Remove the shield kick stun.



  • Most of thou will speak “If you’re holding up your shield, you are just shield hiding”.

    Nay.

    I see the enemy pull back, my instinct is toraise my shield, for fear of taking damage, but nay, turns out he was kicking, and I become stunned and get smashed on the head.

    The stun art too long!

    Whom agrees?!?!



  • Bye, bye shields! It was fun while you were good! 8-)



  • Totally agreed with SerFluffy.



  • I know what you mean, I’ve blocked a few kicks myself out of reflex. You just have to expect to get kicked now and look out for the distinct animation instead of blocking everything.

    This isn’t completely to your disadvantage. If your enemy gets greedy, kicks you repeatedly over the course of a fight and you always lower your shield in time, you can turn the tables and deplete the rest of his stamina to get a free hit in when he parries. In addition, kicks are so slow now that it’s entirely possible to dodge them or back out of range, wasting your enemy’s stamina and possibly leaving him open for attacks.



  • I agree it is too long but there’s already a few threads regarding shield kick stuns.
    Anyway here are the things that directly affected shield users post-patch:

    **-The bug that allowed players to attack instantly with shield raised with no lowering time was fixed

    -Significantly increased shield stamina drain on successful shield block

    -Alternate swings helps players get around shields

    -One handed weapons feint stamina cost increased to 15, combined with the extra shield drain on block means you cannot use feints as liberally as before

    -Significantly increased duration on stamina exhaustion flinch, which is long enough for a free-hit with almost any weapon in chivalry save for maybe the maul’s slow swing time**

    All of these changes combined were enough to balance shields without needing the mechanic of the stun kick.
    While kicks themselves have been slowed down slightly and their stamina cost increased, they aren’t relatively difficult to land against shields as players tend to feint first to force a knight to prematurely raise their shield before kicking them.
    It’s definitely not fun being unable to do anything while you watch someone get a free grand mace overhead to your face.



  • Kick stun is definitly the best thing in the patch.
    How hard can at be to look at what your opponent is doing.
    Everyone without shild has to indentify the kind of the attack and if its a feint, now you have to do the same and you are still protected from feints which are easier and cheaper to use.

    so stop whineing



  • ^



  • I’m sorry, what the hell are you talking about.

    First of all, the change is necessary. 2h weapons still cannot get around shields unless the target makes a mistake. That is not how it is intended to work.

    Secondly, try using some skill instead of asking for a change. It really is not that hard to see what your opponent is doing.

    Grow up and adapt to the mechanic. It’s a good change.



  • @Torrenz:

    I know what you mean, I’ve blocked a few kicks myself out of reflex. You just have to expect to get kicked now and look out for the distinct animation instead of blocking everything.

    This isn’t completely to your disadvantage. If your enemy gets greedy, kicks you repeatedly over the course of a fight and you always lower your shield in time, you can turn the tables and deplete the rest of his stamina to get a free hit in when he parries. In addition, kicks are so slow now that it’s entirely possible to dodge them or back out of range, wasting your enemy’s stamina and possibly leaving him open for attacks.

    Fine against normal and often even average players, but not against good players that use one handers or accelerate their swings and overheads to the maximum while getting into face hugging range. The shield obstructs view and isn’t as reliable or quick as parrying.

    This is a completely unnecessary change. Free hit elements should not exist in the game just because people aren’t wiling to learn how to get around defenses. Dumb down the game for the masses. I guess I understand that as a business choice, but it hurts the game for the players who are serious about it.

    @Bloodhead:

    I’m sorry, what the hell are you talking about.

    First of all, the change is necessary. 2h weapons still cannot get around shields unless the target makes a mistake. That is not how it is intended to work.

    Secondly, try using some skill instead of asking for a change. It really is not that hard to see what your opponent is doing.

    Grow up and adapt to the mechanic. It’s a good change.

    2 hand weapons can get around shields, but even if they couldn’t, so what? Everyone has a secondary one handed weapon which can, with extreme easy, get around shields.

    Defense should require skill, but so should offense, shield or not. You should get a hit if your opponent makes a mistake by not properly defending against your superior offensive moves. Not by walking up to you and kicking you for a free hit, that’s utter crap.

    Free hits lower the skill ceiling by further invalidating skilled defense as an effective element to incorporate into competitive playstyles.

    @TheFunnySide:

    Kick stun is definitly the best thing in the patch.
    How hard can at be to look at what your opponent is doing.
    Everyone without shild has to indentify the kind of the attack and if its a feint, now you have to do the same and you are still protected from feints which are easier and cheaper to use.

    so stop whineing

    All I have to do is get within facehugging distance for most people to panic, with reason, because shields are far less efficient at directly blocking hits as well as being slower to activate than normal attacks. Furthermore, even if you are very calm and don’t make this mistake, all I Have to do is feint an attack and go in for a kick. It’s so easy it is murderously laughable.

    This negates shields as effective tools of war. They are completely pointless. They no longer offer protection against feints, and are inferior to parry for normal defense (not just by reducing offense but being slower and more finicky). The only reason to take a shield is to leave it on your back for passive arrow protection. That is sad.



  • @Bloodhead:

    Secondly, try using some skill instead of asking for a change. It really is not that hard to see what your opponent is doing.

    Grow up and adapt to the mechanic. It’s a good change.



  • Radiant, every single one of your posts in this section has basically been a complaint that the game hasn’t been balanced in your favour. The game was designed to favour the offensive; adapt or die. Shields are still effective if you are careful with them, and often in team fights players can’t afford to waste their stamina on a kick.

    Having the ability to basically be immune to feints while being able to us them yourself after every block made shields extremely powerful in duels, too. At least now a skilled player can punish that behaviour.

    Maybe you should realise that the skill aspect in this game is defence and staying alive rather than offence. It shouldn’t be easy to stay alive a long time in this game unless you are actively killing your attackers.



  • 2 hand weapons can get around shields, but even if they couldn’t, so what? Everyone has a secondary one handed weapon which can, with extreme easy, get around shields.

    First of all - No, 2 handed weapons CAN’T get around shields. If you are good with a shield no 2-handed strike will ever hit you unless you go for a trade.

    Secondly, yes, I could switch to a secondary, but there are 2 problems with this. Firstly, if I am playing vanguard (or knight with throwing axes) it means that you will have a shield while I don’t. That means that you can feint while I can’t. Huge disadvantage. Secondly, it is a huge flaw in the game if I have to switch to a certain setup just to fight yours.

    I mean think about it. Would it be fair if it were the other way round, and shield setups could never hit 2-handers? That would mean you’d have to switch to a 2h to deal with me. Would that be fair? Obviously not. So why would it be fair this way round?

    You should get a hit if your opponent makes a mistake by not properly defending against your superior offensive moves. Not by walking up to you and kicking you for a free hit, that’s utter crap.

    You speak as if it’s unavoidable, which is rubbish. I have seen people lower their shield when they see I’m kicking them. I spent ages learning how to read 2h feints in order to duel properly. I suggest you take some time and learn how to deal with this.

    I honestly cannot fathom how people can speak against this change.



  • Radiant is known for advocating an elitist approach to the game, an approach that favors long, drawn-out duels and turtling. In his view, the game should revolve around 2h vs 2h duelling, which is a minute portion of what it has to offer. Team games are superbly balanced in the state the game is in now, and he wants to change that for the sake of long and exciting 2hander duels.



  • Since I started duelling I’ve been favoring shield and sword on the knight.

    Personally while the shield kick is a free hit, so is the shield bash so I find it balanced.

    Of course if you are stupid enough to turtle with the shield you deserve to get a kick.

    But kicks do not have much range so you can pretend to turtle then stab the the little kicker.

    lol fine as is.



  • @TheFunnySide:

    How hard can at be to look at what your opponent is doing.

    How can anyone lose with that piece of advice?

    @Bloodhead:

    First of all, the change is necessary. 2h weapons still cannot get around shields unless the target makes a mistake. That is not how it is intended to work.

    How about increased stamina drain from 2handers? How about sidestep feinting? It makes no sense that kick now has Chuck Norris power to turn any shield user into a test dummy.

    @Bloodhead:

    Secondly, try using some skill instead of asking for a change. It really is not that hard to see what your opponent is doing.

    No it really is taking away from skilled players by giving a free hit. The devs are just holding the hands of the average player by making it easier for them easy to land hits without earning it.

    @gregcau:

    Personally while the shield kick is a free hit, so is the shield bash so I find it balanced.

    Sure if the game became shield only.

    @gregcau:

    Of course if you are stupid enough to turtle with the shield you deserve to get a kick.

    That is what I would do before this patch and I had success getting past shields, but now its an automatic free hit so any player can feel like a pro. Why should a class that is trained to use a shield in battle be punished for actually using it?



  • I say make kicks instantly kill shield users even if they aren’t blocking.



  • @Genocide:

    No it really is taking away from skilled players by giving a free hit. The devs are just holding the hands of the average player by making it easier for them easy to land hits without earning it.

    If a skilled player is player super defensive with a shield, it took far too long to take them down with the pre-patch arsenal. TRULY skilled players will still use the shield effectively, and won’t give anyone a chance to kick them for a free hit.



  • @Sir:

    -Significantly increased shield stamina drain on successful shield block

    It was actually significantly decreased against heavy weapons.

    @Sir:

    -Alternate swings helps players get around shields

    Even moreso for parries.

    @Sir:

    -One handed weapons feint stamina cost increased to 15, combined with the extra shield drain on block means you cannot use feints as liberally as before

    Also effects onehanders without shields, which have always had higher stamina cost to successfully parry than shields do to successfully block.

    @Sir:

    -Significantly increased duration on stamina exhaustion flinch, which is long enough for a free-hit with almost any weapon in chivalry save for maybe the maul’s slow swing time

    Again, does not just apply to shields.

    @Sir LMBalot:

    All of these changes combined were enough to balance shields without needing the mechanic of the stun kick.
    While kicks themselves have been slowed down slightly and their stamina cost increased, they aren’t relatively difficult to land against shields as players tend to feint first to force a knight to prematurely raise their shield before kicking them.
    It’s definitely not fun being unable to do anything while you watch someone get a free grand mace overhead to your face.

    Most of these changes were changes to the stamina system in general, not directly related to shields at all.

    Shields actually got 2 significant buffs in the patch; decreased stamina drain from blocking heavy weapons (especially helpful for small shields), and decreased shield drop time (now that drop time actually matters; especially helpful for large shields). There were also only two nerfs directly to shields - increased stamina drain for holding the shield up (which only kicks in after 5 seconds) and the kick stun. As you said, ignoring shield drop time was a bug which was fixed.

    As I posted in another thread, you have a .4 sec window to drop your shield when you see a kick coming. When the enemy feints an attack that actually adds another .2-.4 seconds warning - you shouldn’t be holding your block up when there’s no imminent threat to you, you’d just wear yourself out of stamina that way with or without the threat of a kick stun. Being kicked with your shield up means you made a mistake, and while it may suck to watch the “free” hit coming at you, it sucks just as much when you miss a parry. Shields are not meant to be free of downsides and immune to error; I think that’s the part people dislike, that they actually have penalties now.



  • @The:

    This is a completely unnecessary change. Free hit elements should not exist in the game just because people aren’t wiling to learn how to get around defenses.

    You and the frickin’ random arbitrary rules you make up and then use them to justify why something is wrong.

    You may think that circling around back and forthing for a while while making a mockery of the hitboxes in this game is the only definition of skill. I think it’s more skillful for a person to avoid a potentially deadly turn of events through forethought and/or quick reaction. I do not fear giving a bunch of players a hard counter to my shield any more than I was given a hard counter to their attacks. In fact, hard counters are so awesome because of how good of a strategic base they create.

    I also would like to challenge someone to explain why an “expert” would be hindered by the change and yet a new player buffed so much?

    If anything, I would assume that it would allow seasoned players to blow the crap up out of new players who don’t know the game as well and hide behind shields longer than they should.

    I see it as an even boost for all skill levels across the board.

    “but it’s about walking in circles and aiming up and down and accomplishing simple tasks through all sorts of overproduced maneuvers!”



  • Well, at least decrease the stun time. As knight I find it impossible to recover soon enough.


Log in to reply