Greatsword or Claymore?



  • At the launch of the game I picked up claymore since it was suggested by a friend, played mainly duels and it served me well, but I found that the greatsword, with it’s superior reach and slow speed actually benefited me more in other game modes, hell, I even did better with it in duels because I could manipulate the attacks more (delays/accelerations and such) so I switched to the greatsword, a few weeks ago I switched back to claymore because I couldn’t take out good MAA’s, they were just too fast. But now that i’m using the claymore i’m finding that I can’t keep a comfortable distance from knights and have to rush many vanguards simply because they out-range me. So, i’d like to ask the community (and mainly vanguard players) greatsword or claymore?



  • ZWEIHANDER



  • Te claymore is a fast two hander. So you can hold your own against all classes. Esicialytue smaller ones.

    Its very good at a parry combo. After you block instantly attack. Then combo that attack into an overhead.

    Parry+stab+overhead is the best combo for it.

    The great sword is really something to go up against the larger classes or coming up against the noobs archers.

    And the zweihander is the ultimate kill stealers weapon and it excels on low gravity servers because of its reach and damage.



  • Use all three of them!
    Each one plays differently.

    For practicality I like the claymore the most.
    But if I’m playing for aesthetics I’ll use the greatsword.
    Zweihander when I want to fire up the base cannon.



  • Zwei is surprisingly effective in duels once you’ve mastered its’ timings and if you can dance.



  • Claymore actually trades .05s of overhead windup speed for .05s of stab speed. Everytime you open a fight with a claymore overhead, you should remember your attack is .05s slower, 5 damage lower, and who knows how much shorter than it could have been. Everytime you open with either a claymore or greatsword stab, you should remember that you have made a terrible decision. Everytime you slash a giant van sword like that, you should remember that your teammates hate you and want you to die and also the greatsword has more damage and reach so haha.

    Combo times also favor/tie with the greatsword, except for the stab which favors the claymore. Releases are longer on the greatsword, but honestly that’s an advantage - it makes them more draggable. The only area in which the claymore is genuinely stronger than the greatsword is the recovery. But that can be completely negated - always combo. If you want to stop attacking, feint. Don’t recover. Only go into recovery when you’re out of people to kill.

    The claymore’s only practical advantage over the greatsword is that it combos into stab slightly faster. That is an exhaustive list.

    Now the zweihander is a whole 'nother matter entirely. Its huge reach, massive arcs, and lengthy releases let you fill an exceptionally large quantity of space with deadly, deadly sword. It has a role and it fills it very well. But the claymore is just the greatsword’s (ambiguously developmentally challenged) little brother. It has no real space of its own and can’t quite fill big brother’s shoes to boot.



  • Greatsword.

    No question at all. Same speed(only advantage claymore has is recovery, and if you are getting hit in your attack recovery time, then you are doing something VERY wrong), superior reach (greatsword to claymore reach advantage is about as big as claymore to longsword!) and very slightly more damage (doesn’t matter in 99,9% of fights if you know your damage values).

    So the data clearly says greatsword. The greatsword is my favorite weapon and I only drop it for a bardiche when playing scrims. If you really like the claymore, try a longsword/sword of war. You will be much better with these.



  • Zweihänder definitely. Not the best duel weapon ever maybe but… OMFG ONE-SHOTTING ARCHERS AND MAAS!



  • Claymore gets tiresome with people doing the same move over and over and over and over and over:
    [Any move](which gets parried) into [side-step stab]….so predictable and so boring, yet its effective if you’re not used to it or 1v multiple players.

    It also seems to be the weapon of choice for 3rd person players who sprint around like headless chickens in the same old pattern, which becomes predictable, and prescribe to the above attack method.

    So IMHO:
    Claymore’s for show, Greatsword’s for Pro’s.



  • Maybe this is just me but I always did much better with Claymore, for me it’s always that or the Billhook with vanguard. Trying to get used to sword of war with knight, but the range is just so meh once you’ve played vanguard a lot, and the longsword looks way better as well :(



  • @DSMatticus:

    Claymore actually trades .05s of overhead windup speed for .05s of stab speed. Everytime you open a fight with a claymore overhead, you should remember your attack is .05s slower, 5 damage lower, and who knows how much shorter than it could have been. Everytime you open with either a claymore or greatsword stab, you should remember that you have made a terrible decision. Everytime you slash a giant van sword like that, you should remember that your teammates hate you and want you to die and also the greatsword has more damage and reach so haha.

    Combo times also favor/tie with the greatsword, except for the stab which favors the claymore. Releases are longer on the greatsword, but honestly that’s an advantage - it makes them more draggable. The only area in which the claymore is genuinely stronger than the greatsword is the recovery. But that can be completely negated - always combo. If you want to stop attacking, feint. Don’t recover. Only go into recovery when you’re out of people to kill.

    The claymore’s only practical advantage over the greatsword is that it combos into stab slightly faster. That is an exhaustive list.

    Now the zweihander is a whole 'nother matter entirely. Its huge reach, massive arcs, and lengthy releases let you fill an exceptionally large quantity of space with deadly, deadly sword. It has a role and it fills it very well. But the claymore is just the greatsword’s (ambiguously developmentally challenged) little brother. It has no real space of its own and can’t quite fill big brother’s shoes to boot.

    Claymore connects with its attacks faster. It’s a better straight-up, Knight-style weapon. The Greatsword and Zweihander favor the Vanguard sprint-all-around style and just never stop comboing.



  • With the exception of thrusts, attacks can be made to connect as quickly as you need them to (with a small tradeoff in range that probably still favors the greatsword). Besides, the releases are actually only different by .05s on slash and overhead so I find the idea that the claymore connects meaningfully faster skeptical.



  • I find I do much better with the zwei in regular play. 1hk vs MAA and archers is pretty useful for mopping up in TO. I don’t do well in duels with it though.

    The greatsword is perfect for jumping into a group of enemies and LMB spamming, better than the zwei or claymore IMHO, but not everyone wants to play like a berserker all the time. The speed and damage of the zwei overhead combined with the fact that you probably won’t accidentally behead an archer teammate who is just behind and to the right of you makes it a lot better for skirmishes when your team is around.



  • greatsword all day long….



  • While I agree that the great-sword is statistically better. I much prefer the Claymore.



  • if you are getting hit in your attack recovery time, then you are doing something VERY wrong

    Just curious for an explanation of this, it seems that there are quite a few ways you can be hit during recovery (Misjudging range and getting countered, MAA dodging your strike and dodging forward, missing your attack and getting countered) and none of these seem truly sinful. Why is it so horrendous a thing to get hit during recovery?



  • @Bloodhead:

    Just curious for an explanation of this, it seems that there are quite a few ways you can be hit during recovery (Misjudging range and getting countered, MAA dodging your strike and dodging forward, missing your attack and getting countered) and none of these seem truly sinful. Why is it so horrendous a thing to get hit during recovery?

    Because you do not enter recovery with Vg weapons as long as you have stamina or opponents in your face. You always combo so you are not vulnerable(so you can parry/attack/feint instead of taking the hit). It is very easy to hit a Vg in his recovery time (~0.7-0.9s).



  • Claymore ofcourse. Flinch lock ftw!



  • @DSMatticus:

    With the exception of thrusts, attacks can be made to connect as quickly as you need them to (with a small tradeoff in range that probably still favors the greatsword). Besides, the releases are actually only different by .05s on slash and overhead so I find the idea that the claymore connects meaningfully faster skeptical.

    Always felt like the Claymore stab specifically was a lot faster, especially on parry-counters. I like both, but also haven’t mained VG in 2-3 months so my input is a little dated.


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