has the most stamina to play with because he’s so lightly armored - while the Knight can only do so many combo attacks, kicks, shoves and such before he’ll be out of stamina completely, which discourages him from spamming and encourages landing your hits well - but at the same time they have the heaviest weapons and shields, meaning they consume less stamina when blocking with their shock-absorbing heavy shields, and will deal a lot of stamina damage to light shields. The Vanguard is of course somewhere inbetween, having no shield but having long heavy pole weapons and two-handed swords that consume a lot of stamina to combo, as well as their class-specific sprinting lunge attack that consumes a lot of stamina making it wasteful to miss with.
Certain actions do not consume stamina, like sprinting without attacking, or blocking without absorbing a hit, but will completely stop your stamina from regenerating while you’re doing it as well as for a short period afterwards. These actions similarly stop your health from regenerating which means you cannot turtle or run away to regenerate after a fight.
I can’t speak for what the developers might have planned for stamina down the line, but the system in place now is very fluid and intuitive. It gives you something to think about during combat and adds weight to every action, but it doesn’t completely shut you down when you run out, which was very frustrating in AoC. All in all I think you’ll be happy with the system in place.
That’s good news! Thanks a lot for that insight!
Certain actions do not consume stamina, like sprinting without attacking…
So since i heard that all classes now have the same speed but different accelerations does that mean that you can chase someone around indefinitely?
What about if you sprint towards an archer? Can you run 100 meters with full armor zig-zagging like crazy and then have your whole stamina to chop him down?
And also what about the tactical choice to wait for the enemy while having a few archers rainning arrows upon them to force them to run and stam out so that you have a slight advantage when they reach you ?
I don’t say that everything needs to work ingame as it does in reality but i’m mostly wondering how does that balance out.
I can’t speak to the chasing thing because the mechanics in place aren’t finalized or revealed to the public as far as I’m aware, but I can tell you the developers have taken this into account and there will be something in place that gives the pursuer the advantage in a chase, because they want to dissuade running from a fight. I’ll just say if you have a lead on your enemy you will have time to run and hopefully find a teammate if you’re an archer or just injured, but you won’t be able to run from them forever.
As to the latter two points I think I can answer them at once. Movement is somewhat more realistic than in AoC. You won’t be able to turn on a dime and maintain full sprint speed - if you turn too sharply you’ll return to normal movement speed and have to start sprinting again with your acceleration reset. As you’ve probably noticed in the videos, ranged combat is also a lot more precise and faster. It’s much easier to hit someone at a distance even if they’re moving. The reason for this was to put more emphasis on using your shield rather than running around like a maniac in what was generally agreed to be a very-not-medieval-battlefield-appropriate manner.
At the same time, holding up your shield won’t slow you to a crawl like it did in AoC, and shields aren’t magical forcefields that cover you completely. They make you a much smaller target, and the largest shields will in most cases completely protect your front, but a good archer still has a chance of landing his arrows on an enemy’s exposed legs or feet, and of course with your shield up you have limited vision which makes it much easier for the enemy to flank you considering your sides and back are still exposed. Of course, advancing with your shield up for a long period will drain your stamina and you won’t be able to sprint, so advancing against an archer will still leave you tired out and slow your progress.
Archers have to be careful too, though, as there are still plenty of places in the maps where they will be susceptible to flanking, and the maps are being carefully designed to ensure that there are large swathes of cover so that the option to go shieldless doesn’t completely screw you. This is why archers have always been placed in more of a support role - a good archer can instill as much fear in the enemy and slow their advance or weaken their ability to defend just as much as a good melee, but their reliance on having an open target to hit in many cases means an archer cannot succeed alone (of course in most cases nobody can succeed alone, it is a team game after all).
That said, while most of the time if I get the jump on an archer they’ll go down without much chance to defend themselves, I’ll be the first to admit that there are some archers in the alpha that not only make me piss my pants at range, but if I do manage to close the gap on them they’ll still kick my ass at least half the time in melee, especially if they did land an arrow first. And I think that’s just how it should be.
Sounds indeed very good SlyGoat. Thanks for your time.
Happy to help. While the developers are busy developing I try to answer as much as I can from my lowly peasant standpoint. ;)
You are a humble champion of the people Slygoat, really appreciate your help in responding with the community, it does not go unnoticed!